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#31
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Ripe Apples
On Fri, 10 Nov 2017 17:55:13 -0500, nospam
wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share of Apple. market share doesn't matter and apple doesn't chase it anyway. apple, with it's supposedly 'low market share', is on the verge of becoming the first *trillion* dollar company, while hp, with 'twice the market share of apple', is but a tiny fraction of apple, currently about $35b. if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. But it's not with desktop PCs. How have you worked that one out ? Sticking with subject of Dell vs Apple the data in the following link (previously deleted by nospam) explains why I made that remark. "They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share once again, market share doesn't matter. apple is about to become the first trillion dollar company, with it's 'tiny' market share. But they are not a trillion dollar company, just with PCs. Bar in mind it was PCs we were discussing. apple has enough cash to buy dell *and* hp. you also might want to actually read the url *you* gave: http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/...worldwide-pc-m arket-as-windows-continues-to-cede-share-to-the-mac" Apple continued to grow overall Mac marketshare during the March quarter as most leading Windows PC makers suffered significant setbacks, according to the latest research data from Gartner and IDC. ... Meanwhile, according to Gartner, Apple's worldwide shipments advanced 1 percent year-over-year to 4.6 million during the quarter, giving it a 7.1 percent marketshare. HP by contrast saw units slide 9 percent, while Lenovo dropped 7.2 percent. Dell lost just 0.4 percent, but the only major PC maker to see growth was Asus, up 1.5 percent. Yep. I read all that. I didn't try to quote it selectively the way you are prone to do. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#32
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Ripe Apples
In article , Eric Stevens
wrote: They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share of Apple. market share doesn't matter and apple doesn't chase it anyway. apple, with it's supposedly 'low market share', is on the verge of becoming the first *trillion* dollar company, while hp, with 'twice the market share of apple', is but a tiny fraction of apple, currently about $35b. if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. But it's not with desktop PCs. How have you worked that one out ? Sticking with subject of Dell vs Apple the data in the following link (previously deleted by nospam) explains why I made that remark. "They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share once again, market share doesn't matter. apple is about to become the first trillion dollar company, with it's 'tiny' market share. But they are not a trillion dollar company, just with PCs. $896.81 billion, as of now. my guess is it'll hit $1t by feb, 2018, possibly sooner. Bar in mind it was PCs we were discussing. which includes macs, and you've even argued that a mac is a pc. in fact, some people buy a mac to run windows and *not* mac os. apple has enough cash to buy dell *and* hp. you also might want to actually read the url *you* gave: http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/...of-worldwide-p c-m arket-as-windows-continues-to-cede-share-to-the-mac" Apple continued to grow overall Mac marketshare during the March quarter as most leading Windows PC makers suffered significant setbacks, according to the latest research data from Gartner and IDC. ... Meanwhile, according to Gartner, Apple's worldwide shipments advanced 1 percent year-over-year to 4.6 million during the quarter, giving it a 7.1 percent marketshare. HP by contrast saw units slide 9 percent, while Lenovo dropped 7.2 percent. Dell lost just 0.4 percent, but the only major PC maker to see growth was Asus, up 1.5 percent. Yep. I read all that. I didn't try to quote it selectively the way you are prone to do. translated: you ignored the key parts that contradict your prejudices. |
#33
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Ripe Apples
In article , Eric Stevens
wrote: By that reasoning, all PC box manufacturers and assemblers, including HP and Dell are run by stupid people. pretty much, and a very accurate assessment of dell. They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share of Apple. market share doesn't matter and apple doesn't chase it anyway. apple, with it's supposedly 'low market share', is on the verge of becoming the first *trillion* dollar company, while hp, with 'twice the market share of apple', is but a tiny fraction of apple, currently about $35b. if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. But it's not with desktop PCs. yes with desktop pcs. mac sales are up while the overall pc market is shrinking. You are changing the subject. nope. We were originally comparing Apple and Dell who of the latter you wrote (above) "assemblers, including HP and Dell are run by stupid people .... pretty much, and a very accurate assessment of dell." We were not discussing the overall PC market. yes we were. just what do you think market share is about, if not the pc market? hp, dell and apple are all part of the overall pc market. But