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D3200; time to lose the AA filters?



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 28th 12, 04:04 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Rich[_6_]
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Posts: 1,081
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?

If you look at the D3200, the Sony NEX-7, the D800, you'll see that the
images from them at low ISO are soft. But, the D800E doesn't look soft, at
least based on another comparison I saw.
Compare the D7000 to the D3200. Look at the paperclips in the scene at 200
ISO. Notice how soft the D3200 and the Sony NEX-7 images are? Notice how
sharp the D7000 image is by comparison? Same with the Olympus OM-D, it is
sharp. Resolution is better on the 24mp cameras, but the images are not
sharp-looking.

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikond3200/6

  #2  
Old April 28th 12, 06:22 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
David J Taylor[_16_]
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Posts: 1,116
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?

"Rich" wrote in message
...
If you look at the D3200, the Sony NEX-7, the D800, you'll see that the
images from them at low ISO are soft. But, the D800E doesn't look soft,
at
least based on another comparison I saw.
Compare the D7000 to the D3200. Look at the paperclips in the scene at
200
ISO. Notice how soft the D3200 and the Sony NEX-7 images are? Notice
how
sharp the D7000 image is by comparison? Same with the Olympus OM-D, it
is
sharp. Resolution is better on the 24mp cameras, but the images are not
sharp-looking.

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikond3200/6


On the basis that the 36 MP D800 full-frame camera appears to be near to
the resolution of many existing lenses - to a level where the AA filter
isn't doing a lot, a 24 MP APS-C camera (particularly one which is
designed more for use with lower end lenses) may also be at the point
where the need for an AA filter is marginal.

Do we know for sure that the D3200 /has/ an AA filter?

David

  #3  
Old April 28th 12, 06:38 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
David J Taylor[_16_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,116
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?

"Rich" wrote in message
...
If you look at the D3200, the Sony NEX-7, the D800, you'll see that the
images from them at low ISO are soft. But, the D800E doesn't look soft,
at
least based on another comparison I saw.
Compare the D7000 to the D3200. Look at the paperclips in the scene at
200
ISO. Notice how soft the D3200 and the Sony NEX-7 images are? Notice
how
sharp the D7000 image is by comparison? Same with the Olympus OM-D, it
is
sharp. Resolution is better on the 24mp cameras, but the images are not
sharp-looking.

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikond3200/6


I meant to add - for a fair comparison, should you not be looking at the
images where the objects taken are are the same size, rather than at the
different sizes shown in those comparisons? Oh, and taken with the same
lens? I do see what you mean between the D3200 and NEX-7, though.

David

  #4  
Old April 28th 12, 08:27 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Tim Conway[_2_]
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Posts: 438
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?


"RichA" wrote in message
...
On Apr 28, 1:38 am, "David J Taylor" david-
wrote:
"Rich" wrote in message

...

If you look at the D3200, the Sony NEX-7, the D800, you'll see that the
images from them at low ISO are soft. But, the D800E doesn't look soft,
at
least based on another comparison I saw.
Compare the D7000 to the D3200. Look at the paperclips in the scene at
200
ISO. Notice how soft the D3200 and the Sony NEX-7 images are? Notice
how
sharp the D7000 image is by comparison? Same with the Olympus OM-D, it
is
sharp. Resolution is better on the 24mp cameras, but the images are not
sharp-looking.


http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikond3200/6


I meant to add - for a fair comparison, should you not be looking at the
images where the objects taken are are the same size, rather than at the
different sizes shown in those comparisons? Oh, and taken with the same
lens? I do see what you mean between the D3200 and NEX-7, though.

David


Answering your other question, we don't know if the D3200 has an AA
filter, but I presume it does, since not having one would apparently
raise the cost (if the D800E is any guide, or maybe that's only
because they are making few of them?) something you probably don't
want to do with an entry-level camera. Ideally, you would want to use
the same lens, but the images from the 16mp and 24mp cameras were both
close enough so you can see (you have to look at a few areas in that
scene, try the money) that the 24mp does have a resolution edge, but
the images do not look sharp. As it is, the D800E is now the
undisputed resolution benchmark in DSLRs and mirrorless cameras up to
FF.
I would like to add also the D3200 is noisy compared to the D7000
(check out the blue-green swatch or especially the reds of the Martini
bottle at 800ISO or so, but cleaner than the NEX-7 in blue, and worse
in red. The D3200 reds are very washed out, to the point of being
orang. This holds true for RAW and Jpegs.

