Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

On 2018-10-12 17:20, nospam wrote:
In article , Alan Browne
wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one exception)
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's pages and
numbers were never intended to be replacements for word/excel. they're
designed for average users doing common tasks, whereas word/excel tries
to be everything for everyone, and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in features,
but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially to get work done.

--
"2/3 of Donald Trump's wives were immigrants. Proof that we
need immigrants to do jobs that most Americans wouldn't do."
- unknown protester

In article , Alan Browne
wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one exception)
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's pages and
numbers were never intended to be replacements for word/excel. they're
designed for average users doing common tasks, whereas word/excel tries
to be everything for everyone, and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in features,
but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially to get work done.

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple stuff, but
the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not. macs
include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay extra for.

On 2018-10-13 11:30, nospam wrote:
In article , Alan Browne
wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one exception) ----- [1]
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's pages and
numbers were never intended to be replacements for word/excel. they're
designed for average users doing common tasks, whereas word/excel tries
to be everything for everyone, and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in features,
but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially to get work done.

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple stuff, but
the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not. macs
include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

--
"2/3 of Donald Trump's wives were immigrants. Proof that we
need immigrants to do jobs that most Americans wouldn't do."
- unknown protester

In article , Alan Browne
wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one exception)
----- [1]
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's pages and
numbers were never intended to be replacements for word/excel. they're
designed for average users doing common tasks, whereas word/excel tries
to be everything for everyone, and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in features,
but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially to get work done.

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple stuff, but
the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not. macs
include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

maybe for you, but not for everyone.

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 20:08:22 GMT, "MC" wrote:

nospam wrote:

In article , Alan
Browne wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of
Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one
exception) ----- [1]
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's
pages and numbers were never intended to be replacements for
word/excel. they're designed for average users doing common
tasks, whereas word/excel tries to be everything for everyone,
and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in
features, but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially
to get work done.

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple
stuff, but the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not.
macs include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay
extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

maybe for you, but not for everyone.

I go to a supermarket to buy a loaf of bread. Just because the
supermarket sells thousands of other products does not mean I have to
buy them all so I can get my loaf of bread.

Using Word and Excel is no harder to use for "simple" tasks as it to
use a more basic wp or spreadsheet applications. It is just that Word
and Excel offer a whole lot more should you need, or be inclined to
learn how, to use its more advanced features.

As for FREE? Open Office (and its various guises) is not to shabby
when comparing itself to Microsoft offerings. It certainly out-does
most, if not all, other free "office" based applications when it comes
to features.

MC

I've used (almost) everything from WordStar and VisiCalc to current
apps, and presently use Open Office for both text and spreadsheets.
Now that I'm retired, my needs are simpler, and Open Office does
everything I expect/need.

"Better" is determined by a combination of criteria because "better"
is a subjective user-defined term. In this case, Open Office is the
better app for this user...it does what I need and there is no cost.

For text, I personally rated WordPerfect as the better app, but when
Corel took it over it went downhill faster than Jean-Claude Killy and
crashed like Eddie the Eagle.

A lot of people I know (from the Internet) swear by LaTeX, but they
are academics who are into publishing papers and documents in their
specialty areas.

For spreadsheets, Lotus 1-2-3 was the better app in my opinion. While
Open Office is my current app, I sometimes instinctively use a Lotus
shortcut. I get involved and auto-pilot takes over.

I have never been anti-Microsoft, but what they've offered has been
more than what I've needed.

What I *don't* like are people who declare that (name) is the better
app without modifying that statement with "for my use".

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

On 10/9/2018 11:34 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 10/9/2018 10:58 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 10/9/2018 10:38 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 10/9/2018 9:32 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 10/9/2018 2:41 PM, nospam wrote:
In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:


Whether or not this is an issue depends on what users do with
their
computers. If they're playing around with beta releases, as in the
Insider Development program, it's not a good idea to use a
computer
with critical files on it. As for the rest who use Win10, the
update has not been distributed, so it's a non-issue.

wrong. 1809 was released last week to the public then later
pulled on
friday after people lost data. it was not an insider build.

It was not "distributed".* It was available for "optional" download
only.

I got it automatically on a laptop of mine.

yep. same here (although not a laptop).


I did not get the update on my Win10 machine. Possible that had
something to do with the fact that I have automatic updates turned off.

IMHO the larger problem is that Win 10 updates *CAN* delete files.
Also Win 10, by design, forces updates.
The level of trust has been greatly compromised.
Who really knows what files/folders/etc could be the target
of some code "oops", let alone an actual targeted attack?

i do try to regularly back up.
My Win 7 machine has not such issues.

Ah, but that's not Win 10. Now here's a (paranoid) question;
How do you know what and how many files any Win update
has touched let alone deleted? Yes, we have backups .. but
how often do we test for CRC, etc.* differences?
OK, end paranoia, um ...for the moment.* ;-)

I have a Win10 machine, with no such issues, ad have never lost a file,
unless I accidentally deleted it, or put it in the wrong directory.
But

--
PeterN

On 10/10/2018 7:26 PM, RichA wrote:
On Tuesday, 9 October 2018 21:32:51 UTC-4, PeterN wrote:
On 10/9/2018 2:41 PM, nospam wrote:
In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:


Whether or not this is an issue depends on what users do with their
computers. If they're playing around with beta releases, as in the
Insider Development program, it's not a good idea to use a computer
with critical files on it. As for the rest who use Win10, the
update has not been distributed, so it's a non-issue.

wrong. 1809 was released last week to the public then later pulled on
friday after people lost data. it was not an insider build.

