Nikon EN-EL14 battery

On Thu, 26 Feb 2015 05:43:26 -0800 (PST), Whisky-dave
wrote:

On Thursday, 26 February 2015 01:06:52 UTC, philo wrote:

You are 100% full of it (whatever "it" is)

are you suggesting a 100% in full ;-)



A battery that was originally 1000 maH which now has a capacity of 50%
can of course be brought to full charge as defined by voltage...

no charge is something else measured in coulombs not volts or amps.

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.


All that's happened is the ampere-hour is reduced and thus will come to
full charge faster.

you need to define full charge first.
Just like a car can go full speed, is it what the speedo says, or is it teh full speed the car can actually travek at i.e. foot to the floor.

It's when it won't hold any more.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

A battery that was originally 1000 maH which now has a capacity of 50%
can of course be brought to full charge as defined by voltage...

no charge is something else measured in coulombs not volts or amps.

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

not with a constant voltage charger, they don't.

On Thu, 26 Feb 2015 18:06:09 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

A battery that was originally 1000 maH which now has a capacity of 50%
can of course be brought to full charge as defined by voltage...

no charge is something else measured in coulombs not volts or amps.

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

not with a constant voltage charger, they don't.

We started off talking about lithium batteries but I suspect you have
switched to lead-acid. Either way there is no such thing as a constant
voltage charger: the output voltage depends on the state of the
battery being charged.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

A battery that was originally 1000 maH which now has a capacity of 50%
can of course be brought to full charge as defined by voltage...

no charge is something else measured in coulombs not volts or amps.

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

not with a constant voltage charger, they don't.

We started off talking about lithium batteries but I suspect you have
switched to lead-acid.

you suspect wrong.

Either way there is no such thing as a constant
voltage charger: the output voltage depends on the state of the
battery being charged.

there absolutely is such a thing as a constant voltage charger, and
both lion and lead acid use it for the second stage, following a bulk
charge stage that uses constant current.

http://batteryuniversity.com/_img/content/ion1.jpg
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/_img/content/clead1.jpg

more info about lion charging he
http://www.digikey.com/en/articles/t...tant-voltageco
nstant-current-devices-optimize-li-ion-battery-charging-for-energy-harve
sting
To achieve this balance, Li-ion charging typically follows a
two-phase approach (Figure 1). In the first phase, typically called
the constant-current, or current-limit, phase, the cell is charged at
the maximum charging rate recommended by the battery manufacturer.
This rate, typically called the 1C rate or fast-charging rate, is a
charging current equal to the ampere-hour rating of the cell. When
the cell reaches a specified set-point voltage, typically 4.2 V, cell
capacity has reached only 65 percent to 70 percent of its maximum
value but further fast-charging rates risk damaging the cells. As a
result, charging circuits switch to the second phase, or
constant-voltage phase. Here, the charging circuit will provide only
enough current to maintain the voltage of the battery constant at
this set-point voltage. As a result, the charging circuitry will
continually reduce the charging current over time, resulting in a
gradual decay of the charging current profile as shown in Figure 1.

On Thu, 26 Feb 2015 23:38:13 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

A battery that was originally 1000 maH which now has a capacity of 50%
can of course be brought to full charge as defined by voltage...

no charge is something else measured in coulombs not volts or amps.

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

not with a constant voltage charger, they don't.

We started off talking about lithium batteries but I suspect you have
switched to lead-acid.

you suspect wrong.

Either way there is no such thing as a constant
voltage charger: the output voltage depends on the state of the
battery being charged.

there absolutely is such a thing as a constant voltage charger, and
both lion and lead acid use it for the second stage, following a bulk
charge stage that uses constant current.

You are talking about the second stage of multistage charging. This
floats at a constant voltage by controlling the current flow into the
battery. You can only argue that this is a constant voltage charger if
you ignore the constant current/variable voltage of the first stage.

http://batteryuniversity.com/_img/content/ion1.jpg
http://www.batteryuniversity.com/_img/content/clead1.jpg

more info about lion charging he
http://www.digikey.com/en/articles/t...tant-voltageco
nstant-current-devices-optimize-li-ion-battery-charging-for-energy-harve
sting
To achieve this balance, Li-ion charging typically follows a
two-phase approach (Figure 1). In the first phase, typically called
the constant-current, or current-limit, phase, the cell is charged at
the maximum charging rate recommended by the battery manufacturer.
This rate, typically called the 1C rate or fast-charging rate, is a
charging current equal to the ampere-hour rating of the cell. When
the cell reaches a specified set-point voltage, typically 4.2 V, cell
capacity has reached only 65 percent to 70 percent of its maximum
value but further fast-charging rates risk damaging the cells. As a
result, charging circuits switch to the second phase, or
constant-voltage phase. Here, the charging circuit will provide only
enough current to maintain the voltage of the battery constant at
this set-point voltage. As a result, the charging circuitry will
continually reduce the charging current over time, resulting in a
gradual decay of the charging current profile as shown in Figure 1.

