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Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos



 
 
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  #71  
Old October 14th 18, 12:59 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,611
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 00:26:36 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

I know people that do not know how to copy files to/from an usb
stick.

one need not know how to do that for backups to occur.

Ah? And how will that person do the backup? The backup has to go
somewhere. Or are you doing the backup to same disk?

automatic backups, without the user having to do anything special.

Yes yes yes. But you are not saying where are those automatic backups
stored.

either the cloud or an external hard drive. all the user needs to do is
enable backups, which is trivial.

They don't know what an external hard drive is, don't have one, and need
hours of training on how to use it. Similarly with the cloud, but even
worse because their internet is slow, and wifi is also slow.

there is no training. plug it in, click a button. done.


My sister has used Apple computers for many many years. I sent her a
batch of photographs (JPG) on a USB stick and despite seeking help
from her neighbours she never managed to view the photographs. In the
beginning she had not the faintest idea of what to do with the USB
stick. I am sure she is not alone.


that has nothing to do with backups, the topic under discussion.


Of course it has. I was illustrating how helpless untrained people can
be when faced with anything but the most basic of tasks.

however, it does further the point that people incorrectly assume
computers are hard to use, which requires technical skills and
extensive training.


For her, they are. Anything much beyond facebook or email is terra
icognito.

you should also have known that your own sister would not know what to
do with a usb stick. why even send her one in the first place?


Why should I? We have lived in different countries for 60 years.

the easiest solution would have been to use photo sharing, then the
photos would have appeared on her devices without her needing to do
anything special, including an apple tv if she has one.

another option would have been to email or text the photos, or upload
them to a photo sharing site and then send her the links. it's not as
simple or as elegant, but it would have worked.


4GB?
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #72  
Old October 14th 18, 01:11 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Neil[_9_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 521
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

On 10/13/2018 7:51 PM, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 16:34:00 -0400, Tony Cooper
wrote:

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 20:08:22 GMT, "MC" wrote:

nospam wrote:

In article , Alan
Browne wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of
Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one
exception) ----- [1]
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's
pages and numbers were never intended to be replacements for
word/excel. they're designed for average users doing common
tasks, whereas word/excel tries to be everything for everyone,
and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in
features, but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially
to get work done.

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple
stuff, but the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not.
macs include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay
extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

maybe for you, but not for everyone.

I go to a supermarket to buy a loaf of bread. Just because the
supermarket sells thousands of other products does not mean I have to
buy them all so I can get my loaf of bread.

Using Word and Excel is no harder to use for "simple" tasks as it to
use a more basic wp or spreadsheet applications. It is just that Word
and Excel offer a whole lot more should you need, or be inclined to
learn how, to use its more advanced features.

As for FREE? Open Office (and its various guises) is not to shabby
when comparing itself to Microsoft offerings. It certainly out-does
most, if not all, other free "office" based applications when it comes
to features.

MC


I've used (almost) everything from WordStar and VisiCalc to current
apps, and presently use Open Office for both text and spreadsheets.
Now that I'm retired, my needs are simpler, and Open Office does
everything I expect/need.

"Better" is determined by a combination of criteria because "better"
is a subjective user-defined term. In this case, Open Office is the
better app for this user...it does what I need and there is no cost.

For text, I personally rated WordPerfect as the better app, but when
Corel took it over it went downhill faster than Jean-Claude Killy and
crashed like Eddie the Eagle.


That was at least partly due to the damage wreaked by Microsoft
withholding the new revised Visual Basic from Wordperfect for six
months in the days before Corel bought the the wreck. In effect
Microsoft was able to hamstring their only significant competition
while giving themselves a clear run. What happened after was not
entirely Corel's fault.

Those with more extensive experience with Corel know that they've
screwed up every app they acquired. They wrecked Ventura Publisher to
the point where it never worked as well as what they acquired. Ask XARA
what they think of Corel, who pretty much pushed them into non-existence
in a market where they once competed with Adobe. They even sidelined
their own premier app, Draw, because of their insistence on using
non-compliant PostScript code in a pitiful attempt to challenge Adobe's
dominance. I could go on, but there isn't much point, is there?

--
best regards,

Neil
  #73  
Old October 14th 18, 01:22 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Tony Cooper[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 188
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 00:08:51 GMT, "MC" wrote:

open office may be free, but it's also crap.



Whatever.
Hey, everybody, don't bother using Open Office coz its crap. Nospam
says so. No idea why he says so but he does.


Yeah, but if anyone else had said it was "crap", nospam would say
"nope" or "false". Nospam's position is to always take the opposite
position. Facts never factor in.



--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
  #74  
Old October 14th 18, 01:57 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

In article , Tony Cooper
wrote:

Yeah, but if anyone else had said it was "crap", nospam would say
"nope" or "false". Nospam's position is to always take the opposite
position. Facts never factor in.


ad hominem.
  #75  
Old October 14th 18, 01:57 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

I know people that do not know how to copy files to/from an usb
stick.

one need not know how to do that for backups to occur.

