Newbie question about field cameras that accept 120 rolls

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:41:47 GMT, "Shelley" wrote:

Helo Shelley, may I ask you a couple of things I didn't get?

So your choices are a 2x3 camera or a 4x5 camera with roll film holder. 4x5
cameras come with two types of backs, those with spring backs and those with
"Graflok" or "international" backs. Cameras with a spring back limit your
choice of roll film holders to the type that slide into the camera
underneath the ground glass. Calumet makes such holders in various 120
formats. Cameras with Graflok backs give you a wider selection of roll film
holder brands. OTOH, the type that slide under the ground glass are more
convenient to use since you don't need to remove and replace the ground
glass frame every time you make a photograph.

Why, with Graflok-type backs, I have to remove and replace the ground
glass frame for every shot? I assume rangefinders don't exist / are
not accurate enough?

If you're looking for information about specific brands, I'd suggest going
to www.largeformatphotography.info and scrolling down to the sections that
contain information and reviews of numerous cameras. Then post questions
here or there about specific brands that interest you.

Great infos up there!
Now, it's very clear to me that I really really want an Arca Swiss
6x9. I clearly deserve it. :-)))
But, it's quite expensive. :-(
So, let's say I look for a good-shaped Horseman 980, for example.
Which features I miss vs. typical view cameras? Some movements, I
imagine? Other features?
Then: which lensplates/lenses could I use on such camera? Are
lensplates "standard", or are they specific for a certain kind of
camera? I know there are different plate sizes and different lens
holes (I suppose, for different sized lenses/shutters: Copal 0, Copal
1 and so). Is this the only thing to look for? Or are there other
things I should be aware of?

Many thanks! ;-)

Fernando

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:41:47 GMT, "Shelley" wrote:

Helo Shelley, may I ask you a couple of things I didn't get?

So your choices are a 2x3 camera or a 4x5 camera with roll film holder. 4x5
cameras come with two types of backs, those with spring backs and those with
"Graflok" or "international" backs. Cameras with a spring back limit your
choice of roll film holders to the type that slide into the camera
underneath the ground glass. Calumet makes such holders in various 120
formats. Cameras with Graflok backs give you a wider selection of roll film
holder brands. OTOH, the type that slide under the ground glass are more
convenient to use since you don't need to remove and replace the ground
glass frame every time you make a photograph.

Why, with Graflok-type backs, I have to remove and replace the ground
glass frame for every shot? I assume rangefinders don't exist / are
not accurate enough?

If you're looking for information about specific brands, I'd suggest going
to www.largeformatphotography.info and scrolling down to the sections that
contain information and reviews of numerous cameras. Then post questions
here or there about specific brands that interest you.

Great infos up there!
Now, it's very clear to me that I really really want an Arca Swiss
6x9. I clearly deserve it. :-)))
But, it's quite expensive. :-(
So, let's say I look for a good-shaped Horseman 980, for example.
Which features I miss vs. typical view cameras? Some movements, I
imagine? Other features?
Then: which lensplates/lenses could I use on such camera? Are
lensplates "standard", or are they specific for a certain kind of
camera? I know there are different plate sizes and different lens
holes (I suppose, for different sized lenses/shutters: Copal 0, Copal
1 and so). Is this the only thing to look for? Or are there other
things I should be aware of?

Many thanks! ;-)

Fernando

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 23:29:39 GMT, Fernando
wrote:

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:41:47 GMT, "Shelley" wrote:

Helo Shelley, may I ask you a couple of things I didn't get?

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 23:29:39 GMT, Fernando
wrote:

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:41:47 GMT, "Shelley" wrote:

Helo Shelley, may I ask you a couple of things I didn't get?

Why, with Graflok-type backs, I have to remove and replace the ground
glass frame for every shot? I assume rangefinders don't exist / are
not accurate enough?

Rangefinders exist on a few 4x5 cameras, the Graflex/Graphic line of
cameras had them, as does the Linhof Technika cameras, one of the Wista
models, and probably others that don't come to mind. Perhaps some 2x3
cameras have rangefinders as well. I don't use 2x3 cameras so I don't know
much about them. I asume there must be some that come with a rangefinder.
However, your interest in using a larger format camera seemed to be based on
the availability of camera movements and when you use a rangefinder you
can't use camera movements.

So, let's say I look for a good-shaped Horseman 980, for example.
Which features I miss vs. typical view cameras? Some movements, I
imagine? Other features?

