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#1
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SB800 Nikon flash question (with D70)
If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need
a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? |
#2
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On 15 Jan 2005 in rec.photo.digital, larrylook wrote:
If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? No. Not unless you need the compensation normally. The flash/camera system computes the exposure regardless of how you aim the flash. How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? Have you tried any of these? It's a digital camera; button clicks are cheap. Do the experiments and see how they look. -- Joe Makowiec http://makowiec.org/ Email: http://makowiec.org/contact/?Joe |
#3
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"larrylook" writes:
If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? No special compensation needed for bounce in TTL mode. The "diffusion dome" gives you more of a bare-bulb look than a diffused look. It's somewhat different from ceiling bounce (it depends on ceiling and wall bounce a lot). Play with it, decide what you like in different kinds of rooms. There's no "right" and "wrong" here! This is art. Bouncing off the ceiling will give softer light than the diffusion dome thingy, in my experience. If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? No exposure compensation, no (in ttl mode). The little white card is a variable fill reflector. When bouncing off the ceiling, especially close up, you'll tend to get dark shadows under the eyes and chin. The fill reflector opens those dark areas up and makes them look better. -- David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/ Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/ Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/ |
#4
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"larrylook" writes:
If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? No special compensation needed for bounce in TTL mode. The "diffusion dome" gives you more of a bare-bulb look than a diffused look. It's somewhat different from ceiling bounce (it depends on ceiling and wall bounce a lot). Play with it, decide what you like in different kinds of rooms. There's no "right" and "wrong" here! This is art. Bouncing off the ceiling will give softer light than the diffusion dome thingy, in my experience. If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? No exposure compensation, no (in ttl mode). The little white card is a variable fill reflector. When bouncing off the ceiling, especially close up, you'll tend to get dark shadows under the eyes and chin. The fill reflector opens those dark areas up and makes them look better. -- David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/ Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/ Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/ |
#5
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"David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message ... "larrylook" writes: If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? No special compensation needed for bounce in TTL mode. The "diffusion dome" gives you more of a bare-bulb look than a diffused look. It's somewhat different from ceiling bounce (it depends on ceiling and wall bounce a lot). Play with it, decide what you like in different kinds of rooms. There's no "right" and "wrong" here! This is art. Bouncing off the ceiling will give softer light than the diffusion dome thingy, in my experience. When you say bare bulb, do you mean if diff. dome is pointed right at the subject? So maybe I should bounce off ceiling and not use dome, since I want diffused light. Maybe no point for me to put on the d. dome, if I'm bouncing off ceiling. Or should I use the dome and bounce too. I know there's no 1 answer, but happy for any advise or thoughts, since I'm a newbie. What you do yourself may be a good starting point for me. If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? No exposure compensation, no (in ttl mode). The little white card is a variable fill reflector. When bouncing off the ceiling, especially close up, you'll tend to get dark shadows under the eyes and chin. The fill reflector opens those dark areas up and makes them look better. I realize there's no one right answer. When you (or anyone) use white card (fill reflector) do you put flash straight up (0 degrees) or perhaps use 20 degrees (slightly angled toward subject) (say ceiling is 9-10 ft high and subject is 4-7 feet away? Do you also put on the small wide-angle rectangular diffuser (I don't know it's correct name) - or leave it off - when bouncing with white card? If photographing people do you advise always using the white card to avoid racoon eyes? When would you choose diff. dome and bounce off ceiling without card (over using white bounce card)? Thanks for any suggestions. -- David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/ Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/ Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/ |