--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

not with a constant voltage charger, they don't.

We started off talking about lithium batteries but I suspect you have
switched to lead-acid.

you suspect wrong.

Either way there is no such thing as a constant
voltage charger: the output voltage depends on the state of the
battery being charged.

there absolutely is such a thing as a constant voltage charger, and
both lion and lead acid use it for the second stage, following a bulk
charge stage that uses constant current.

You are talking about the second stage of multistage charging. This
floats at a constant voltage by controlling the current flow into the
battery. You can only argue that this is a constant voltage charger if
you ignore the constant current/variable voltage of the first stage.

nope. the fact that it has more than one stage does not matter. a
constant voltage charger *does* exist.

plus, some chargers will skip the first stage if it's not needed. my
car battery charger does that (it shows which stage it's in).

On Fri, 27 Feb 2015 01:23:34 -0800 (PST), Whisky-dave
wrote:

On Thursday, 26 February 2015 22:37:40 UTC, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 26 Feb 2015 05:35:32 -0800 (PST), Whisky-dave
wrote:

On Wednesday, 25 February 2015 20:46:43 UTC, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Wed, 25 Feb 2015 13:30:57 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , philo
wrote:

I am not talking about a /defective/ battery, such as a shorted or open cell

a 1000 mah battery that can only hold 500 mah or whatever is a failing
battery.

it doesn't need to be a total failure to be considered defective.

merely a low capacity battery which now has a reduced ampere-hour

it will charge faster simply because there is not as much to charge
(to put it simply)

to put it simply, you're not fully charging it, which is why it's
faster.

obviously, half-charging a battery will take less time. no surprise
there.

what should also be obvious is that it's not fully charged, regardless
of the reason. calling it fully charged when it's only half-charged is
bull****.

It depends whether you assess start of charge by Q or V: Quantity of
electricity or Voltage at the terminals.

or when the blinking LED stops or when the bisexual LED changes colour ;-)

They normally work off voltage.
--

No they do not, LEDs should be driven from a constant current source or driven from a Pulse width modulation if you want to change their brightness.

I was talking about the control of the charger, not the operation of
the LED.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

On Fri, 27 Feb 2015 07:05:07 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

not with a constant voltage charger, they don't.

We started off talking about lithium batteries but I suspect you have
switched to lead-acid.

you suspect wrong.

Either way there is no such thing as a constant
voltage charger: the output voltage depends on the state of the
battery being charged.

there absolutely is such a thing as a constant voltage charger, and
both lion and lead acid use it for the second stage, following a bulk
charge stage that uses constant current.

You are talking about the second stage of multistage charging. This
floats at a constant voltage by controlling the current flow into the
battery. You can only argue that this is a constant voltage charger if
you ignore the constant current/variable voltage of the first stage.

nope. the fact that it has more than one stage does not matter. a
constant voltage charger *does* exist.

plus, some chargers will skip the first stage if it's not needed. my
car battery charger does that (it shows which stage it's in).

Then you are trying to charge it when it is already charged.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

On Fri, 27 Feb 2015 01:42:09 -0800 (PST), Whisky-dave
wrote:

On Friday, 27 February 2015 04:09:04 UTC, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 26 Feb 2015 18:06:09 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

A battery that was originally 1000 maH which now has a capacity of 50%
can of course be brought to full charge as defined by voltage...

no charge is something else measured in coulombs not volts or amps.

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

not with a constant voltage charger, they don't.

We started off talking about lithium batteries but I suspect you have
switched to lead-acid. Either way there is no such thing as a constant
voltage charger:

yes there are.

the output voltage depends on the state of the
battery being charged.
No it doessn;t they are constant current charges typical for Nicds

constant voltage charges put out a constant voltage irrespective of the battery being charged.

Even into a short circuit?
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

On Fri, 27 Feb 2015 01:37:33 -0800 (PST), Whisky-dave
wrote:

On Thursday, 26 February 2015 22:41:37 UTC, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 26 Feb 2015 05:43:26 -0800 (PST), Whisky-dave
wrote:

On Thursday, 26 February 2015 01:06:52 UTC, philo wrote:

You are 100% full of it (whatever "it" is)

are you suggesting a 100% in full ;-)



A battery that was originally 1000 maH which now has a capacity of 50%
can of course be brought to full charge as defined by voltage...

no charge is something else measured in coulombs not volts or amps.

Battery chargers don't normally count Coulombs or Joules. They decide
when the have got there by measuring Volts.

No they don't. Good one use the change in voltage over time, poor ones just use a timer, really bad ones just use voltage

Leaving out the one using a timer (yechh!), the others decide when
they have got there by measuring Volts.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens