One upmanship and Canon's claim

On Jul 5, 10:27 pm, Robert Coe wrote:
On Thu, 05 Jul 2007 19:11:03 -0700, RichA wrote:

: On Jul 5, 9:20 pm, "Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)": wrote:

: Rita Ä Berkowitz wrote:
: Bill Funk wrote:
:
: Maintenance costs alone will destroy any aspirations of keeping a
: dSLR for more than 18-months.
:
: I don't understand this at all; experience says otherwise.
: Could you expand on this?
:
: After 18-months of being used properly you generally have maintenance
: issues to contend with. It is worse if you wear out a shutter assembly
: prematurely. I know Canon had a streak of bad shutters that were taking a
: dump just after 15k actuations. It all eats into your useable lifecycle.
:
: Here is my maintenance costs on my DSLRs:
:
: D60 from 2002 to 2007: $0.00
: 10D from 2003 to 2007: $0.00
: 1DII from 2004 to 2007: $0.00
: 30D 2007: $0.00
:
: You mean repair bills?
: Any canned air or wipes for dust removal used?

Are you proposing to capitalize the cost of canned air and dust wipes? You're
not a professional accountant, I hope.

Bob

Why not? Consumables used for business, just like printer inks, blank
DVDs, etc.

"RichA" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Jul 5, 9:20 pm, "Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)"
wrote:
Rita Ä Berkowitz wrote:
Bill Funk wrote:

Maintenance costs alone will destroy any aspirations of keeping a
dSLR for more than 18-months.

I don't understand this at all; experience says otherwise.
Could you expand on this?

After 18-months of being used properly you generally have maintenance
issues
to contend with. It is worse if you wear out a shutter assembly
prematurely. I know Canon had a streak of bad shutters that were taking
a
dump just after 15k actuations. It all eats into your useable
lifecycle.

Here is my maintenance costs on my DSLRs:

D60 from 2002 to 2007: $0.00
10D from 2003 to 2007: $0.00
1DII from 2004 to 2007: $0.00
30D 2007: $0.00

You mean repair bills?
Any canned air or wipes for dust removal used?

It's not advisable to use canned air to clear dust out of a DSLR, especially
on the sensor.

Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:

On Jul 5, 9:20 pm, "Roger N. Clark" wrote
Here is my maintenance costs on my DSLRs:

D60 from 2002 to 2007: $0.00
10D from 2003 to 2007: $0.00
1DII from 2004 to 2007: $0.00
30D 2007: $0.00

You mean repair bills?

Yes,

Any canned air or wipes for dust removal used?

It's not advisable to use canned air to clear dust out of a DSLR, especially
on the sensor.

I did buy pec pads and eclipse, but have yet to use
any--never needed it, even after a safari in Africa.
I DO use canned air. I use an almost depleted
can, and only move the camera over the air stream,
keeping the can in one place.
At the rate I seem to need to clean, I would say
I've used maybe 1/3 of a small can, so $2.00 over
6 years. I've used caned air on optics and
electronic sensors for 30+ years.

Roger

Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:
"RichA" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Jul 5, 9:20 pm, "Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)"
wrote:
Rita Ä Berkowitz wrote:
Bill Funk wrote:

Maintenance costs alone will destroy any aspirations of keeping a
dSLR for more than 18-months.

I don't understand this at all; experience says otherwise.
Could you expand on this?

After 18-months of being used properly you generally have
maintenance issues
to contend with. It is worse if you wear out a shutter assembly
prematurely. I know Canon had a streak of bad shutters that were
taking a
dump just after 15k actuations. It all eats into your useable
lifecycle.

Here is my maintenance costs on my DSLRs:

D60 from 2002 to 2007: $0.00
10D from 2003 to 2007: $0.00
1DII from 2004 to 2007: $0.00
30D 2007: $0.00

You mean repair bills?
Any canned air or wipes for dust removal used?

It's not advisable to use canned air to clear dust out of a DSLR,
especially on the sensor.