#6
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"larrylook" writes:
"David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message ... "larrylook" writes: If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? No special compensation needed for bounce in TTL mode. The "diffusion dome" gives you more of a bare-bulb look than a diffused look. It's somewhat different from ceiling bounce (it depends on ceiling and wall bounce a lot). Play with it, decide what you like in different kinds of rooms. There's no "right" and "wrong" here! This is art. Bouncing off the ceiling will give softer light than the diffusion dome thingy, in my experience. When you say bare bulb, do you mean if diff. dome is pointed right at the subject? So maybe I should bounce off ceiling and not use dome, since I want diffused light. Maybe no point for me to put on the d. dome, if I'm bouncing off ceiling. Or should I use the dome and bounce too. I know there's no 1 answer, but happy for any advise or thoughts, since I'm a newbie. What you do yourself may be a good starting point for me. The diffusion dome thingy is normally used pointed towards the ceiling. It sends quite a bit of the light forward, backwards, and to the sides, through the other 4 sides of the thingy. I find it depends on the room, and perhaps on the type of shots I'm taking. *Mostly* I choose to bounce off the ceiling, with various amounts of fill from the little reflector. If you were looking for a diffused look, that'll probably work better for you than the dome. If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? No exposure compensation, no (in ttl mode). The little white card is a variable fill reflector. When bouncing off the ceiling, especially close up, you'll tend to get dark shadows under the eyes and chin. The fill reflector opens those dark areas up and makes them look better. I realize there's no one right answer. When you (or anyone) use white card (fill reflector) do you put flash straight up (0 degrees) or perhaps use 20 degrees (slightly angled toward subject) (say ceiling is 9-10 ft high and subject is 4-7 feet away? Do you also put on the small wide-angle rectangular diffuser (I don't know it's correct name) - or leave it off - when bouncing with white card? If photographing people do you advise always using the white card to avoid racoon eyes? When would you choose diff. dome and bounce off ceiling without card (over using white bounce card)? Thanks for any suggestions. In the 4-7 foot range I'll generally point the flash straight up. At that close range it also depends a lot on subject height vs. camera position; if I'm pointing the camera *down*, I'll sometimes turn the flash around and point it *backwards* a bit, to move the bright area on the ceiling (the "light source" in terms of lighting angle and hardness/softness) more away from directly above the subject. Assuming a level camera, I'll start tilting the flash forward a bit out beyond 15 feet or so. Especially on the wider settings, it's easy to get the fringes of the *direct* beam on the subject if you tilt the flash too far forward, and this rarely works well -- it's hard light (which you must not have wanted, or you wouldn't be bouncing), and often it catches only the *top half* of the subject, so you get a lot of lighting variation across the picture -- this is not good! So I'm pretty careful about tilting the flash forward. For flash zoom (and wideangle panel), think in terms of the size spot of light you'll be making on the ceiling, and then think in terms of that as an umbrella or light-box size, and try to get it the size you need for the degree of hardness/softness you want in the lighting. Even if none of these things are at all automatic for you yet, I hope the *concept* gets you thinking in the right direction. I pretty much always use the white card (or regret forgetting it) at ranges under 15 feet, anyway. I liked the way you phrased this round of questions, by the way. By making it clear that you understood the lack of absolutes, you helped me worry less about accidentally sounding absolute. I'm happy to talk about how I do things and why, but worry sometimes (perhaps more than necessary in this group of individualists!) about sounding too absolute when I don't mean to be. -- David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/ Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/ Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/ |
#7
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"larrylook" writes:
"David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message ... "larrylook" writes: If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? No special compensation needed for bounce in TTL mode. The "diffusion dome" gives you more of a bare-bulb look than a diffused look. It's somewhat different from ceiling bounce (it depends on ceiling and wall bounce a lot). Play with it, decide what you like in different kinds of rooms. There's no "right" and "wrong" here! This is art. Bouncing off the ceiling will give softer light than the diffusion dome thingy, in my experience. When you say bare bulb, do you mean if diff. dome is pointed right at the subject? So maybe I should bounce off ceiling and not use dome, since I want diffused light. Maybe no point for me to put on the d. dome, if I'm bouncing off ceiling. Or should I use the dome and bounce too. I know there's no 1 answer, but happy for any advise or thoughts, since I'm a newbie. What you do yourself may be a good starting point for me. The diffusion dome thingy is normally used pointed towards the ceiling. It sends quite a bit of the light forward, backwards, and to the sides, through the other 4 sides of the thingy. I find it depends on the room, and perhaps on the type of shots I'm taking. *Mostly* I choose to bounce off the ceiling, with various amounts of fill from the little reflector. If you were looking for a diffused look, that'll probably work better for you than the dome. If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? No exposure compensation, no (in ttl mode). The little white card is a variable fill reflector. When bouncing off the ceiling, especially close up, you'll tend to get dark shadows under the eyes and chin. The fill reflector opens those dark areas up and makes them look better. I realize there's no one right answer. When you (or anyone) use white card (fill reflector) do you put flash straight up (0 degrees) or perhaps use 20 degrees (slightly angled toward subject) (say ceiling is 9-10 ft high and subject is 4-7 feet away? Do you also put on the small wide-angle rectangular diffuser (I don't know it's correct name) - or leave it off - when bouncing with white card? If photographing people do you advise always using the white card to avoid racoon eyes? When would you choose diff. dome and bounce off ceiling without card (over using white bounce card)? Thanks for any suggestions. In the 4-7 foot range I'll generally point the flash straight up. At that close range it also depends a lot on subject height vs. camera position; if I'm pointing the camera *down*, I'll sometimes turn the flash around and point it *backwards* a bit, to move the bright area on the ceiling (the "light source" in terms of lighting angle and hardness/softness) more away from directly above the subject. Assuming a level camera, I'll start tilting the flash forward a bit out beyond 15 feet or so. Especially on the wider settings, it's easy to get the fringes of the *direct* beam on the subject if you tilt the flash too far forward, and this rarely works well -- it's hard light (which you must not have wanted, or you wouldn't be bouncing), and often it catches only the *top half* of the subject, so you get a lot of lighting variation across the picture -- this is not good! So I'm pretty careful about tilting the flash forward. For flash zoom (and wideangle panel), think in terms of the size spot of light you'll be making on the ceiling, and then think in terms of that as an umbrella or light-box size, and try to get it the size you need for the degree of hardness/softness you want in the lighting. Even if none of these things are at all automatic for you yet, I hope the *concept* gets you thinking in the right direction. I pretty much always use the white card (or regret forgetting it) at ranges under 15 feet, anyway. I liked the way you phrased this round of questions, by the way. By making it clear that you understood the lack of absolutes, you helped me worry less about accidentally sounding absolute. I'm happy to talk about how I do things and why, but worry sometimes (perhaps more than necessary in this group of individualists!) about sounding too absolute when I don't mean to be. -- David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/ Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/ Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/ |
#8
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"David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message ... "larrylook" writes: "David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message ... "larrylook" writes: If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? No special compensation needed for bounce in TTL mode. The "diffusion dome" gives you more of a bare-bulb look than a diffused look. It's somewhat different from ceiling bounce (it depends on ceiling and wall bounce a lot). Play with it, decide what you like in different kinds of rooms. There's no "right" and "wrong" here! This is art. Bouncing off the ceiling will give softer light than the diffusion dome thingy, in my experience. When you say bare bulb, do you mean if diff. dome is pointed right at the subject? So maybe I should bounce off ceiling and not use dome, since I want diffused light. Maybe no point for me to put on the d. dome, if I'm bouncing off ceiling. Or should I use the dome and bounce too. I know there's no 1 answer, but happy for any advise or thoughts, since I'm a newbie. What you do yourself may be a good starting point for me. The diffusion dome thingy is normally used pointed towards the ceiling. It sends quite a bit of the light forward, backwards, and to the sides, through the other 4 sides of the thingy. I find it depends on the room, and perhaps on the type of shots I'm taking. *Mostly* I choose to bounce off the ceiling, with various amounts of fill from the little reflector. If you were looking for a diffused look, that'll probably work better for you than the dome. Thanks! All if this is so helpful since as you know I need a good starting point and am happy for any opinions of those more experienced than me (which is most here). So, interestingly, if I want a diffused look (which I think I do) I'll probably be avoiding the diffusion dome ( which seems a bit counterintuitive at first), and bouncing off the ceiling (without the dome) and using the white card reflector. Do you see a point in putting on the wide angle diffuser (small rectangle next to the white card) when doing this? Or does just the act of bouncing the light off the ceiling diffuse the light sufficiently? With vertical shots (portrait as opposed to landscape) it's tough to bounce off the ceiling and use the white card simultaneously. Aiming for the ceiling with the flash doesn't seem condusive to aiming the white card reflection towards the subject. Any suggestions here - besides removing the flash which may be annoying and there's more to learn with that? If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? No exposure compensation, no (in ttl mode). The little white card is a variable fill reflector. When bouncing off the ceiling, especially close up, you'll tend to get dark shadows under the eyes and chin. The fill reflector opens those dark areas up and makes them look better. I realize there's no one right answer. When you (or anyone) use white card (fill reflector) do you put flash straight up (0 degrees) or perhaps use 20 degrees (slightly angled toward subject) (say ceiling is 9-10 ft high and subject is 4-7 feet away? Do you also put on the small wide-angle rectangular diffuser (I don't know it's correct name) - or leave it off - when bouncing with white card? If photographing people do you advise always using the white card to avoid racoon eyes? When would you choose diff. dome and bounce off ceiling without card (over using white bounce card)? Thanks for any suggestions. In the 4-7 foot range I'll generally point the flash straight up. At that close range it also depends a lot on subject height vs. camera position; if I'm pointing the camera *down*, I'll sometimes turn the flash around and point it *backwards* a bit, to move the bright area on the ceiling (the "light source" in terms of lighting angle and hardness/softness) more away from directly above the subject. So you really aren't concerned about angle of inc. and angle of reflection here? since you're aren't aiming the flash so it hits the subject after bouncing of the ceiling. Previously I though about an imaginary line - that you aim a spot on ceiling roughly half way between camera and subject. Assuming a level camera, I'll start tilting the flash forward a bit out beyond 15 feet or so. Especially on the wider settings, it's easy to get the fringes of the *direct* beam on the subject if you tilt the flash too far forward, and this rarely works well -- it's hard light (which you must not have wanted, or you wouldn't be bouncing), and often it catches only the *top half* of the subject, so you get a lot of lighting variation across the picture -- this is not good! So I'm pretty careful about tilting the flash forward. For flash zoom (and wideangle panel), think in terms of the size spot of light you'll be making on the ceiling, and then think in terms of that as an umbrella or light-box size, and try to get it the size you need for the degree of hardness/softness you want in the lighting. Even if none of these things are at all automatic for you yet, I hope the *concept* gets you thinking in the right direction. I pretty much always use the white card (or regret forgetting it) at ranges under 15 feet, anyway. Why do some photographers use a huge white card. Is this really necessary? When would you choose not to pull the card out all the way? This is very helpful - since many would tell me to go out and buy a book - and I wouldn't blame you if you did. I liked the way you phrased this round of questions, by the way. By making it clear that you understood the lack of absolutes, you helped me worry less about accidentally sounding absolute. I'm happy to talk about how I do things and why, but worry sometimes (perhaps more than necessary in this group of individualists!) about sounding too absolute when I don't mean to be. -- David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/ Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/ Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/ |
#9
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"larrylook" writes:
"David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message ... "larrylook" writes: "David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message ... "larrylook" writes: If I bounce the sb800 off the ceiling (using TTL mode) will I generally need a + exposure compensation setting? How is this done? If I bounce off the ceiling should I bother with the rounded diffusion dome accessory, or does just bouncing off the ceiling diffuse the light enough that it's not worth putting the dome on? No special compensation needed for bounce in TTL mode. The "diffusion dome" gives you more of a bare-bulb look than a diffused look. It's somewhat different from ceiling bounce (it depends on ceiling and wall bounce a lot). Play with it, decide what you like in different kinds of rooms. There's no "right" and "wrong" here! This is art. Bouncing off the ceiling will give softer light than the diffusion dome thingy, in my experience. When you say bare bulb, do you mean if diff. dome is pointed right at the subject? So maybe I should bounce off ceiling and not use dome, since I want diffused light. Maybe no point for me to put on the d. dome, if I'm bouncing off ceiling. Or should I use the dome and bounce too. I know there's no 1 answer, but happy for any advise or thoughts, since I'm a newbie. What you do yourself may be a good starting point for me. The diffusion dome thingy is normally used pointed towards the ceiling. It sends quite a bit of the light forward, backwards, and to the sides, through the other 4 sides of the thingy. I find it depends on the room, and perhaps on the type of shots I'm taking. *Mostly* I choose to bounce off the ceiling, with various amounts of fill from the little reflector. If you were looking for a diffused look, that'll probably work better for you than the dome. Thanks! All if this is so helpful since as you know I need a good starting point and am happy for any opinions of those more experienced than me (which is most here). So, interestingly, if I want a diffused look (which I think I do) I'll probably be avoiding the diffusion dome ( which seems a bit counterintuitive at first), and bouncing off the ceiling (without the dome) and using the white card reflector. Do you see a point in putting on the wide angle diffuser (small rectangle next to the white card) when doing this? Or does just the act of bouncing the light off the ceiling diffuse the light sufficiently? I think a lot of the trouble is with the concept of "diffusion". You're probably thinking about diffusion when what you *really* want is "soft" light. "Hard" light casts sharp-edged shadows. The softer the edge of the shadow, the softer the light. (There's a continuum from a point source, perfectly "hard" light, through various degrees of softness to what you get in a light tent, which might be considered perfectly "soft" light.) The thing that controls the hardness of a particular light source for a particular picture is the size of that light source when viewed from the point-of-view of the subject. Think about a sunny day vs. a cloudy day; on a sunny day the primarily light source is that little sun, and the shadow it casts of you on the ground is fairly sharp-edged. On a cloudy day, the whole sky full of clouds is the light source, and you may not be able to find your shadow at all, except right under your feet. ("Size" of the light source in this context means angular size; a source covering 1 degree is much smaller than one covering 10 degrees.) Simple direct flash is a very small light source. Bouncing off the ceiling accomplishes two things. One is that it moves the apparent light source up to the ceiling. The other, and more important one, is that it makes the apparent light source *much bigger*, and hence softer. The "diffusion dome" only makes the light softer if some of the light diffused out the back, top, and sides bounces off stuff in the environment and helps illuminate the subject. In a perfectly black room, the diffusion dome wouldn't make pictures any different from direct flash, *except* that there'd be a lot *less* light. I addressed the wide-angle diffuser question in my last response, but to repeat, mostly not. Using it makes it far too easy to get the direct beam of the flash covering part or all of the subject, which interferes with the bounce lighting. With vertical shots (portrait as opposed to landscape) it's tough to bounce off the ceiling and use the white card simultaneously. Aiming for the ceiling with the flash doesn't seem condusive to aiming the white card reflection towards the subject. Any suggestions here - besides removing the flash which may be annoying and there's more to learn with that? Yes, verticals are a problem. You can either do without fill, or use your own bounce card. The little built-in card Nikon supplies is just a fancy form of something press photographers have been doing since the 70s to my knowledge, and probably longer: attaching a 3x5 card to their flash head with a rubber band to provide some fill flash when bouncing. Or, as you say, take the flash off-camera. Off-camera is a pain with modern dedicated flashes that take fancy (expensive) connecting cords. It was much easier when all you needed was a simple generic sync cord. If I bounce off the small supplied white card (by sliding it out) I can no longer use the diffusion dome (it won't go on). So if I want to try bouncing off the card should I also use the small rectangular (flat diffuser) to bounce additional light off the ceiling or not bother to use that? Is + exposure compensation needed when bouncing off the little white card they supply? No exposure compensation, no (in ttl mode). The little white card is a variable fill reflector. When bouncing off the ceiling, especially close up, you'll tend to get dark shadows under the eyes and chin. The fill reflector opens those dark areas up and makes them look better. I realize there's no one right answer. When you (or anyone) use white card (fill reflector) do you put flash straight up (0 degrees) or perhaps use 20 degrees (slightly angled toward subject) (say ceiling is 9-10 ft high and subject is 4-7 feet away? Do you also put on the small wide-angle rectangular diffuser (I don't know it's correct name) - or leave it off - when bouncing with white card? If photographing people do you advise always using the white card to avoid racoon eyes? When would you choose diff. dome and bounce off ceiling without card (over using white bounce card)? Thanks for any suggestions. In the 4-7 foot range I'll generally point the flash straight up. At that close range it also depends a lot on subject height vs. camera position; if I'm pointing the camera *down*, I'll sometimes turn the flash around and point it *backwards* a bit, to move the bright area on the ceiling (the "light source" in terms of lighting angle and hardness/softness) more away from directly above the subject. So you really aren't concerned about angle of inc. and angle of reflection here? since you're aren't aiming the flash so it hits the subject after bouncing of the ceiling. Previously I though about an imaginary line - that you aim a spot on ceiling roughly half way between camera and subject. The ceiling is generally a "flat" reflector (not specular), so I'm not concerned with the reflected light missing the subject. I'm concerned with the *size* of the ceiling light spot, and its location, as those relate to the lighting the subject will receive. Try this with a flood-light: Shine it at a white wall or ceiling in a dark room, and then look at the lighting in the rest of the room. You'll see that it's pretty even throughout, except for a gradual falloff with distance. Assuming a level camera, I'll start tilting the flash forward a bit out beyond 15 feet or so. Especially on the wider settings, it's easy to get the fringes of the *direct* beam on the subject if you tilt the flash too far forward, and this rarely works well -- it's hard light (which you must not have wanted, or you wouldn't be bouncing), and often it catches only the *top half* of the subject, so you get a lot of lighting variation across the picture -- this is not good! So I'm pretty careful about tilting the flash forward. For flash zoom (and wideangle panel), think in terms of the size spot of light you'll be making on the ceiling, and then think in terms of that as an umbrella or light-box size, and try to get it the size you need for the degree of hardness/softness you want in the lighting. Even if none of these things are at all automatic for you yet, I hope the *concept* gets you thinking in the right direction. I pretty much always use the white card (or regret forgetting it) at ranges under 15 feet, anyway. Why do some photographers use a huge white card. Is this really necessary? When would you choose not to pull the card out all the way? This is very helpful - since many would tell me to go out and buy a book - and I wouldn't blame you if you did. The huge white card you're thinking of is *probably* intended to replace the ceiling entirely -- it's intended to be a soft light source still tied to the camera. Of course it's not as big, hence not as soft, as the big light spot on the ceiling, but it's better than direct flash especially for close-up work. Or you *might* be seeing one of the skeletonized cards that lets 80% of the light go up to the ceiling and directs 20% forward -- a fancier version of the fill card, that makes the fill light softer too. The book, by the way, is Hunter & Fuqua, _Light: Science and Magic_ (Focal Press, ISBN 0-240-51796-2). It's a textbook on photographic lighting, not a how-to or cookbook. Once you've got the basics down, applications in the real world come fairly easily. (The devil is in the details, so it's not *that* easy often; but by then you know what you're working towards and what the tools you have to work with are.) I'd also like to reiterate what another poster said yesterday -- Digital is cheap! Try things out. If you see two ways to do things, try both in a test setup and look at how the results differ. Then you'll have a much better understanding of what the difference really is. -- David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/ Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/ Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/ |
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