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#21
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
nospam wrote:
In article , Neil Gould wrote: There was no difficulty in processing large images (50 meg) because the actual image file was never loaded into RAM. And, there were applications that worked much faster than PhotoShop, which was a "late comer" to digital image editing. actually it wasn't a 'latecomer' at all. before photoshop, what existed were little more than paint programs. they were very primitive and not particularly good. I completely disagree with your notions about this. There were several professional image editing applications on the market long before PhotoShop was created. not on low cost desktop computers, there weren't. "Low cost" is always relative to the application. My $10k desktop computers that I used for image editing in the mid '80s were "low cost" compared to the dedicated workstations that were the only competitive alternatives. What do you think folks used to edit images from high-end drum scanners? really expensive software. photoshop might seem expensive but it's much cheaper than what came before it. Photoshop never seemed expensive to me. I've paid over $5k for some of the image editing software I used back then. Photoshop never was all that good of a program compared to what was available, even some that cost *less* than Photoshop, like the ULead products were more efficient and flexible. That's why Adobe bought them and shelved them. I have PhotoShop for the same reason that folks get ProTools, not because it's all that good. -- best regards, Neil |
#22
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
Photoshop never seemed expensive to me.
Not if you're a professional photographer. But for someone who doesn't earn their living doing graphics work, the price is several times beyond outrageous. Adobe's arrogance doesn't help. The last time I visited its site, I was amazed at how it failed to explain exactly what each of its products did (or didn't) do, and why you might purchase it (or not). When I complained about this, I received pretty much a "we're Adobe -- we don't give a damn" response. |
#23
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
William Sommerwerck wrote:
Photoshop never seemed expensive to me. Not if you're a professional photographer. But for someone who doesn't earn their living doing graphics work, the price is several times beyond outrageous. Adobe's arrogance doesn't help. The last time I visited its site, I was amazed at how it failed to explain exactly what each of its products did (or didn't) do, and why you might purchase it (or not). When I complained about this, I received pretty much a "we're Adobe -- we don't give a damn" response. Since professionals have used many similar products for extended periods of time, Adobe's explanations of what their products do are adequate to provide a basic understanding of them. There are functional details and workflow implications that can not be adequately covered on a website, and sometimes even take a couple of years of in-service use to sort out. -- best regards, Neil |
#24
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
William Sommerwerck wrote:
Photoshop never seemed expensive to me. Not if you're a professional photographer. But for someone who doesn't earn their living doing graphics work, the price is several times beyond outrageous. Adobe's arrogance doesn't help. The last time I visited its site, I was amazed at how it failed to explain exactly what each of its products did (or didn't) do, and why you might purchase it (or not). When I complained about this, I received pretty much a "we're Adobe -- we don't give a damn" response. http://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop/topics.html "CS6 Help PDF (20 MB)" http://helpx.adobe.com/pdf/photoshop_reference.pdf That's better than when I bought Photoshop, in that at the time, the paper copy of manual in the box was the reference. I don't think there was anything that detailed I could look at before hand. Paul |
#25
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
Adobe's arrogance doesn't help. The last time I visited its site,
I was amazed at how it failed to explain exactly what each of its products did (or didn't) do, and why you might purchase it (or not). When I complained about this, I received pretty much a "we're Adobe -- we don't give a damn" response. Since professionals have used many similar products for extended periods of time, Adobe's explanations of what their products do are adequate to provide a basic understanding of them. And what of those who haven't used them? There are hundreds of new potential customers every day who are ignorant of such things. What do you do... ignore them? For example... What is the relationship between Lightroom and Photoshop? Lightroom apparently does some things Photoshop also does. Why would I use one and not the other? Or both? How do these products interact (or not). What are the advantages and tradeoffs? One of the best sales tools is to clearly explain what your product can and can't do, and how its features work with the features of other products in your line. The goal is to get a "I like that -- I'll buy it!" reaction. Adobe doesn't give a damn, probably because it has de facto monopoly on image editing. |
#26
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
