Sanyo Xacti HD2 Camcorder Review

Peter,
I certainly am not an expert on this camera, but there is nothing to say
that these 2 statements are contradictory. One relates to recording rate,
the other to playback rate. I assume your concern is the apparent
disagreement between 30fps and 60fps? This camera could, for example, make
60 fps recordings, but at playback time "skip" every 2nd frame, playing back
therefore at 30 fps.

Smarty


"Peter Niemayer" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Sanyo Xacti HD2 Camcorder Review
[...]

One question: The tech specs. at
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/produkte/....asp?Xacti=HD2
claim that the HD2 is capable of recording clips at 640x480 in _60_fps.

The manual, downloadable at the same page:
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/support/m..._Kamera_en.pdf
says 30 fps is the maximum and even states at page 78:

* Video clips recorded using model VPC-HD1A or VPC-HD1 with the mode
set to XXX (640 x 480 pixels, 60 fps) will be played back on this
camera at
a resolution of 640 x 480 pixels and frame rate 30 fps.

Either of those two statements must be wrong.

Can you tell us which statement is true?

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

Smarty wrote:
Peter,
I certainly am not an expert on this camera, but there is nothing to say
that these 2 statements are contradictory. One relates to recording rate,
the other to playback rate. I assume your concern is the apparent
disagreement between 30fps and 60fps? This camera could, for example, make
60 fps recordings, but at playback time "skip" every 2nd frame, playing back
therefore at 30 fps.

If the HD2 was able to record 60fps (in whatever mode), the manual would
certainly name that mode - as it names all the others (page 74, page 77 etc.) -
but it doesn't. So from the manual it seems there's no way to record 60fps.

And the fact that it mentions 60fps clips only to say that such recorded by
the HD1(a) cannot be replayed at 60fps is a another indication that this
feature is missing, right?

So while you are formally right that the cited sentence alone would not rule
out 60fps recordings, it seems very likely that this feature is gone.

That's why I ask (somebody who actually own a HD2 already)...

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

Peter,

Also, since the older VPC-HD1A model may have a different file format or
recording format, the newer HD2 may only allow older files to be played back
at this downsampled 30 fps speed by "skipping" every other frame.

Smarty


"Peter Niemayer" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Sanyo Xacti HD2 Camcorder Review
[...]

One question: The tech specs. at
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/produkte/....asp?Xacti=HD2
claim that the HD2 is capable of recording clips at 640x480 in _60_fps.

The manual, downloadable at the same page:
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/support/m..._Kamera_en.pdf
says 30 fps is the maximum and even states at page 78:

* Video clips recorded using model VPC-HD1A or VPC-HD1 with the mode
set to XXX (640 x 480 pixels, 60 fps) will be played back on this
camera at
a resolution of 640 x 480 pixels and frame rate 30 fps.

Either of those two statements must be wrong.

Can you tell us which statement is true?

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

If the contradiction is between the spec saying 60 and the manual saying
otherwise (a max of 30), you have not provided this quote from the manual to
show such a contradiction.

Is there indeed a statement in the manual which explicitly states that the
camera only can record up to 30, and not 60 fps?

Smarty


"Smarty" wrote in message
...
Peter,

Also, since the older VPC-HD1A model may have a different file format or
recording format, the newer HD2 may only allow older files to be played
back at this downsampled 30 fps speed by "skipping" every other frame.

Smarty


"Peter Niemayer" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Sanyo Xacti HD2 Camcorder Review
[...]

One question: The tech specs. at
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/produkte/....asp?Xacti=HD2
claim that the HD2 is capable of recording clips at 640x480 in _60_fps.

The manual, downloadable at the same page:
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/support/m..._Kamera_en.pdf
says 30 fps is the maximum and even states at page 78:

* Video clips recorded using model VPC-HD1A or VPC-HD1 with the mode
set to XXX (640 x 480 pixels, 60 fps) will be played back on this
camera at
a resolution of 640 x 480 pixels and frame rate 30 fps.

Either of those two statements must be wrong.

Can you tell us which statement is true?

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

For whatever it is worth, the only samples from this camera on the web
(mostly from Japan) are all 29.97 fps (mpeg4) files. I would imagine that
60fps samples would be posted if the camera were truly able to record at
that rate.

Smarty


"Smarty" wrote in message
...
If the contradiction is between the spec saying 60 and the manual saying
otherwise (a max of 30), you have not provided this quote from the manual
to show such a contradiction.

Is there indeed a statement in the manual which explicitly states that the
camera only can record up to 30, and not 60 fps?

Smarty


"Smarty" wrote in message
...
Peter,

Also, since the older VPC-HD1A model may have a different file format or
recording format, the newer HD2 may only allow older files to be played
back at this downsampled 30 fps speed by "skipping" every other frame.

Smarty


"Peter Niemayer" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Sanyo Xacti HD2 Camcorder Review
[...]

One question: The tech specs. at
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/produkte/....asp?Xacti=HD2
claim that the HD2 is capable of recording clips at 640x480 in _60_fps.

The manual, downloadable at the same page:
http://www.sanyo-xacti.com/support/m..._Kamera_en.pdf
says 30 fps is the maximum and even states at page 78:

* Video clips recorded using model VPC-HD1A or VPC-HD1 with the mode
set to XXX (640 x 480 pixels, 60 fps) will be played back on this
camera at
a resolution of 640 x 480 pixels and frame rate 30 fps.

Either of those two statements must be wrong.

Can you tell us which statement is true?

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

Smarty wrote:
If the contradiction is between the spec saying 60 and the manual saying
otherwise (a max of 30), you have not provided this quote from the manual to
show such a contradiction.

How would one quote a non-existing statement?

Is there indeed a statement in the manual which explicitly states that the
camera only can record up to 30, and not 60 fps?

No, but there's neither any explanation of how one would enter a 60fps
recording mode.

"Proving" that the 60fps mode is non-existing within the HD only according
to the existing manual is as impossible as proving the non-existence of
any deity from a set of ancient books... :-)

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

PS: Of course I asked this question to the Sanyo-support, too, I'll let
you know if I ever get an answer.

Peter Niemayer wrote in
:

Smarty wrote:
If the contradiction is between the spec saying 60 and the manual
saying otherwise (a max of 30), you have not provided this quote
from the manual to show such a contradiction.

How would one quote a non-existing statement?

Is there indeed a statement in the manual which explicitly states
that the camera only can record up to 30, and not 60 fps?

No, but there's neither any explanation of how one would enter a
60fps recording mode.

"Proving" that the 60fps mode is non-existing within the HD only
according to the existing manual is as impossible as proving the
non-existence of any deity from a set of ancient books... :-)

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

PS: Of course I asked this question to the Sanyo-support, too,
I'll let
you know if I ever get an answer.


Meanwhile, remember that 30 frames per second NTFS records 60 fields
per second. Did you possibly misread a statement regarding *fields*
as *frames*?

Those things do happen :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Gino) ... letters617blochg3251
(replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom")

On Tue, 08 May 2007 12:48:30 -0500, in 'rec.video.desktop',
in article Sanyo Xacti HD2 Camcorder Review,
"Gene E. Bloch" wrote:

Peter Niemayer wrote in
:

Smarty wrote:
If the contradiction is between the spec saying 60 and the manual
saying otherwise (a max of 30), you have not provided this quote
from the manual to show such a contradiction.

How would one quote a non-existing statement?

Is there indeed a statement in the manual which explicitly states
that the camera only can record up to 30, and not 60 fps?

No, but there's neither any explanation of how one would enter a
60fps recording mode.

"Proving" that the 60fps mode is non-existing within the HD only
according to the existing manual is as impossible as proving the
non-existence of any deity from a set of ancient books... :-)

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

PS: Of course I asked this question to the Sanyo-support, too,
I'll let
you know if I ever get an answer.


Meanwhile, remember that 30 frames per second NTFS records 60 fields
per second. Did you possibly misread a statement regarding *fields*
as *frames*?

Those things do happen :-)


Sort of like typing "NTFS" instead of "NTSC".

Those things do happen :-)

--
Frank, Independent Consultant, New York, NY
[Please remove 'nojunkmail.' from address to reply via e-mail.]
Read Frank's thoughts on HDV at http://www.humanvalues.net/hdv/

Peter,

Well, it seems the only question you have been asking from the start but
never explicitly stated is simply whether this HD2 camcorder can or cannot
record 60 fps.

I was initially trying to understand your stated concerns, which you
expressed as what the specs said, versus what the manual said, and their
apparent contradiction.

Obviously you cannot provide a nonexistent statement from the manual. The
fact that is does not exist may be altogether clear to someone like yourself
who apparently has the manual to read, but its' absence is not the slightest
bit obvious to someone like myself who has neither the camera or the manual
but was merely trying to help you.

Smarty


"Peter Niemayer" wrote in message
...
Smarty wrote:
If the contradiction is between the spec saying 60 and the manual saying
otherwise (a max of 30), you have not provided this quote from the manual
to show such a contradiction.

How would one quote a non-existing statement?

Is there indeed a statement in the manual which explicitly states that
the camera only can record up to 30, and not 60 fps?

No, but there's neither any explanation of how one would enter a 60fps
recording mode.

"Proving" that the 60fps mode is non-existing within the HD only according
to the existing manual is as impossible as proving the non-existence of
any deity from a set of ancient books... :-)

Regards,

Peter Niemayer

PS: Of course I asked this question to the Sanyo-support, too, I'll let
you know if I ever get an answer.

"Smarty"

Well, it seems the only question you have been asking from the start but
never explicitly stated is simply whether this HD2 camcorder can or cannot
record 60 fps.

Obviously you cannot provide a nonexistent statement from the manual. The
fact that is does not exist may be altogether clear to someone like
yourself

It's out of my patience...) Couple minutes in Google helped me to find some
docs about this device. Enjoy!-) To simplify the search click Ctrl-F and
then enter 60, you will find it out in several places yourself.

http://www.steves-digicams.com/2006_reviews/hd1a.html

640x480 MPEG-4 movies @ 60fps or 30fps with stereo audio

Video:
HD
[HD-SHQ] 1280 x 720 (30 fps, 9 Mbps)
[HD-HQ] 1280 x 720 (30 fps, 6 Mbps)
SD
[TV-HR] 640 x 480 (60 fps, 6 Mbps)
[TV-SHQ] 640 x 480 (30 fps, 3 Mbps)
[TV-HQ] 640 x 480 (30 fps, 2 Mbps)
[Web-SHQ] 320 x 240 (30 fps)
[Web-HQ] 320 x 240 (15 fps)

What else do you need?

Just D.