What makes a mac better?

In article , tony cooper
wrote:

Mac products are to computers what snake handling is to religion.
People who buy Macs tend to become evangelical about their choice.

some might, but most don't.

people who buy pcs tend to bash macs a *lot* more than mac users bash
pcs. many mac users have both and pick the one which is best for a
given task.

what's important is getting the job done, not which tool you use.

Mac-pimps like nospam automatically assume that Macs will be "best" at
everything; even things they have no personal experience with.

i never said anything of the sort.

It's just a machine; it doesn't endow the user with any special
qualities or abilities. As with any machine, proficiency comes with
experience, training (which can be self-training), and adaptability.

a car is just a car. a kia won't get you to the store any faster than a
lexus or bmw or ferrari, but it won't be as comfortable of a ride.

the difference is a mac does a lot of things with a lot less hassle.
it's a 'nicer ride'.

More people with PCs have problems than people with Macs, but that's
because the average Mac buyer is a little more sophisticated about
working with a computer and going online than the average PC buyer.
Knowledgeable PC users don't tend to have the same problems.

you do have data to back that up? didn't think so.

Macs are more expensive than PCs.

once again, they are not, and in some cases they are cheaper.

Mac-pimps are quick to point out
that PC computers with comparable specs are just as expensive, but one
of the definitions of "expensive" is the amount of money it takes to
purchase what will perform sufficiently for the user.

maybe in your personal dictionary it might be but not in anyone elses.

compare like versus like.

Mac-pimps
refuse to recognize that not all users need or want or are willing to
pay for spec levels they don't expect to use.

more bull****. nobody has said anything of the sort.

and the fact you are calling mac users 'mac-pimps' shows your bias, one
which you are trying to deny.

I don't think supporters of PCs say that their brand choice is the
best as you have posited above. I think they do think it works for
them and they are perfectly happy with their choice, but PC owners
aren't dick-wavers about brand superiority like Mac owners tend to be.
When have you ever heard a PC owner to say his e-machine or his Dell
is the best machine on the market?

many times, actually.

pc users tend to bash macs, like you're doing right now and dudley has
been doing. in fact, most of the mac-pc flamewars began with an idiot
making a bogus claim about macs and then a mac user corrects him.

there is a *lot* of misinformation about macs out there, some of which
might have been true 20 years ago, but mainly, it's just ignorance.

mac users don't give a flying **** what people use. many mac users use
pcs *and* macs, and are therefore able to make direct comparisons about
which one is better for a particular task. for some things, a mac is
the better choice and for others it isn't. pick the best tool for the
job.

mac bashers can't get this through their heads. all they know is
windows windows windows. if a mac is better for a given task, they
refuse to acknowledge it. they rant how macs are to be avoided and the
users are wackos. they refuse to listen to anything about a mac or how
something might possibly be easier to do on a different system.

Despite the continuous whining of a certain Mac-pimp here, I'm not
biased against Macs.

bull****. the fact that you call mac users 'mac-pimps' means are *very*
biased against macs and mac users, and saying you aren't means you're a
liar.

I just happened to drift into the PC area, found
that I can do what I want and need to do on a PC, and remain satisfied
with my choice. Had I started out on a Mac, I'd be perfectly
satisfied with a Mac, but I hope that I would never become the type of
person who thinks he is somehow superior or smarter for making that
choice.

have you ever looked at how a mac can do what you need to do? no. you
are just staying with pc because you don't know any different.

It's what you can do with the machine, not the name on the machine,
that counts.

that is true, but it contradicts your idiotic rant.

I certainly don't see the output or results of Mac users
to be superior to the output or results of PC users just because of
the machine they use.

it's not the output that matters, it's the ease of which it can be
done. as i said before about cars, it's a nicer ride.

And, in the case of one notable Mac-pimp, I
don't see the output or results at all. I wonder why.

because i have *no* interest in sharing it with you.

furthermore, my artistic skills do not change anything i've said.

you are once again, trying desperately to divert the issue.

In article , PeterN
wrote:

Do you actually work with any post processing program, or do you just
bull**** using theoretical specs.

mainly photoshop and lightroom. i've written several photoshop plug-ins
so i know how photoshop works internally and have also worked on other
image processing software. i've used aperture a couple of times but
don't like it. i use iphoto to sync photos to my idevices but not to
edit. from time to time i look at other apps just to see what they're
up to, including pixelmator, the gimp and others. it's been a while
since i've done anything with video, but i used to use adobe premiere.
on the rare occasion i need to do video now, i used imovie only because
it's free.

any other questions?

