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#11
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On 3/8/2015 12:41 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On 2015-03-08 16:20:56 +0000, Savageduck said: On 2015-03-08 10:48:19 +0000, Jeff said: Tony Cooper wrote in : On Fri, 6 Mar 2015 10:58:14 -0800, Savageduck wrote: I recall your fondness for Studebakers, and along with your distain of all things HDR. So I thought you might enjoy this Non-HDR image of a 1932 Studebaker Indy Special Racer. http://adobe.ly/1Mfq417 Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise. I have the same problem in viewing some UK shots of point-to-point racing. They run clockwise. That looks like the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, in which case they would be going counterclockwise. It is not unusual for road courses in the US to go clockwise, though (Infineon, Mid-Ohio). Indianapolis has a road course through the infield. When cars use it they go clockwise and motorcycles go counterclockwise. Correct! It is the "Corkscrew" at Laguna Seca, and it does run anti or counterclockwise (depending on your particular taste). My position was on the hill under the trees, where I could see the vehicles coming directly down the drop off into that radical elevation change starting with the left curve over the top, then the left to right to left switch back, into the sweep at the bottom. I believe Tony thought that the blue & white curb indicated the outside of an oval track running clockwise. Laguna Seca is no oval, and there is more to driving there than only making a left turn. BTW: that elevation change is one of the greatest on any motor race track anywhere. The only comparible track is Bathurst in Australia where there is a climb up Mount Panorama with a subsequent serious descent. Most drivers liken the experience of navigating the "Corkscrew" to driving off a six story building, and having to maintain control. This shot might show a bit more of the direction change. http://adobe.ly/1Gvw9q1 ...and with the luxury of GPS tagging in the file EXIF, my position for many of those shots can be seen. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_20.jpg ...and this shot might show the direction change in the "Corkscrew" a little better. https://db.tt/PONAFPIu Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 == Later.... Ron C -- |
#12
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On 2015-03-08 20:04:47 +0000, Ron C said:
On 3/8/2015 12:41 PM, Savageduck wrote: On 2015-03-08 16:20:56 +0000, Savageduck said: On 2015-03-08 10:48:19 +0000, Jeff said: Tony Cooper wrote in : On Fri, 6 Mar 2015 10:58:14 -0800, Savageduck wrote: I recall your fondness for Studebakers, and along with your distain of all things HDR. So I thought you might enjoy this Non-HDR image of a 1932 Studebaker Indy Special Racer. http://adobe.ly/1Mfq417 Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise. I have the same problem in viewing some UK shots of point-to-point racing. They run clockwise. That looks like the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, in which case they would be going counterclockwise. It is not unusual for road courses in the US to go clockwise, though (Infineon, Mid-Ohio). Indianapolis has a road course through the infield. When cars use it they go clockwise and motorcycles go counterclockwise. Correct! It is the "Corkscrew" at Laguna Seca, and it does run anti or counterclockwise (depending on your particular taste). My position was on the hill under the trees, where I could see the vehicles coming directly down the drop off into that radical elevation change starting with the left curve over the top, then the left to right to left switch back, into the sweep at the bottom. I believe Tony thought that the blue & white curb indicated the outside of an oval track running clockwise. Laguna Seca is no oval, and there is more to driving there than only making a left turn. BTW: that elevation change is one of the greatest on any motor race track anywhere. The only comparible track is Bathurst in Australia where there is a climb up Mount Panorama with a subsequent serious descent. Most drivers liken the experience of navigating the "Corkscrew" to driving off a six story building, and having to maintain control. This shot might show a bit more of the direction change. http://adobe.ly/1Gvw9q1 ...and with the luxury of GPS tagging in the file EXIF, my position for many of those shots can be seen. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_20.jpg ...and this shot might show the direction change in the "Corkscrew" a little better. https://db.tt/PONAFPIu Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 That is one of the better demonstrations of just what that corner is like. Anyway, we might have convinced Tony that Laguna Seca isn't run as a counter-clockwise oval. ;-) Now there is a thought, run Laguna Seca counter-clockwise and climb the "Corkscrew". Going over that crest at speed, into a right turn would be a real thrill. -- Regards, Savageduck |
#13
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On 2015-03-08 20:41:08 +0000, Savageduck said:
On 2015-03-08 20:04:47 +0000, Ron C said: On 3/8/2015 12:41 PM, Savageduck wrote: On 2015-03-08 16:20:56 +0000, Savageduck said: On 2015-03-08 10:48:19 +0000, Jeff said: Tony Cooper wrote in : On Fri, 6 Mar 2015 10:58:14 -0800, Savageduck wrote: I recall your fondness for Studebakers, and along with your distain of all things HDR. So I thought you might enjoy this Non-HDR image of a 1932 Studebaker Indy Special Racer. http://adobe.ly/1Mfq417 Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise. I have the same problem in viewing some UK shots of point-to-point racing. They run clockwise. That looks like the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, in which case they would be going counterclockwise. It is not unusual for road courses in the US to go clockwise, though (Infineon, Mid-Ohio). Indianapolis has a road course through the infield. When cars use it they go clockwise and motorcycles go counterclockwise. Correct! It is the "Corkscrew" at Laguna Seca, and it does run anti or counterclockwise (depending on your particular taste). My position was on the hill under the trees, where I could see the vehicles coming directly down the drop off into that radical elevation change starting with the left curve over the top, then the left to right to left switch back, into the sweep at the bottom. I believe Tony thought that the blue & white curb indicated the outside of an oval track running clockwise. Laguna Seca is no oval, and there is more to driving there than only making a left turn. BTW: that elevation change is one of the greatest on any motor race track anywhere. The only comparible track is Bathurst in Australia where there is a climb up Mount Panorama with a subsequent serious descent. Most drivers liken the experience of navigating the "Corkscrew" to driving off a six story building, and having to maintain control. This shot might show a bit more of the direction change. http://adobe.ly/1Gvw9q1 ...and with the luxury of GPS tagging in the file EXIF, my position for many of those shots can be seen. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_20.jpg ...and this shot might show the direction change in the "Corkscrew" a little better. https://db.tt/PONAFPIu Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 That is one of the better demonstrations of just what that corner is like. Anyway, we might have convinced Tony that Laguna Seca isn't run as a counter-clockwise oval. ;-) Oops! I meant to say; "...isn't run as a clockwise oval." Now there is a thought, run Laguna Seca counter-clockwise and climb the "Corkscrew". Going over that crest at speed, into a right turn would be a real thrill. ....and the same correction applies there, clockwise, not counter-clockwise. I guess my fingers were running with my brain not in gear. -- Regards, Savageduck |
#14
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On Sun, 8 Mar 2015 13:41:08 -0700, Savageduck
wrote: On 2015-03-08 20:04:47 +0000, Ron C said: On 3/8/2015 12:41 PM, Savageduck wrote: On 2015-03-08 16:20:56 +0000, Savageduck said: On 2015-03-08 10:48:19 +0000, Jeff said: Tony Cooper wrote in : On Fri, 6 Mar 2015 10:58:14 -0800, Savageduck wrote: I recall your fondness for Studebakers, and along with your distain of all things HDR. So I thought you might enjoy this Non-HDR image of a 1932 Studebaker Indy Special Racer. http://adobe.ly/1Mfq417 Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise. I have the same problem in viewing some UK shots of point-to-point racing. They run clockwise. That looks like the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, in which case they would be going counterclockwise. It is not unusual for road courses in the US to go clockwise, though (Infineon, Mid-Ohio). Indianapolis has a road course through the infield. When cars use it they go clockwise and motorcycles go counterclockwise. Correct! It is the "Corkscrew" at Laguna Seca, and it does run anti or counterclockwise (depending on your particular taste). My position was on the hill under the trees, where I could see the vehicles coming directly down the drop off into that radical elevation change starting with the left curve over the top, then the left to right to left switch back, into the sweep at the bottom. I believe Tony thought that the blue & white curb indicated the outside of an oval track running clockwise. Laguna Seca is no oval, and there is more to driving there than only making a left turn. BTW: that elevation change is one of the greatest on any motor race track anywhere. The only comparible track is Bathurst in Australia where there is a climb up Mount Panorama with a subsequent serious descent. Most drivers liken the experience of navigating the "Corkscrew" to driving off a six story building, and having to maintain control. This shot might show a bit more of the direction change. http://adobe.ly/1Gvw9q1 ...and with the luxury of GPS tagging in the file EXIF, my position for many of those shots can be seen. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_20.jpg ...and this shot might show the direction change in the "Corkscrew" a little better. https://db.tt/PONAFPIu Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 That is one of the better demonstrations of just what that corner is like. Anyway, we might have convinced Tony that Laguna Seca isn't run as a counter-clockwise oval. ;-) Now there is a thought, run Laguna Seca counter-clockwise and climb the "Corkscrew". Going over that crest at speed, into a right turn would be a real thrill. I wonder how motorcycles would handle it? -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#15
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On 2015-03-08 21:22:46 +0000, Eric Stevens said:
On Sun, 8 Mar 2015 13:41:08 -0700, Savageduck wrote: On 2015-03-08 20:04:47 +0000, Ron C said: On 3/8/2015 12:41 PM, Savageduck wrote: On 2015-03-08 16:20:56 +0000, Savageduck said: On 2015-03-08 10:48:19 +0000, Jeff said: Tony Cooper wrote in : On Fri, 6 Mar 2015 10:58:14 -0800, Savageduck wrote: I recall your fondness for Studebakers, and along with your distain of all things HDR. So I thought you might enjoy this Non-HDR image of a 1932 Studebaker Indy Special Racer. http://adobe.ly/1Mfq417 Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise. I have the same problem in viewing some UK shots of point-to-point racing. They run clockwise. That looks like the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, in which case they would be going counterclockwise. It is not unusual for road courses in the US to go clockwise, though (Infineon, Mid-Ohio). Indianapolis has a road course through the infield. When cars use it they go clockwise and motorcycles go counterclockwise. Correct! It is the "Corkscrew" at Laguna Seca, and it does run anti or counterclockwise (depending on your particular taste). My position was on the hill under the trees, where I could see the vehicles coming directly down the drop off into that radical elevation change starting with the left curve over the top, then the left to right to left switch back, into the sweep at the bottom. I believe Tony thought that the blue & white curb indicated the outside of an oval track running clockwise. Laguna Seca is no oval, and there is more to driving there than only making a left turn. BTW: that elevation change is one of the greatest on any motor race track anywhere. The only comparible track is Bathurst in Australia where there is a climb up Mount Panorama with a subsequent serious descent. Most drivers liken the experience of navigating the "Corkscrew" to driving off a six story building, and having to maintain control. This shot might show a bit more of the direction change. http://adobe.ly/1Gvw9q1 ...and with the luxury of GPS tagging in the file EXIF, my position for many of those shots can be seen. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_20.jpg ...and this shot might show the direction change in the "Corkscrew" a little better. https://db.tt/PONAFPIu Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 That is one of the better demonstrations of just what that corner is like. Anyway, we might have convinced Tony that Laguna Seca isn't run as a counter-clockwise oval. ;-) Now there is a thought, run Laguna Seca counter-clockwise and climb the "Corkscrew". Going over that crest at speed, into a right turn would be a real thrill. I wonder how motorcycles would handle it? They handle it very well. It is quite spectacular to see those bikes making that left-side to right-side lean switch as they negotiate that turn at race speed. Laguna Seca has been one of the stops for the MotoGP World Championship tour. This year big $$$ has spoken and the US MotoGP race will be at the new "Circuit of The Americas" or "COTA" in Austin, Texas. It is still a major stop for the World Super Bike and AMA races. -- Regards, Savageduck |
#16
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On Sun, 08 Mar 2015 16:04:47 -0400, Ron C wrote:
Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 That could be the most annoying video I've ever seen. Bunch of words, bunch of slow motion of essentially nothing at useless camera angles. An on-board camera would have been about the only way to get a feel for it. In fact, here's one of many: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOek5nI6Wac And here's a (very old) video from a bike: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc-dB4DB7dg |
#17
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On Sun, 08 Mar 2015 15:07:42 -0700, Bill W
wrote: On Sun, 08 Mar 2015 16:04:47 -0400, Ron C wrote: Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 That could be the most annoying video I've ever seen. Bunch of words, bunch of slow motion of essentially nothing at useless camera angles. An on-board camera would have been about the only way to get a feel for it. In fact, here's one of many: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOek5nI6Wac And here's a (very old) video from a bike: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc-dB4DB7dg Here's a better one on a bike: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YYQQXuPWMg |
#18
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On 2015-03-08 22:02:36 +0000, Tony Cooper said:
On Sun, 8 Mar 2015 13:41:08 -0700, Savageduck wrote: That looks like the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, in which case they would be going counterclockwise. It is not unusual for road courses in the US to go clockwise, though (Infineon, Mid-Ohio). Indianapolis has a road course through the infield. When cars use it they go clockwise and motorcycles go counterclockwise. That is one of the better demonstrations of just what that corner is like. Anyway, we might have convinced Tony that Laguna Seca isn't run as a counter-clockwise oval. ;-) What do you mean "convinced"? I made no assumption about where, or under what conditions, the shot was made. I merely observed that for a person who grew up thinking Indy cars run counter-clockwise sees that image as somewhat disconcerting. Yup! You didn't make an assumption, you made a decided statement. In your first reply to my OP you seemed to have formulated a strong opinion as to the direction of travel in that image when you stated: "Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise." You pretty much decided that he was driving clockwise without clarifying the actual direction of travel, and that was for you disconcerting. So much so that you made that comment, even though you were wrong. Photographs can be deceptive if points of reference are misinterpreted