It was not "distributed". It was available for "optional" download
only.

I got it automatically on a laptop of mine.

yep. same here (although not a laptop).


I did not get the update on my Win10 machine. Possible that had
something to do with the fact that I have automatic updates turned off.

--
PeterN

Didn't think it was that easy to do. Not like Win 7-8.

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-s...lly-windows-10

Note the language: "You can do it "depending" on which edition you have."



Win10 Professional

--
PeterN

On 10/10/2018 8:10 PM, Alan Browne wrote:

snip


From what I keep reading about Win 10 I shudder to think I may have to
go there some day... (different "editions" with different abilities and
limitations, arbitrary updates (just when you have to get something else
done...)


I am convinced that some marines have a version of Murphy, with mind
reading capabilities.

Similarly I am also convinced that most critters have meetings, at were
they agree that if a photographer points a camera at you, you should
turn away. As soon as he puts down his camera, then do something
interesting.

--
PeterN

In article , MC
wrote:

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple
stuff, but the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not.
macs include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay
extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

maybe for you, but not for everyone.

I go to a supermarket to buy a loaf of bread. Just because the
supermarket sells thousands of other products does not mean I have to
buy them all so I can get my loaf of bread.

not a good analogy, but if all you want is bread, then a bakery is a
better choice, likely offering a better selection and also fresher.

an slr with a bag full of lenses is more capable than a cellphone
camera, but if all you want to do is gram, a cellphone is a better
choice.

choose the best tool for the job.

Using Word and Excel is no harder to use for "simple" tasks as it to
use a more basic wp or spreadsheet applications. It is just that Word
and Excel offer a whole lot more should you need, or be inclined to
learn how, to use its more advanced features.

false. it's harder for simple tasks. most people don't need the more
advanced features. their presence is not in any way an advantage and
paying for them is a waste of money.

word/excel are not the only options out there, despite microsoft
forcing them down people's throats. people who want to use them
certainly can, but they don't have to.

also, macos can read/write word & excel files with no additional
software required. windows can't. it can also read & write pdf, without
any additional software. no need to buy acrobat.

As for FREE? Open Office (and its various guises) is not to shabby
when comparing itself to Microsoft offerings. It certainly out-does
most, if not all, other free "office" based applications when it comes
to features.

open office may be free, but it's also crap.

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 16:34:00 -0400, Tony Cooper
wrote:

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 20:08:22 GMT, "MC" wrote:

nospam wrote:

In article , Alan
Browne wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of
Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one
exception) ----- [1]
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's
pages and numbers were never intended to be replacements for
word/excel. they're designed for average users doing common
tasks, whereas word/excel tries to be everything for everyone,
and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in
features, but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially
to get work done.

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple
stuff, but the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not.
macs include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay
extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

maybe for you, but not for everyone.

I go to a supermarket to buy a loaf of bread. Just because the
supermarket sells thousands of other products does not mean I have to
buy them all so I can get my loaf of bread.

Using Word and Excel is no harder to use for "simple" tasks as it to
use a more basic wp or spreadsheet applications. It is just that Word
and Excel offer a whole lot more should you need, or be inclined to
learn how, to use its more advanced features.

As for FREE? Open Office (and its various guises) is not to shabby
when comparing itself to Microsoft offerings. It certainly out-does
most, if not all, other free "office" based applications when it comes
to features.

MC

I've used (almost) everything from WordStar and VisiCalc to current
apps, and presently use Open Office for both text and spreadsheets.
Now that I'm retired, my needs are simpler, and Open Office does
everything I expect/need.

"Better" is determined by a combination of criteria because "better"
is a subjective user-defined term. In this case, Open Office is the
better app for this user...it does what I need and there is no cost.

For text, I personally rated WordPerfect as the better app, but when
Corel took it over it went downhill faster than Jean-Claude Killy and
crashed like Eddie the Eagle.

That was at least partly due to the damage wreaked by Microsoft
withholding the new revised Visual Basic from Wordperfect for six
months in the days before Corel bought the the wreck. In effect
Microsoft was able to hamstring their only significant competition
while giving themselves a clear run. What happened after was not
entirely Corel's fault.


A lot of people I know (from the Internet) swear by LaTeX, but they
are academics who are into publishing papers and documents in their
specialty areas.

For spreadsheets, Lotus 1-2-3 was the better app in my opinion. While
Open Office is my current app, I sometimes instinctively use a Lotus
shortcut. I get involved and auto-pilot takes over.

I have never been anti-Microsoft, but what they've offered has been
more than what I've needed.

What I *don't* like are people who declare that (name) is the better
app without modifying that statement with "for my use".

--

Regards,

Eric Stevens