Sorry but someone else will have to answer that question, I can't. All I
know about the 980 is that it's big and heavy.

Then: which lensplates/lenses could I use on such camera? Are
lensplates "standard", or are they specific for a certain kind of
camera? I know there are different plate sizes and different lens
holes (I suppose, for different sized lenses/shutters: Copal 0, Copal
1 and so). Is this the only thing to look for? Or are there other
things I should be aware of?

Lensboards sizes aren't standard though the Linhof size board is used on
quite a few other 4x5 field cameras such as the Wista, Tachihara, Horseman
Woodfield, et al. The size of the holes in the boards are as you say based
on the size of the shutter. Most new lenses come in Copal shutters these
days (0,1, and 3). Older lenses came in a variety of shutter brands and the
fact that the numbers are the same among different brands doesn't
necessarily mean the hole size will be the same (e.g. an Ilex #4 shutter
might not fit in a hole cut for a Rapax #4 shutter).

"Fernando" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:41:47 GMT, "Shelley" wrote:

Helo Shelley, may I ask you a couple of things I didn't get?

So your choices are a 2x3 camera or a 4x5 camera with roll film holder.
4x5
cameras come with two types of backs, those with spring backs and those
with
"Graflok" or "international" backs. Cameras with a spring back limit your
choice of roll film holders to the type that slide into the camera
underneath the ground glass. Calumet makes such holders in various 120
formats. Cameras with Graflok backs give you a wider selection of roll
film
holder brands. OTOH, the type that slide under the ground glass are more
convenient to use since you don't need to remove and replace the ground
glass frame every time you make a photograph.

Why, with Graflok-type backs, I have to remove and replace the ground
glass frame for every shot? I assume rangefinders don't exist / are
not accurate enough?

If you're looking for information about specific brands, I'd suggest
going
to www.largeformatphotography.info and scrolling down to the sections
that
contain information and reviews of numerous cameras. Then post questions
here or there about specific brands that interest you.

Great infos up there!
Now, it's very clear to me that I really really want an Arca Swiss
6x9. I clearly deserve it. :-)))
But, it's quite expensive. :-(
So, let's say I look for a good-shaped Horseman 980, for example.
Which features I miss vs. typical view cameras? Some movements, I
imagine? Other features?
Then: which lensplates/lenses could I use on such camera? Are
lensplates "standard", or are they specific for a certain kind of
camera? I know there are different plate sizes and different lens
holes (I suppose, for different sized lenses/shutters: Copal 0, Copal
1 and so). Is this the only thing to look for? Or are there other
things I should be aware of?

Many thanks! ;-)

Fernando

Why, with Graflok-type backs, I have to remove and replace the ground
glass frame for every shot? I assume rangefinders don't exist / are
not accurate enough?

Rangefinders exist on a few 4x5 cameras, the Graflex/Graphic line of
cameras had them, as does the Linhof Technika cameras, one of the Wista
models, and probably others that don't come to mind. Perhaps some 2x3
cameras have rangefinders as well. I don't use 2x3 cameras so I don't know
much about them. I asume there must be some that come with a rangefinder.
However, your interest in using a larger format camera seemed to be based on
the availability of camera movements and when you use a rangefinder you
can't use camera movements.

So, let's say I look for a good-shaped Horseman 980, for example.
Which features I miss vs. typical view cameras? Some movements, I
imagine? Other features?

Sorry but someone else will have to answer that question, I can't. All I
know about the 980 is that it's big and heavy.

Then: which lensplates/lenses could I use on such camera? Are
lensplates "standard", or are they specific for a certain kind of
camera? I know there are different plate sizes and different lens
holes (I suppose, for different sized lenses/shutters: Copal 0, Copal
1 and so). Is this the only thing to look for? Or are there other
things I should be aware of?

Lensboards sizes aren't standard though the Linhof size board is used on
quite a few other 4x5 field cameras such as the Wista, Tachihara, Horseman
Woodfield, et al. The size of the holes in the boards are as you say based
on the size of the shutter. Most new lenses come in Copal shutters these
days (0,1, and 3). Older lenses came in a variety of shutter brands and the
fact that the numbers are the same among different brands doesn't
necessarily mean the hole size will be the same (e.g. an Ilex #4 shutter
might not fit in a hole cut for a Rapax #4 shutter).

"Fernando" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 13:41:47 GMT, "Shelley" wrote:

Helo Shelley, may I ask you a couple of things I didn't get?

So your choices are a 2x3 camera or a 4x5 camera with roll film holder.
4x5
cameras come with two types of backs, those with spring backs and those
with
"Graflok" or "international" backs. Cameras with a spring back limit your
choice of roll film holders to the type that slide into the camera
underneath the ground glass. Calumet makes such holders in various 120
formats. Cameras with Graflok backs give you a wider selection of roll
film
holder brands. OTOH, the type that slide under the ground glass are more
convenient to use since you don't need to remove and replace the ground
glass frame every time you make a photograph.

Why, with Graflok-type backs, I have to remove and replace the ground
glass frame for every shot? I assume rangefinders don't exist / are
not accurate enough?

If you're looking for information about specific brands, I'd suggest
going
to www.largeformatphotography.info and scrolling down to the sections
that
contain information and reviews of numerous cameras. Then post questions
here or there about specific brands that interest you.

Great infos up there!
Now, it's very clear to me that I really really want an Arca Swiss
6x9. I clearly deserve it. :-)))
But, it's quite expensive. :-(
So, let's say I look for a good-shaped Horseman 980, for example.
Which features I miss vs. typical view cameras? Some movements, I
imagine? Other features?
Then: which lensplates/lenses could I use on such camera? Are
lensplates "standard", or are they specific for a certain kind of
camera? I know there are different plate sizes and different lens
holes (I suppose, for different sized lenses/shutters: Copal 0, Copal
1 and so). Is this the only thing to look for? Or are there other
things I should be aware of?

Many thanks! ;-)

Fernando

I guess the price has gone up. I bought my 6X7 back new about 4 years
ago, and paid (if memory serves) about $279 for it.

jjs wrote:

"LR Kalajainen" wrote in message
...


Calumet sells Cambo rollfilm backs that will fit in any 4X5 camera. They
just are inserted like a regular sheet film holder. They come in either
6X7 or 6X9, or perhaps even 6X12 formats and cost under $300.



You must mean the price for used backs. The least expensive rollfilm back at
Calumet is the Cambo at $399.99US, and the least expensive at B&H is the
Wista at $370US (special order only at B&H)

Or is there some special hidden discount at Calumet?

I guess the price has gone up. I bought my 6X7 back new about 4 years
ago, and paid (if memory serves) about $279 for it.

jjs wrote:

"LR Kalajainen" wrote in message
...


Calumet sells Cambo rollfilm backs that will fit in any 4X5 camera. They
just are inserted like a regular sheet film holder. They come in either
6X7 or 6X9, or perhaps even 6X12 formats and cost under $300.



You must mean the price for used backs. The least expensive rollfilm back at
Calumet is the Cambo at $399.99US, and the least expensive at B&H is the
Wista at $370US (special order only at B&H)

Or is there some special hidden discount at Calumet?

Possibly misstated but the reference was directed at 4x5 sheet film results
vs. the rollfilm results----i.e. the resulting negative size!! Referral was
not directed at the/a process comparison but rather the final result with a
4x5 negative's size !

"Malcolm Stewart" wrote in
message ...
"Jos. Burke" wrote in message
...

snipped
Black
and White 4x5 sheet film is so very easy to process yourself and the
results
are fabulous.

Having developed much 35mm over the years, and recently some 4x5 sheet
film
(Tri-X & FP4+) I'm intrigued by your use of the word "fabulous" with
regard
to the 4x5 process. To me, processing the 4x5 was just another B&W
process
where if necessary I could develop each exposure individually. What am I
missing?

--
M Stewart
Milton Keynes, UK
http://www.megalith.freeserve.co.uk/oddimage.htm

On 11 Nov 2004 14:24:17 GMT, (Argon3) wrote:

Look at the Horseman "technical" cameras...ebay may be a good place to start
getting an idea of their capabilities and prices. They seem reasonable right
now.

I've found a "Topcon Horseman 6x9 Press Technical View Camera" that
appeals me a lot. :-)

Now the questions:

The camera comes without lensboard, and without a rollfilm 6x9 back.
Which kind/size/brand of lensboards should I look for (for a decent
65mm wideangle lens)?
It also comes without a "cam". What is it?

Does it use a "Graflock" back or a spring back? Which kind of 6x9
rollfilm back should I look for?

Do you know of any specific issues with this camera? I was not able to
find any conspicuous by looking at the main LF websites.

Thanks!

Fernando