as you did. Road racing was a foreign sport in my growing-up years. With no television coverage of the sport, it was pretty much unknown to me. While races were held in places like Sebring as early as 1950, it was not a popular form of racing in the US. The first road race I attended was at Road America at Elkhart Lake (Wisconsin) somewhere around 1966 or 1967. Road America goes back to the 1950s, though. Today, with television coverage of everything that goes on, people are aware of things that they don't see in person. That wasn't the case for people of my generation. I have been to road races with my father since I was aware of what was actually happening around me in the early 50's. Particularly at places such as Watkins Glen and Lime Rock. I have been a fan and follower of F1 & Le Mans type races since the early 1960's. I remember talking to a man in 1968 who had tried out for the Olympic track team (he didn't make it) when he was young who had seen a newspaper photograph of Dick Fosbury at the Olympics, who insisted that Fosbury tried to abort his jump, turned by accident, and would be disqualified. It was disconcerting to him to see someone go over the bar with his back down. ....and that has what to do with anything in this thread, other than his refusal to understand what was being shown? -- Regards, Savageduck |
#19
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On 2015-03-08 21:43:15 +0000, Savageduck said:
On 2015-03-08 21:22:46 +0000, Eric Stevens said: On Sun, 8 Mar 2015 13:41:08 -0700, Savageduck wrote: On 2015-03-08 20:04:47 +0000, Ron C said: On 3/8/2015 12:41 PM, Savageduck wrote: On 2015-03-08 16:20:56 +0000, Savageduck said: On 2015-03-08 10:48:19 +0000, Jeff said: Tony Cooper wrote in : On Fri, 6 Mar 2015 10:58:14 -0800, Savageduck wrote: I recall your fondness for Studebakers, and along with your distain of all things HDR. So I thought you might enjoy this Non-HDR image of a 1932 Studebaker Indy Special Racer. http://adobe.ly/1Mfq417 Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise. I have the same problem in viewing some UK shots of point-to-point racing. They run clockwise. That looks like the corkscrew at Laguna Seca, in which case they would be going counterclockwise. It is not unusual for road courses in the US to go clockwise, though (Infineon, Mid-Ohio). Indianapolis has a road course through the infield. When cars use it they go clockwise and motorcycles go counterclockwise. Correct! It is the "Corkscrew" at Laguna Seca, and it does run anti or counterclockwise (depending on your particular taste). My position was on the hill under the trees, where I could see the vehicles coming directly down the drop off into that radical elevation change starting with the left curve over the top, then the left to right to left switch back, into the sweep at the bottom. I believe Tony thought that the blue & white curb indicated the outside of an oval track running clockwise. Laguna Seca is no oval, and there is more to driving there than only making a left turn. BTW: that elevation change is one of the greatest on any motor race track anywhere. The only comparible track is Bathurst in Australia where there is a climb up Mount Panorama with a subsequent serious descent. Most drivers liken the experience of navigating the "Corkscrew" to driving off a six story building, and having to maintain control. This shot might show a bit more of the direction change. http://adobe.ly/1Gvw9q1 ...and with the luxury of GPS tagging in the file EXIF, my position for many of those shots can be seen. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/FileChute/screenshot_20.jpg ...and this shot might show the direction change in the "Corkscrew" a little better. https://db.tt/PONAFPIu Can't remember who posted this link but for what it's worth, here's a youtube clip of that turn: "A Blind Crest and a 3 Story Drop: The Corkscrew at Laguna Seca" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pej4R0DsKKs#t=213 That is one of the better demonstrations of just what that corner is like. Anyway, we might have convinced Tony that Laguna Seca isn't run as a counter-clockwise oval. ;-) Now there is a thought, run Laguna Seca counter-clockwise and climb the "Corkscrew". Going over that crest at speed, into a right turn would be a real thrill. I wonder how motorcycles would handle it? They handle it very well. It is quite spectacular to see those bikes making that left-side to right-side lean switch as they negotiate that turn at race speed. Laguna Seca has been one of the stops for the MotoGP World Championship tour. This year big $$$ has spoken and the US MotoGP race will be at the new "Circuit of The Americas" or "COTA" in Austin, Texas. It is still a major stop for the World Super Bike and AMA races. ....and here is how two very competitive & aggressive MotoGP racers handle Laguna Seca: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JY9mrKR5SkA&spfreload=10 -- Regards, Savageduck |
#20
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For Tony, A Non-HDR Studebaker
On 2015.03.06 15:16 , Tony Cooper wrote:
Nice shot, but disconcerting because he's driving clockwise on a race track. Having grown up in Indianapolis, I know that race cars go around counterclockwise. The Montreal Formula One is run clockwise as are most F1's. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...a_One_circuits -- "Your net worth to the world is usually determined by what remains after your bad habits are subtracted from your good ones." Benjamin Franklin |
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