In article , Alan Browne
wrote:

Macs are more expensive than PCs. Mac-pimps are quick to point out
that PC computers with comparable specs are just as expensive, but one
of the definitions of "expensive" is the amount of money it takes to
purchase what will perform sufficiently for the user. Mac-pimps
refuse to recognize that not all users need or want or are willing to
pay for spec levels they don't expect to use.

There are areas (not universal) where the cost of equivalent spec macs
and PC's are very close, esp. in laptops. Yes you can make your case
where you don't need a quad core i7 laptop, an i3 dual core will do.
It's meaningless to those who need more powerful machines.

Windows is bizarrely expensive and comes in several "levels". The least
expensive (and crippled level) is about $140 and is a license for one
machine. The most expensive "starts" at $280. And is a license for one
machine.

OTOH, Upgrades to OS X are quite low priced. The current update to
"Lion" is "Mountain Lion" and is $20. There are no other flavours. And
that one license covers all Macs under one roof.

So a family of 5 having to upgrade all their PC's is looking at over
$600 to go from Vista to Win 7. And you'll need anti-virus for all of them.

Or $20 if using 5 Macs in the same household.

yep, and that's something the mac bashers ignore. they look at the
initial price tag and assume there will be no other costs.

I don't think supporters of PCs say that their brand choice is the
best as you have posited above. I think they do think it works for
them and they are perfectly happy with their choice, but PC owners
aren't dick-wavers about brand superiority like Mac owners tend to be.
When have you ever heard a PC owner to say his e-machine or his Dell
is the best machine on the market?

Go to the right forum and you will hear the hp/dell/etc. fights.

This dickwaver uses both Windows and Macs (and even smatterings of
Linux) and can tell you without a smidgen of bias that Mac OS X is far
better than Windows which has evolved from meager beginnings to be a big
mediocrity of a thousand disjointed parts. A blivet. That is Windows.

Mac hardware is very good stuff. That doesn't matter much because most
good PC brands are very good stuff too...

Except in one area. When you buy an iMac or a Mac laptop, the displays
are head and shoulders above what is provided with PC kits and most (not
all) PC laptops. There is premium value in Mac displays. (And that's
not even counting the superlative retina displays now available on some
Macbooks and Macbook Air laptops and rumoured to be coming to the iMac
this fall).

and there's also support.

got a question or problem? go to an apple store and they'll help, no
matter what it is. if the machine is not working properly, they'll
diagnose it, whether it's in warranty or not. if it's not, a repair
will probably cost money (no surprise there), but if it's a simple
thing such as reseating memory, reinstalling an app, etc., it will be
free.

in fact, they'll even help with *non* mac products. i saw someone bring
in a dell laptop and an ipod, and they walked him through getting it to
work. repairs are done same day or next day, except for alan's apple
store which is the lone exception to the rule. a year or so ago i
dropped off my laptop at 9am in the morning and they called me a little
after lunch to pick it up, fixed. try that at best buy and they
wouldn't have even touched it let alone fix it in that time.

It's what you can do with the machine, not the name on the machine,
that counts. I certainly don't see the output or results of Mac users
to be superior to the output or results of PC users just because of
the machine they use. And, in the case of one notable Mac-pimp, I
don't see the output or results at all. I wonder why.

Don't wonder but don't forget the journey is not only the end, but how
you get there. Traveling with a Mac is far less trouble, effort and
hassle than with a PC. I use both. I know.

as opposed to the likes of tony who hasn't used a mac and doesn't know
what they can or cannot do.

On 8/26/2012 3:49 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2012.08.26 15:28 , tony cooper wrote:
On Sun, 26 Aug 2012 09:43:57 -0600, "Dudley Hanks"
wrote:

I've always found the Apple / Mac versus the IBM / Windows debate rather
interesting...

Supporters on both sides say their brand choice is best, but why?

Mac products are to computers what snake handling is to religion.
People who buy Macs tend to become evangelical about their choice.
Mac-pimps like nospam automatically assume that Macs will be "best" at
everything; even things they have no personal experience with.

It's just a machine; it doesn't endow the user with any special
qualities or abilities. As with any machine, proficiency comes with
experience, training (which can be self-training), and adaptability.

More people with PCs have problems than people with Macs, but that's
because the average Mac buyer is a little more sophisticated about
working with a computer and going online than the average PC buyer.
Knowledgeable PC users don't tend to have the same problems.

I disagree with that. A lot of Mac users, esp. the artsy sorts are
pretty lame when it comes to understanding everything going on on their
computers. But they are productive with them whether writing, doing art
(incl. photography) and so on. There is something about the fussless
way things are done that appeals to them.


Macs are more expensive than PCs. Mac-pimps are quick to point out
that PC computers with comparable specs are just as expensive, but one
of the definitions of "expensive" is the amount of money it takes to
purchase what will perform sufficiently for the user. Mac-pimps
refuse to recognize that not all users need or want or are willing to
pay for spec levels they don't expect to use.

There are areas (not universal) where the cost of equivalent spec macs
and PC's are very close, esp. in laptops. Yes you can make your case
where you don't need a quad core i7 laptop, an i3 dual core will do.
It's meaningless to those who need more powerful machines.

Windows is bizarrely expensive and comes in several "levels". The least
expensive (and crippled level) is about $140 and is a license for one
machine. The most expensive "starts" at $280. And is a license for one
machine.

OTOH, Upgrades to OS X are quite low priced. The current update to
"Lion" is "Mountain Lion" and is $20. There are no other flavours. And
that one license covers all Macs under one roof.

So a family of 5 having to upgrade all their PC's is looking at over
$600 to go from Vista to Win 7. And you'll need anti-virus for all of
them.

Or $20 if using 5 Macs in the same household.

I don't think supporters of PCs say that their brand choice is the
best as you have posited above. I think they do think it works for
them and they are perfectly happy with their choice, but PC owners
aren't dick-wavers about brand superiority like Mac owners tend to be.
When have you ever heard a PC owner to say his e-machine or his Dell
is the best machine on the market?

Go to the right forum and you will hear the hp/dell/etc. fights.

This dickwaver uses both Windows and Macs (and even smatterings of
Linux) and can tell you without a smidgen of bias that Mac OS X is far
better than Windows which has evolved from meager beginnings to be a big
mediocrity of a thousand disjointed parts. A blivet. That is Windows.

Mac hardware is very good stuff. That doesn't matter much because most
good PC brands are very good stuff too...

Except in one area. When you buy an iMac or a Mac laptop, the displays
are head and shoulders above what is provided with PC kits and most (not
all) PC laptops. There is premium value in Mac displays. (And that's
not even counting the superlative retina displays now available on some
Macbooks and Macbook Air laptops and rumoured to be coming to the iMac
this fall).

Despite the continuous whining of a certain Mac-pimp here, I'm not
biased against Macs. I just happened to drift into the PC area, found
that I can do what I want and need to do on a PC, and remain satisfied
with my choice. Had I started out on a Mac, I'd be perfectly
satisfied with a Mac, but I hope that I would never become the type of
person who thinks he is somehow superior or smarter for making that
choice.

You can't help it. Get a Mac and you never go back. You will wave your
dick without embarrassment no matter how small. To have and use a Mac
is to have arrived. To be free of all the hassles of PC-dom.

It's what you can do with the machine, not the name on the machine,
that counts. I certainly don't see the output or results of Mac users
to be superior to the output or results of PC users just because of
the machine they use. And, in the case of one notable Mac-pimp, I
don't see the output or results at all. I wonder why.

Don't wonder but don't forget the journey is not only the end, but how
you get there. Traveling with a Mac is far less trouble, effort and
hassle than with a PC. I use both. I know.


True. And life under a dictatorship, without the right to choose, is
simple too.

--
Peter

On 2012.08.26 17:05 , nospam wrote:

work. repairs are done same day or next day, except for alan's apple
store which is the lone exception to the rule. a year or so ago i

You have 0 basis to know how many Apple stores provide as bad service as
Apple Montreal and Laval.


--
"C'mon boys, you're not laying pipe!".
-John Keating.

On 8/26/12 3:30 PM, in article
, "Dudley Hanks"
wrote:


"George Kerby" wrote in message
...



On 8/26/12 10:43 AM, in article
, "Dudley Hanks"
wrote:

I've always found the Apple / Mac versus the IBM / Windows debate rather
interesting...


snip

Dudley, are you trolling for a flame war?!?

bows head

Tsk-tsk...


Only with nospam ...



That isn't difficult, LOL!