the data, the link to which you deleted showed that the "stupid people" who run Dell have achieved twice the PC market share of Apple. dell targets a different market segment than apple. the bulk of dell's sales are corporate contracts, not end user sales. apple's sales are mostly consumer, a segment dell is extremely weak. for retail sales, apple owns it. how many dell stores do you see? zero. they were closed long ago. but as i said, apple isn't chasing market share. also, despite apple's supposedly low (and entirely meaningless) market share, apple is raking in the bucks, more than hp and dell *combined*: http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/upl...ot-2013-04-16- at-4-16-4.16.46-PM.png as i said: if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. No wonder you deleted the link and are now trying to change the subject. nope. i'm exactly on subject, and understand apple *far* better than you do. not that it matters since the future is not desktop pcs. that game is over. also keep in mind that most of hp and dell sales are corporate contracts, not end users, which is a totally different market segment, something those who mindlessly spout market share numbers fail to understand. A desktop computer sold is a desktop computer sold. It doesn't really matter who the buyer is. absolutely wrong. Why? common sense. do you really think those who buy a $200 netbook, a $1000 laptop, a $2000 midrange system and a $5000 high end workstation are the same sort of customers? not only are the customers different, but the product specs will also be different as well as the types of tasks done on them. And their money is all equally good. whoosh. |
#34
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Ripe Apples
On Fri, 10 Nov 2017 17:55:14 -0500, nospam
wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: users are not interested in being able to open the computer. they want to get actual work done. Which is why they don't want to sit around while someone buggers about with small tools. instead, they bring it to a repair shop and drop it off. All of the high end commercially oriented Dell stuff can be fixed on the spot without needing any tools. nobody cares whether the onsite service person needs tools or not. they just want it fixed. [Holds up hoarding] They just want it fixed! When do they want it? They want it NOWWWW! They don't want to wait while the repair tech tries to find that screw which he dropped somewhere inside the computer case (or was it on the carpet?) you're also ignoring the time for the person to actually show up. not that it matters, since high end commercial sites will have backup systems ready for immediate service, often automatically. even midrange sites and many low end ones have backup systems available. For the people who don't have on-site on-call service they can be fixed within minutes at the service center. It's called cost effective. as usual, you're ignoring the time to disconnect it, pack it up and take it to the service center, wait for it to be fixed (even if it's just a few minutes), drive back and reconnect everything. of course, that only matters if it fails. if it *doesn't* fail, then being able to fix it within minutes doesn't make a difference. put simply: dell *has* to offer fast repair because their products *need* it. And Apple offers slow repair because their products don't need fast repair ... This is getting silly. I think I will leave you to it. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#35
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Ripe Apples
On Fri, 10 Nov 2017 17:55:10 -0500, nospam
wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: I just attach a drive to a USB port takes a few seconds, even though we have about 40 PCs in the lab we haven't had to change a drive in years. Would you want to hang a drive on the kind of USB port circa 2000? usb 2 existed then, so yes. however, macs had firewire for several years prior, which was faster than usb 2 and *muuuuuuuch* faster than usb 1.1. The Acer had a firewire card fitted but I found I never needed to use it. But we did for years run a course unit on hpw PCs work and how to change cards, discs and teh like from PC desktops, but that course has now been cancelled as we know the vast majority of uses don;t ever need to change the ethernet card or hard drive any more than the average car driver has to change their engine or headlights or 'gas' tank. Don't tell that to nospam. too late. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#36
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Ripe Apples
In article , Eric Stevens
wrote: Would you want to hang a drive on the kind of USB port circa 2000? usb 2 existed then, so yes. however, macs had firewire for several years prior, which was faster than usb 2 and *muuuuuuuch* faster than usb 1.1. The Acer had a firewire card fitted but I found I never needed to use it. why not? firewire would have been faster than dealing with usb 2, especially back then when the early usb chipsets were not all that great. not only that, but bus-powered firewire drives worked exceptionally well, easily supporting two and sometimes three drives, all connected to a single firewire port. |
#37
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Ripe Apples
On Fri, 10 Nov 2017 21:08:35 -0500, nospam
wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: By that reasoning, all PC box manufacturers and assemblers, including HP and Dell are run by stupid people. pretty much, and a very accurate assessment of dell. They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share of Apple. market share doesn't matter and apple doesn't chase it anyway. apple, with it's supposedly 'low market share', is on the verge of becoming the first *trillion* dollar company, while hp, with 'twice the market share of apple', is but a tiny fraction of apple, currently about $35b. if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. But it's not with desktop PCs. yes with desktop pcs. mac sales are up while the overall pc market is shrinking. You are changing the subject. nope. We were originally comparing Apple and Dell who of the latter you wrote (above) "assemblers, including HP and Dell are run by stupid people .... pretty much, and a very accurate assessment of dell." We were not discussing the overall PC market. yes we were. just what do you think market share is about, if not the pc market? hp, dell and apple are all part of the overall pc market. But the data, the link to which you deleted showed that the "stupid people" who run Dell have achieved twice the PC market share of Apple. dell targets a different market segment than apple. the bulk of dell's sales are corporate contracts, not end user sales. apple's sales are mostly consumer, a segment dell is extremely weak. for retail sales, apple owns it. how many dell stores do you see? zero. they were closed long ago. but as i said, apple isn't chasing market share. also, despite apple's supposedly low (and entirely meaningless) market share, apple is raking in the bucks, more than hp and dell *combined*: http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/upl...ot-2013-04-16- at-4-16-4.16.46-PM.png Wiggle wiggle (also squirm). Why don't you continue to talk about the relative competence of Apple and Dell in the PC market, which is where you started off? as i said: if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. No wonder you deleted the link and are now trying to change the subject. nope. i'm exactly on subject, and understand apple *far* better than you do. And I understand the subject where this started off better than you seem prepared for. not that it matters since the future is not desktop pcs. that game is over. also keep in mind that most of hp and dell sales are corporate contracts, not end users, which is a totally different market segment, something those who mindlessly spout market share numbers fail to understand. A desktop computer sold is a desktop computer sold. It doesn't really matter who the buyer is. absolutely wrong. Why? common sense. do you really think those who buy a $200 netbook, a $1000 laptop, a $2000 midrange system and a $5000 high end workstation are the same sort of customers? not only are the customers different, but the product specs will also be different as well as the types of tasks done on them. And their money is all equally good. whoosh. Can't answer that, can you. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#38
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Ripe Apples
On Fri, 10 Nov 2017 21:08:31 -0500, nospam
wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share of Apple. market share doesn't matter and apple doesn't chase it anyway. apple, with it's supposedly 'low market share', is on the verge of becoming the first *trillion* dollar company, while hp, with 'twice the market share of apple', is but a tiny fraction of apple, currently about $35b. if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. But it's not with desktop PCs. How have you worked that one out ? Sticking with subject of Dell vs Apple the data in the following link (previously deleted by nospam) explains why I made that remark. "They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share once again, market share doesn't matter. apple is about to become the first trillion dollar company, with it's 'tiny' market share. But they are not a trillion dollar company, just with PCs. $896.81 billion, as of now. my guess is it'll hit $1t by feb, 2018, possibly sooner. Bar in mind it was PCs we were discussing. which includes macs, and you've even argued that a mac is a pc. PC as in personal computer - yes. in fact, some people buy a mac to run windows and *not* mac os. apple has enough cash to buy dell *and* hp. you also might want to actually read the url *you* gave: http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/...of-worldwide-p c-m arket-as-windows-continues-to-cede-share-to-the-mac" Apple continued to grow overall Mac marketshare during the March quarter as most leading Windows PC makers suffered significant setbacks, according to the latest research data from Gartner and IDC. ... Meanwhile, according to Gartner, Apple's worldwide shipments advanced 1 percent year-over-year to 4.6 million during the quarter, giving it a 7.1 percent marketshare. HP by contrast saw units slide 9 percent, while Lenovo dropped 7.2 percent. Dell lost just 0.4 percent, but the only major PC maker to see growth was Asus, up 1.5 percent. Yep. I read all that. I didn't try to quote it selectively the way you are prone to do. translated: you ignored the key parts that contradict your prejudices. I haven't ignored any of it. In fact all I did was refer you to it. That's enough of this nonsensical argument. You are running in circles. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#39
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Ripe Apples
In article , Eric Stevens
wrote: We were originally comparing Apple and Dell who of the latter you wrote (above) "assemblers, including HP and Dell are run by stupid people .... pretty much, and a very accurate assessment of dell." We were not discussing the overall PC market. yes we were. just what do you think market share is about, if not the pc market? hp, dell and apple are all part of the overall pc market. But the data, the link to which you deleted showed that the "stupid people" who run Dell have achieved twice the PC market share of Apple. dell targets a different market segment than apple. the bulk of dell's sales are corporate contracts, not end user sales. apple's sales are mostly consumer, a segment dell is extremely weak. for retail sales, apple owns it. how many dell stores do you see? zero. they were closed long ago. but as i said, apple isn't chasing market share. also, despite apple's supposedly low (and entirely meaningless) market share, apple is raking in the bucks, more than hp and dell *combined*: http://www.asymco.com/wp-content/upl...ot-2013-04-16- at-4-16-4.16.46-PM.png Wiggle wiggle (also squirm). nope. Why don't you continue to talk about the relative competence of Apple and Dell in the PC market, which is where you started off? that's exactly what i have been talking about all along. as i said: if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. No wonder you deleted the link and are now trying to change the subject. nope. i'm exactly on subject, and understand apple *far* better than you do. And I understand the subject where this started off better than you seem prepared for. nope. you clearly do not. you are fixated on market share being the only metric of success. that's a fundamental misunderstanding. you also don't understand what the market share numbers even mean. also keep in mind that most of hp and dell sales are corporate contracts, not end users, which is a totally different market segment, something those who mindlessly spout market share numbers fail to understand. A desktop computer sold is a desktop computer sold. It doesn't really matter who the buyer is. absolutely wrong. Why? common sense. do you really think those who buy a $200 netbook, a $1000 laptop, a $2000 midrange system and a $5000 high end workstation are the same sort of customers? not only are the customers different, but the product specs will also be different as well as the types of tasks done on them. And their money is all equally good. whoosh. Can't answer that, can you. i already did, and more than once. |
#40
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Ripe Apples
In article , Eric Stevens
wrote: They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share of Apple. market share doesn't matter and apple doesn't chase it anyway. apple, with it's supposedly 'low market share', is on the verge of becoming the first *trillion* dollar company, while hp, with 'twice the market share of apple', is but a tiny fraction of apple, currently about $35b. if anyone is doing something right, it's apple. But it's not with desktop PCs. How have you worked that one out ? Sticking with subject of Dell vs Apple the data in the following link (previously deleted by nospam) explains why I made that remark. "They must be doing something right. They have twice the market share once again, market share doesn't matter. apple is about to become the first trillion dollar company, with it's 'tiny' market share. But they are not a trillion dollar company, just with PCs. $896.81 billion, as of now. my guess is it'll hit $1t by feb, 2018, possibly sooner. Bar in mind it was PCs we were discussing. which includes macs, and you've even argued that a mac is a pc. PC as in personal computer - yes. in other words, i've remained on topic all along. in fact, some people buy a mac to run windows and *not* mac os. apple has enough cash to buy dell *and* hp. you also might want to actually read the url *you* gave: http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/...74-of-worldwid e-p c-m arket-as-windows-continues-to-cede-share-to-the-mac" Apple continued to grow overall Mac marketshare during the March quarter as most leading Windows PC makers suffered significant setbacks, according to the latest research data from Gartner and IDC. ... Meanwhile, according to Gartner, Apple's worldwide shipments advanced 1 percent year-over-year to 4.6 million during the quarter, giving it a 7.1 percent marketshare. HP by contrast saw units slide 9 percent, while Lenovo dropped 7.2 percent. Dell lost just 0.4 percent, but the only major PC maker to see growth was Asus, up 1.5 percent. Yep. I read all that. I didn't try to quote it selectively the way you are prone to do. translated: you ignored the key parts that contradict your prejudices. I haven't ignored any of it. In fact all I did was refer you to it. That's enough of this nonsensical argument. You are running in circles. i'm not moving at all. you're *very* confused. |
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