Then again, since I'm getting much older and frailer, I might just say the
hell with it all and get a Panasonic Lumix FZ150 and be done with it all as
opposed to lugging around all the lenses and tripods etc....the price you
pay...

  #5  
Old April 29th 12, 01:06 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
nospam
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Posts: 24,165
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?

In article
,
RichA wrote:

Answering your other question, we don't know if the D3200 has an AA
filter, but I presume it does,


it's virtually guaranteed to have one.

since not having one would apparently
raise the cost (if the D800E is any guide, or maybe that's only
because they are making few of them?)


leaving it out entirely would reduce the cost.

what the d800e has is an antialias filter followed by an un-antialias
filter, so that the optical length matches the d800 and the rest of the
camera can remain the same.
  #6  
Old April 29th 12, 02:32 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Savageduck[_3_]
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Posts: 16,487
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?

On 2012-04-28 12:23:55 -0700, "Tim Conway" said:


"RichA" wrote in message
...

On

Apr 28, 1:38 am, "David J Taylor" david-
wrote:
"Rich" wrote in message

...

If you look at the D3200, the Sony NEX-7, the D800, you'll see that the
images from them at low ISO are soft. But, the D800E doesn't look soft,
at
least based on another comparison I saw.
Compare the D7000 to the D3200. Look at the paperclips in the scene at
200
ISO. Notice how soft the D3200 and the Sony NEX-7 images are? Notice
how
sharp the D7000 image is by comparison? Same with the Olympus OM-D, it
is
sharp. Resolution is better on the 24mp cameras, but the images are not
sharp-looking.


http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikond3200/6


I meant to add - for a fair comparison, should you not be looking at the
images where the objects taken are are the same size, rather than at the
different sizes shown in those comparisons? Oh, and taken with the same
lens? I do see what you mean between the D3200 and NEX-7, though.

David


Answering your other question, we don't know if the D3200 has an AA
filter, but I presume it does, since not having one would apparently
raise the cost (if the D800E is any guide, or maybe that's only
because they are making few of them?)


It seems the D3200 has what Nikon calls "an optical low pass" filter.
So I guess it has an AA filter.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #7  
Old April 29th 12, 07:10 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
David J Taylor[_16_]
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Posts: 1,116
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?

"Tim Conway" wrote in message
...
[]
Then again, since I'm getting much older and frailer, I might just say
the hell with it all and get a Panasonic Lumix FZ150 and be done with it
all as opposed to lugging around all the lenses and tripods etc....the
price you pay...


Some of the Panasonic super-zooms are quite good, I've used both their
compact and larger-format variants. I do agree with you about "lugging
around kit", which is why today I mostly use an 18-200 mm zoom with my
compact Nikon DSLR, and get getter lens quality than the Panasonic, and
the advantage of a high-ISO capability. No tripods, and no "etc." I've
also been experimenting with the 5 Mpix camera in the iPad and find that
it can produce reasonable images under good conditions, and acceptable
images indoors.

Cheers,
David

  #8  
Old April 29th 12, 07:25 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
nospam
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Posts: 24,165
Default D3200; time to lose the AA filters?

In article
,
RichA wrote:

since not having one would apparently
raise the cost (if the D800E is any guide, or maybe that's only
because they are making few of them?)


leaving it out entirely would reduce the cost.

what the d800e has is an antialias filter followed by an un-antialias
filter, so that the optical length matches the d800 and the rest of the
camera can remain the same.


Yes, I've read that, so if they decided to eliminate the effect of the
AA filter, they would have to do the same with the D3200.


no they wouldn't have to do the same. the only reason they do that is
because there's two models, one with and one without an aa filter.

if they're only making one model, they don't need to match anything
else. just leave the aa filter out entirely.

however, it's stupid to do that, especially on a low end camera.
 




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