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#11
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Deconstruct a GIF file
In article , Mayayana
wrote: | bmp is very, very rarely used anymore. Of course not, on Macs. nor on windows. bmp is inefficient. it still exists, but it's not that common anymore. The OP seems to be on Windows. A BMP is the most basic bitmap format. A grid of pixel values. It's what *all* raster graphics are. JPG, PNG, GIF, etc all render as bitmaps. Only the storage varies. A BMP file is only that grid of pixel values, with a very minimal file header of something like 22 bytes. The image you work on in Photoshop is a bitmap. Most of the filters you can use in Photoshop are essentially math formulas applied to that bitmap. but not a bmp file. So on Windows, the only sensible way to work with non-RAW is as BMP, or as TIF if one prefers it compressed. both are dumb choices. But in that case a TIF is only a compressed BMP. which makes it better just for that alone. One could work with PNGs, but there's not much point. for many purposes, there absolutely is. If one works in JPG then each save is lossy. nope. repeated opening/editing/saving is what's lossy. simply saving the *same* image multiple times doesn't lose anything beyond the first save, which won't be noticeable other than pixel peepers. If one works in GIF then the number of colors has been severely limited. which may not be an issue for a screen shot, especially one coming from a smartphone. There are different ways to go to 8-bit color from 24-bit. Getting the best GIF can sometimes take a few tries. only for stupid people. So there's no sense reduing from BMP until editing is done and one wants a finished copy as GIF. there's no sense in using bmp anymore. |
#12
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Deconstruct a GIF file
On Mon, 5 Jun 2017 19:18:15 -0400, "Mayayana"
wrote: "Chaya Eve" wrote | I'm not asking about meta data. | I'm asking about layers. | Layers? Are you sure you're not talking about layers in the graphic editor? Once you save a file to disk you're merging layers. The end result is essentially a bitmap. I don't know of any format that stores layers, except the custom formats used by things like Paint Shop Pro or Photoshop that retain info about your editing. But those are temp formats that other people usually can't open. TIFF can save layers, but not all software can handle them If you save to GIF then you're reducing from 24-bit color to 8-bit. (16 million+ colors to 256 colors.) The only reason to use GIF is for simple images, especially online when a small file size is important. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#13
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Deconstruct a GIF file
"nospam" wrote
..... I'm not going to respond to any of this. It's just too many misleading and/or false statements, and to no purpose. |
#14
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Deconstruct a GIF file
"Eric Stevens" wrote
| TIFF can save layers, but not all software can handle them | TIF can be a lot of things. I'm guessing that you're talking about specific software that saves layers for its own use. That's what I meant by custom formats. Paint Shop Pro can save layers in PSP format, but no other program can read that, so it doesn't count. I don't know of any standard format that has a layers option in the spec. So I'm guessing that Chaya Eve is actually talking about layers worked with in an editor, mistakenly thinking all of those layers end up prt of the final PNG image. |
#15
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Deconstruct a GIF file
In article , Mayayana
wrote: I'm not going to respond to any of this. It's just too many misleading and/or false statements, and to no purpose. nothing misleading or false about what i wrote. |
#16
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Deconstruct a GIF file
In article , Mayayana
wrote: | TIFF can save layers, but not all software can handle them TIF can be a lot of things. I'm guessing that you're talking about specific software that saves layers for its own use. That's what I meant by custom formats. tiff is not a custom format. Paint Shop Pro can save layers in PSP format, but no other program can read that, so it doesn't count. lots of apps can read psp files. I don't know of any standard format that has a layers option in the spec. several do, including tiff and photoshop, both publicly documented formats. So I'm guessing that Chaya Eve is actually talking about layers worked with in an editor, mistakenly thinking all of those layers end up prt of the final PNG image. chaya eve is the well known nymshifting troll. |
#17
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Deconstruct a GIF file
On Mon, 5 Jun 2017 20:56:54 -0400, "Mayayana"
wrote: "Eric Stevens" wrote | TIFF can save layers, but not all software can handle them | TIF can be a lot of things. I'm guessing that you're talking about specific software that saves layers for its own use. Not at all. I'm talking about TIFF. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TIFF#Image_types "Features and options ------------------------ TIFF is a flexible, adaptable file format for handling images and data within a single file, by including the header tags (size, definition, image-data arrangement, applied image compression) defining the image's geometry. A TIFF file, for example, can be a container holding JPEG (lossy) and PackBits (lossless) compressed images. A TIFF file also can include a vector-based clipping path (outlines, croppings, image frames). The ability to store image data in a lossless format makes a TIFF file a useful image archive, because, unlike standard JPEG files, a TIFF file using lossless compression (or none) may be edited and re-saved without losing image quality. This is not the case when using the TIFF as a container holding compressed JPEG. Other TIFF options are layers and pages." .... but not all software can handle all the various possible features. That's what I meant by custom formats. Paint Shop Pro can save layers in PSP format, but no other program can read that, so it doesn't count. I don't know of any standard format that has a layers option in the spec. So I'm guessing that Chaya Eve is actually talking about layers worked with in an editor, mistakenly thinking all of those layers end up prt of the final PNG image. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#18
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Deconstruct a GIF file
"Eric Stevens" wrote
| TIF can be a lot of things. I'm guessing that you're | talking about specific software that saves layers for | its own use. | | Not at all. I'm talking about TIFF. See | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TIFF#Image_types | It seems like we're saying the same thing, with different emphasis. I'm saying it can be many things, but generally it's a compressed bitmap. Your link doesn't conflict with that. There wouldn't be much point in using features that most programs don't read. I'd use TIF for storage if I needed the space, but generally I just stick with BMP once I have something I might work on. I'm surprised by how many photographers and graphics people like JPG. If anyone came out with a lossless format, achieving similar compression and royalty-free, JPG would quickly disappear. File size and lack of royalty are the only reason it achieved wide usage. Now it's grossly overused to such an extent that grotesquely compressed images have become almost synonymous with webpage graphics, and even with photography. |
#19
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Deconstruct a GIF file
In article , Mayayana
wrote: I'm surprised by how many photographers and graphics people like JPG. because it works exceptionally well in nearly all situations. If anyone came out with a lossless format, achieving similar compression and royalty-free, JPG would quickly disappear. they did, and it didn't. File size and lack of royalty are the only reason it achieved wide usage. Now it's grossly overused to such an extent that grotesquely compressed images have become almost synonymous with webpage graphics, and even with photography. nothing about jpeg requires it to be 'grotesquely compressed'. a high quality jpeg is visually indistinguishable from the original unless you pixel peep. simple test: open both in photoshop and subtract. the differences are *very* minor. |
#20
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Deconstruct a GIF file
On 2017-06-06 01:14:23 +0000, nospam said:
chaya eve is the well known nymshifting troll. Given the absurdity of the original question that makes perfect sense. -- Regards, Savageduck |
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