The only problem with canned air is when you tip the can, or hold the tip
too close. In that case, it can come out still it its liquid form, which
can freeze things and leave residue. As long as you don't shake/tip the
can...and keep it a reasonable distance from the sensor, you won't have a
problem. I never have. Some people aren't familiar enough with canned air
to know when to expect liquid/freezing effects. Even the most casual of
care will avoid a problem. I usually have a smaller can of it to take on
trips. Be careful with brand new cans, as very little tipping is needed for
liquid to come out.

Interesting side note... I've had a grand total of 3 warts in my life...and
I actually froze each of them off my thumb and the palm of my hand by
dripping the frozen stuff from canned air onto it. You do this by turning
it completely upside down, and just barely pulling the "trigger" until a
drop of the liquid forms at the end of the tube. This way, you can very
carefully control where it goes. Then keep it frozen for a minute or two by
periodically dropping more so it stayes "frosted." It basically kills the
tissue, which then dries up over a period of days...and comes off about like
dried blood from a scrape (that's a nice way of saying, "scab" ). Works
a charm, and is a lot cheaper than having a doctor do the EXACT same thing.
He merely uses a fancier applicator, and perhaps a different chemical that
freezes via quick evaporation. The effect is exactly the same.

Try it...all your warty photography toads!

-Dr. Mark²us Welby M.D.

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

On Jun 30, 6:05 pm, "Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even number
wrote:
Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:
"Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even number wrote in message
...
Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark) wrote:
Mark² wrote:

We agree on that. I'm pretty disgusted, frankly. I'm a Canon guy,
and like their stuff...but they've really screwed up on this one.
At this level, they should either deliver the goods, or don't
deliver at all. What's most frustrating is that they knew in
advance about it (this is known due to their recognition of RG's
review of a pre-production unit, and the later confirmation that
the production units suffer the EXACT same problem Canon was
notified about). When/if there is a fix, I'll likely be somewhere
in Africa where it's
impossible to benefit from it.
Bummer.

Mark,
Have you talked directly to Canon technical support and
told them of your impending trip? Maybe you could send them
your 1D3 and they send you a 1D2 for your Africa trip
(I would suggest that to them if they don't offer it).
One could hope they will have a firmware update that
solves the problem pretty quick.

Roger

Hmmm... That might be worth a try. I took my 1D3 to Irvine today,
but I frankly don't expect a real fix when I pick it up on Monday. I
might just try that...though I'll be gone for 7 weeks. They might
not be too wild about such a long loan. If it doesn't appear that
the camera is fixed (I'll take my laptop and test it), then I may
try your suggestion. That's something I hadn't thought of...

Thanks, Roger.

Mark

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

Oh yeah, have a good and safe trip too.

Thanks. Safety will be an issue, as I'll be carrying major camera gear in
some of the most crime-ridden areas in the world...traveling alone most of
the time. We'll see how it goes...

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

Check the local laws and carry a handgun and a rifle.

On Jul 6, 11:56 pm, "Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)"
wrote:
Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:

On Jul 5, 9:20 pm, "Roger N. Clark" wrote
Here is my maintenance costs on my DSLRs:

D60 from 2002 to 2007: $0.00
10D from 2003 to 2007: $0.00
1DII from 2004 to 2007: $0.00
30D 2007: $0.00

You mean repair bills?

Yes,

Any canned air or wipes for dust removal used?

It's not advisable to use canned air to clear dust out of a DSLR, especially
on the sensor.

I did buy pec pads and eclipse, but have yet to use
any--never needed it, even after a safari in Africa.
I DO use canned air. I use an almost depleted
can, and only move the camera over the air stream,
keeping the can in one place.
At the rate I seem to need to clean, I would say
I've used maybe 1/3 of a small can, so $2.00 over
6 years. I've used caned air on optics and
electronic sensors for 30+ years.

Roger

He's probably referring to those stupid enough to incline or invert
the can, with inevitable consequences.

RichA wrote:
On Jun 30, 6:05 pm, "Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even number
wrote:
Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:
"Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even number wrote in
message ...
Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark) wrote:
Mark² wrote:

We agree on that. I'm pretty disgusted, frankly. I'm a Canon
guy, and like their stuff...but they've really screwed up on
this one. At this level, they should either deliver the goods,
or don't deliver at all. What's most frustrating is that they
knew in advance about it (this is known due to their recognition
of RG's review of a pre-production unit, and the later
confirmation that the production units suffer the EXACT same
problem Canon was notified about). When/if there is a fix, I'll
likely be somewhere in Africa where it's
impossible to benefit from it.
Bummer.