On 8/26/12 4:05 PM, in article ,
"nospam" wrote:

In article , Alan Browne
wrote:

Macs are more expensive than PCs. Mac-pimps are quick to point out
that PC computers with comparable specs are just as expensive, but one
of the definitions of "expensive" is the amount of money it takes to
purchase what will perform sufficiently for the user. Mac-pimps
refuse to recognize that not all users need or want or are willing to
pay for spec levels they don't expect to use.

There are areas (not universal) where the cost of equivalent spec macs
and PC's are very close, esp. in laptops. Yes you can make your case
where you don't need a quad core i7 laptop, an i3 dual core will do.
It's meaningless to those who need more powerful machines.

Windows is bizarrely expensive and comes in several "levels". The least
expensive (and crippled level) is about $140 and is a license for one
machine. The most expensive "starts" at $280. And is a license for one
machine.

OTOH, Upgrades to OS X are quite low priced. The current update to
"Lion" is "Mountain Lion" and is $20. There are no other flavours. And
that one license covers all Macs under one roof.

So a family of 5 having to upgrade all their PC's is looking at over
$600 to go from Vista to Win 7. And you'll need anti-virus for all of them.

Or $20 if using 5 Macs in the same household.

yep, and that's something the mac bashers ignore. they look at the
initial price tag and assume there will be no other costs.

I don't think supporters of PCs say that their brand choice is the
best as you have posited above. I think they do think it works for
them and they are perfectly happy with their choice, but PC owners
aren't dick-wavers about brand superiority like Mac owners tend to be.
When have you ever heard a PC owner to say his e-machine or his Dell
is the best machine on the market?

Go to the right forum and you will hear the hp/dell/etc. fights.

This dickwaver uses both Windows and Macs (and even smatterings of
Linux) and can tell you without a smidgen of bias that Mac OS X is far
better than Windows which has evolved from meager beginnings to be a big
mediocrity of a thousand disjointed parts. A blivet. That is Windows.

Mac hardware is very good stuff. That doesn't matter much because most
good PC brands are very good stuff too...

Except in one area. When you buy an iMac or a Mac laptop, the displays
are head and shoulders above what is provided with PC kits and most (not
all) PC laptops. There is premium value in Mac displays. (And that's
not even counting the superlative retina displays now available on some
Macbooks and Macbook Air laptops and rumoured to be coming to the iMac
this fall).

and there's also support.

got a question or problem? go to an apple store and they'll help, no
matter what it is. if the machine is not working properly, they'll
diagnose it, whether it's in warranty or not. if it's not, a repair
will probably cost money (no surprise there), but if it's a simple
thing such as reseating memory, reinstalling an app, etc., it will be
free.

in fact, they'll even help with *non* mac products. i saw someone bring
in a dell laptop and an ipod, and they walked him through getting it to
work. repairs are done same day or next day, except for alan's apple
store which is the lone exception to the rule. a year or so ago i
dropped off my laptop at 9am in the morning and they called me a little
after lunch to pick it up, fixed. try that at best buy and they
wouldn't have even touched it let alone fix it in that time.


There *IS* a reason for this..

http://osxdaily.com/2011/09/20/apple...ting-at-all-ti
me-high-dominates-pc-industry/

And this...

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-20...ustomer-satisf
action-for-8th-year/

BTW, FYI...

http://www.apple.com/accessibility/

On 8/26/12 4:48 PM, in article ,
"tony cooper" wrote:

why should I not stay with my PC?


Because my IRA needs to grow?

"George Kerby" wrote in message
...



On 8/26/12 3:30 PM, in article
, "Dudley Hanks"
wrote:


"George Kerby" wrote in message
...



On 8/26/12 10:43 AM, in article
, "Dudley Hanks"
wrote:

I've always found the Apple / Mac versus the IBM / Windows debate
rather
interesting...


snip

Dudley, are you trolling for a flame war?!?

bows head

Tsk-tsk...


Only with nospam ...



That isn't difficult, LOL!

You might say, he's becoming my number one diversion tactic when boredom
sets in ...

In article , PeterN
wrote:

Don't wonder but don't forget the journey is not only the end, but how
you get there. Traveling with a Mac is far less trouble, effort and
hassle than with a PC. I use both. I know.

True. And life under a dictatorship, without the right to choose, is
simple too.

what dictatorship?

you can run any software you want on a mac, including a lot of open
source software. macs use industry standard formats, such as mp3, aac,
mpeg, h.264, pdf, etc.

meanwhile, windows locks you in with proprietary formats and
technologies like wmv, wma, active-x, .net, etc.