"William Sommerwerck" wrote in message news: : Adobe's arrogance doesn't help. The last time I visited its site, I was amazed at how it failed to explain exactly what each of its products did (or didn't) do, and why you might purchase it (or not). When I complained about this, I received pretty much a "we're Adobe -- we don't give a damn" response. Since professionals have used many similar products for extended periods of time, Adobe's explanations of what their products do are adequate to provide a basic understanding of them. And what of those who haven't used them? There are hundreds of new potential customers every day who are ignorant of such things. What do you do... ignore them? For example... What is the relationship between Lightroom and Photoshop? Lightroom apparently does some things Photoshop also does. Why would I use one and not the other? Or both? How do these products interact (or not). What are the advantages and tradeoffs? One of the best sales tools is to clearly explain what your product can and can't do, and how its features work with the features of other products in your line. The goal is to get a "I like that -- I'll buy it!" reaction. Adobe doesn't give a damn, probably because it has de facto monopoly on image editing. I tend to avoid Adobe so as to stay off their expensive "update treadmill" with each application, and to avoid the multitude of expensive applications needed to do relatively simple things (which is why I like Vegas - it alone incorporates several "apps." in one reasonably priced program). And, for those interested in just a good photo editor (but without some of the specialty functions of PhotoShop that most users don't need), there is the free Gimp 2. --DR |
#27
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
Adobe, like most software of this type of application,
offers trial downloads. A comprehensive description of the features of Photoshop would have to be book-like in length. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about an overview of the product's point and purpose. |
#28
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
On 2012-07-29 06:39:53 -0700, Paul said:
William Sommerwerck wrote: Photoshop never seemed expensive to me. Not if you're a professional photographer. But for someone who doesn't earn their living doing graphics work, the price is several times beyond outrageous. Adobe's arrogance doesn't help. The last time I visited its site, I was amazed at how it failed to explain exactly what each of its products did (or didn't) do, and why you might purchase it (or not). When I complained about this, I received pretty much a "we're Adobe -- we don't give a damn" response. http://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop/topics.html "CS6 Help PDF (20 MB)" http://helpx.adobe.com/pdf/photoshop_reference.pdf That's better than when I bought Photoshop, in that at the time, the paper copy of manual in the box was the reference. I don't think there was anything that detailed I could look at before hand. Paul While the trend has been toward the downloadable PDF for most software and many advanced products, with my purchase of CS2 when I upgraded from PS7 I received both a full and comprehensive and detailed manual of some 380 pages, and a free DVD from Kelby Training "Photoshop CS2 Power Session" which detailed all of the new features to be found in that game changing release, and their basic use. Since then however, cost cutting seems to have excluded the inclusion of a manual of any type, and leaving the user to find advice in the Adobe help files, forums, or some of the details found in the Photoshop User, or NAPP Podcasts. -- Regards, Savageduck |
#29
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
Since then however, cost cutting seems to have excluded
the inclusion of a manual of any type, and leaving the user to find advice in the Adobe help files, forums, or some of the details found in the Photoshop User, or NAPP Podcasts. This has, unfortunately, has become pretty much the standard for almost all software. It wouldn't be so bad if the documentation were of consistently high quality -- but it isn't. Regardless, what I was talking was things that are not necessarily answered in a user manual. And if they are, they should be pulled out and displayed on the Website. |
#30
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Has your memory card ever worn out?
On 2012-07-29 09:16:40 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
said: Adobe, like most software of this type of application, offers trial downloads. A comprehensive description of the features of Photoshop would have to be book-like in length. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about an overview of the product's point and purpose. "...an overview of the product's point and purpose"??? If you need that, you have a serious problem which might be beyond any assistance you might find in the photo groups. It has been clear from day one with PS1-7 what the "point and purpose" of Photoshop was. It is and always has been a photo editor, with the "point and purpose" to edit and adjust photographs and image files. Most folks get that. With the move to the Creative Suite its various parts have evolved. The basic concept and features are spelled out on the Adobe web site, If they don't meet, or if they exceed your requirements, don't buy it. You might want to check out a trial demo version. If it doesn't suit you, don't buy it, there might be another solution for you. http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop.html -- Regards, Savageduck |
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