Mark,
Have you talked directly to Canon technical support and
told them of your impending trip? Maybe you could send them
your 1D3 and they send you a 1D2 for your Africa trip
(I would suggest that to them if they don't offer it).
One could hope they will have a firmware update that
solves the problem pretty quick.

Roger

Hmmm... That might be worth a try. I took my 1D3 to Irvine today,
but I frankly don't expect a real fix when I pick it up on Monday.
I might just try that...though I'll be gone for 7 weeks. They
might not be too wild about such a long loan. If it doesn't
appear that the camera is fixed (I'll take my laptop and test it),
then I may try your suggestion. That's something I hadn't thought
of...

Thanks, Roger.

Mark

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

Oh yeah, have a good and safe trip too.

Thanks. Safety will be an issue, as I'll be carrying major camera
gear in some of the most crime-ridden areas in the world...traveling
alone most of the time. We'll see how it goes...

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

Check the local laws and carry a handgun and a rifle.


Carrying a handgun would drop me right into an ex-soviet prison...

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

On Sat, 7 Jul 2007 13:39:50 -0700, "Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even
number wrote:

RichA wrote:
. . .
Check the local laws and carry a handgun and a rifle.


Carrying a handgun would drop me right into an ex-soviet prison...

Check the local laws and carry a handgun and a rifle.

g

On Jul 7, 4:39 pm, "Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even number
wrote:
RichA wrote:
On Jun 30, 6:05 pm, "Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even number
wrote:
Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:
"Mark²" mjmorgan(lowest even number wrote in
...
Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark) wrote:
Mark² wrote:

We agree on that. I'm pretty disgusted, frankly. I'm a Canon
guy, and like their stuff...but they've really screwed up on
this one. At this level, they should either deliver the goods,
or don't deliver at all. What's most frustrating is that they
knew in advance about it (this is known due to their recognition
of RG's review of a pre-production unit, and the later
confirmation that the production units suffer the EXACT same
problem Canon was notified about). When/if there is a fix, I'll
likely be somewhere in Africa where it's
impossible to benefit from it.
Bummer.

Mark,
Have you talked directly to Canon technical support and
told them of your impending trip? Maybe you could send them
your 1D3 and they send you a 1D2 for your Africa trip
(I would suggest that to them if they don't offer it).
One could hope they will have a firmware update that
solves the problem pretty quick.

Roger

Hmmm... That might be worth a try. I took my 1D3 to Irvine today,
but I frankly don't expect a real fix when I pick it up on Monday.
I might just try that...though I'll be gone for 7 weeks. They
might not be too wild about such a long loan. If it doesn't
appear that the camera is fixed (I'll take my laptop and test it),
then I may try your suggestion. That's something I hadn't thought
of...

Thanks, Roger.

Mark

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

Oh yeah, have a good and safe trip too.

Thanks. Safety will be an issue, as I'll be carrying major camera
gear in some of the most crime-ridden areas in the world...traveling
alone most of the time. We'll see how it goes...

--
Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by Mark² at:
www.pbase.com/markuson

Check the local laws and carry a handgun and a rifle.


Carrying a handgun would drop me right into an ex-soviet prison...

That's not fair! Every time I see pictures of Africa, people either
have hunting rifles, or AK-47s.

On Jul 7, 8:13 pm, Rita Ä Berkowitz ritaberk2O04 @aol.com wrote:
RichA wrote:
Oh yeah, have a good and safe trip too.

Thanks. Safety will be an issue, as I'll be carrying major camera
gear in some of the most crime-ridden areas in the world...traveling
alone most of the time. We'll see how it goes...

Check the local laws and carry a handgun and a rifle.

Somehow I suspect Mark is over dramatizing a bit. If Mark carries himself
properly he will have no problems from the local "thugs" and "gangsters"
that fill the wild streets. I know Mark will have a very safe and enjoyable
time.

Rita

I know it's hard to understand if you live in a nice, upscale
community filled with "progressive liberals" who love all mankind, but
at least TRY to stay current.

http://allafrica.com/stories/200707040216.html