Ah? And how will that person do the backup? The backup has to go
somewhere. Or are you doing the backup to same disk?

automatic backups, without the user having to do anything special.

Yes yes yes. But you are not saying where are those automatic backups
stored.

either the cloud or an external hard drive. all the user needs to do
is
enable backups, which is trivial.

They don't know what an external hard drive is, don't have one, and need
hours of training on how to use it. Similarly with the cloud, but even
worse because their internet is slow, and wifi is also slow.

there is no training. plug it in, click a button. done.

My sister has used Apple computers for many many years. I sent her a
batch of photographs (JPG) on a USB stick and despite seeking help
from her neighbours she never managed to view the photographs. In the
beginning she had not the faintest idea of what to do with the USB
stick. I am sure she is not alone.


that has nothing to do with backups, the topic under discussion.


Of course it has.


sending someone a usb stick full of photos has nothing to do with
backups.

I was illustrating how helpless untrained people can
be when faced with anything but the most basic of tasks.


what it illustrates is that computers are too complex for most people.

that continues to improve, but for some reason, many people are
fighting it.

however, it does further the point that people incorrectly assume
computers are hard to use, which requires technical skills and
extensive training.


For her, they are. Anything much beyond facebook or email is terra
icognito.


then you should have used facebook or email.

you chose the wrong method and are blaming her.

you should also have known that your own sister would not know what to
do with a usb stick. why even send her one in the first place?


Why should I? We have lived in different countries for 60 years.


because she's your sister.

it's one thing if you sent it to a random unknown person, but you
should know that your sister would be confused with a usb stick full of
photos.

the easiest solution would have been to use photo sharing, then the
photos would have appeared on her devices without her needing to do
anything special, including an apple tv if she has one.

another option would have been to email or text the photos, or upload
them to a photo sharing site and then send her the links. it's not as
simple or as elegant, but it would have worked.


4GB?


doesn't matter, although texting would not be ideal.
  #76  
Old October 14th 18, 01:57 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

In article , MC
wrote:

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is
photoshop for basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use
it for simple stuff, but the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are
not. macs include a lot of stuff that windows requires
people to pay extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

maybe for you, but not for everyone.

I go to a supermarket to buy a loaf of bread. Just because the
supermarket sells thousands of other products does not mean I have
to buy them all so I can get my loaf of bread.


not a good analogy, but if all you want is bread, then a bakery is a
better choice, likely offering a better selection and also fresher.


Now you are just being pedantic for no other reason other that to get
the last word.


nope. just pointing out the problems with your claims.

Of course bakery bread is better but that is not the
argument. I could quite easily have used "milk", "beans" or "candy" in
my example.


that *is* the argument.

word/excel does more, but it's overkill for what most people want to do.

a product optimized for a given task is a better choice than one that
does everything.

jack of all trades, master of none.

an slr with a bag full of lenses is more capable than a cellphone
camera, but if all you want to do is gram, a cellphone is a better
choice.


And you said my analogy was not good?


that's what i said.

choose the best tool for the job.

Using Word and Excel is no harder to use for "simple" tasks as it to
use a more basic wp or spreadsheet applications. It is just that
Word and Excel offer a whole lot more should you need, or be
inclined to learn how, to use its more advanced features.


false. it's harder for simple tasks. most people don't need the more
advanced features. their presence is not in any way an advantage and
paying for them is a waste of money.



Just because YOU have no idea how to use the MS apps for simple tasks
does not mean it is not easy. I can assure you it is.


ad hominem.

whether i know how to use them is irrelevant.

keep in mind that i've been using them longer than you have, since
word/excel were available for macs before they were for windows.

If senior
citizens (among others), who have never touched a PC in their life, can
get to grips with using the afforesead MS Office apps then it cannot be
that hard. I know so, I used to teach it to them (after showing them
the rudiments of using the PC first of course).


that you need to teach them 'rudiments of using a pc' before even
starting to teach word/excel is exactly why it's the wrong choice.

they would need a lot less handholding using a mac, ipad or chromebook
than with a pc, likely teaching you a few things.

windows is *not* a universal solution to every computing task.

choose the best tool for the job.

word/excel are not the only options out there, despite microsoft
forcing them down people's throats. people who want to use them
certainly can, but they don't have to.


Indeed. Not the only options by far. But they do have the most
comprehensive feature list of any SS or WP software. For that you have
to pay, I'm afraid. Although at about £50 a year (or equivalent
dollars) for the entire Office suite it is hardly going to break the
bank and will never be out of date.


having the most features is not always a benefit, and if the additional
features are not used, that money is wasted.

also, macos can read/write word & excel files with no additional
software required. windows can't. it can also read & write pdf,
without any additional software. no need to buy acrobat.


What you on about? You never did need to buy acrobat to read pdfs and
most apps can now write pdfs as standard.


'most apps' ?

pdf is the imaging model on macos and ios, it's part of the operating
system itself, which means *any* app can read and write pdf, no
additional software required, free or paid. that also means that any
app which can print can print to pdf, also without any additional
software, free or paid.

the free acrobat is just a reader. to write, the paid version is
required. other apps may claim to write pdf, but generally don't do a
very good job.

Also, all commonly used
"alternative" WP and Spereadsheet apps can also read and write word and
excel files as standard.


on macos, that's also built into the operating system.
  #77  
Old October 14th 18, 09:13 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,611
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 20:11:06 -0400, Neil
wrote:

On 10/13/2018 7:51 PM, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 16:34:00 -0400, Tony Cooper
wrote:

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 20:08:22 GMT, "MC" wrote:

nospam wrote:

In article , Alan
Browne wrote:

The most reliable and stable OS I've ever
used is Mac OS. Not perfect put miles above the ****pile of
Windows.

agreed, as are the vast majority of mac apps.

MS Word and Excel are miles above Apple's offerings (with one
exception) ----- [1]
Can't speak about Powerpoint as I've never used Keynote.

i wasn't talking specifically about those, however, apple's
pages and numbers were never intended to be replacements for
word/excel. they're designed for average users doing common
tasks, whereas word/excel tries to be everything for everyone,
and harder to use as a result.

Nothing hard about Word or Excel. They are incredibly rich in
features, but that doesn't mean one needs to use them initially
to get work done.

it's overkill for what most people want to do, as is photoshop for
basic photo editing. sure, someone 'could' use it for simple
stuff, but the average user would be lost.

also, pages, numbers and keynote are free. word & excel are not.
macs include a lot of stuff that windows requires people to pay
extra for.

The statement [1] was about what are the better apps.

Word and Excel hands down.

maybe for you, but not for everyone.

I go to a supermarket to buy a loaf of bread. Just because the
supermarket sells thousands of other products does not mean I have to
buy them all so I can get my loaf of bread.

Using Word and Excel is no harder to use for "simple" tasks as it to
use a more basic wp or spreadsheet applications. It is just that Word
and Excel offer a whole lot more should you need, or be inclined to
learn how, to use its more advanced features.

As for FREE? Open Office (and its various guises) is not to shabby
when comparing itself to Microsoft offerings. It certainly out-does
most, if not all, other free "office" based applications when it comes
to features.

MC

I've used (almost) everything from WordStar and VisiCalc to current
apps, and presently use Open Office for both text and spreadsheets.
Now that I'm retired, my needs are simpler, and Open Office does
everything I expect/need.

"Better" is determined by a combination of criteria because "better"
is a subjective user-defined term. In this case, Open Office is the
better app for this user...it does what I need and there is no cost.

For text, I personally rated WordPerfect as the better app, but when
Corel took it over it went downhill faster than Jean-Claude Killy and
crashed like Eddie the Eagle.


That was at least partly due to the damage wreaked by Microsoft
withholding the new revised Visual Basic from Wordperfect for six
months in the days before Corel bought the the wreck. In effect
Microsoft was able to hamstring their only significant competition
while giving themselves a clear run. What happened after was not
entirely Corel's fault.

Those with more extensive experience with Corel know that they've
screwed up every app they acquired. They wrecked Ventura Publisher to
the point where it never worked as well as what they acquired. Ask XARA
what they think of Corel, who pretty much pushed them into non-existence
in a market where they once competed with Adobe. They even sidelined
their own premier app, Draw, because of their insistence on using
non-compliant PostScript code in a pitiful attempt to challenge Adobe's
dominance. I could go on, but there isn't much point, is there?


That kind of rot started with Michael Cowpland, the founder of the
company. Nevertheless Microsoft did deliberately make things worse for
Wordperfect by withholding the new Visual Basic for six months after
they gave it to all other software houses. This was before Corel
bought Wordperfect.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #78  
Old October 14th 18, 09:18 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,611
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

On Sat, 13 Oct 2018 20:57:16 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

I know people that do not know how to copy files to/from an usb
stick.

one need not know how to do that for backups to occur.

Ah? And how will that person do the backup? The backup has to go
somewhere. Or are you doing the backup to same disk?

automatic backups, without the user having to do anything special.

Yes yes yes. But you are not saying where are those automatic backups
stored.

either the cloud or an external hard drive. all the user needs to do
is
enable backups, which is trivial.

They don't know what an external hard drive is, don't have one, and need
hours of training on how to use it. Similarly with the cloud, but even
worse because their internet is slow, and wifi is also slow.

there is no training. plug it in, click a button. done.

My sister has used Apple computers for many many years. I sent her a
batch of photographs (JPG) on a USB stick and despite seeking help
from her neighbours she never managed to view the photographs. In the
beginning she had not the faintest idea of what to do with the USB
stick. I am sure she is not alone.

that has nothing to do with backups, the topic under discussion.


Of course it has.


sending someone a usb stick full of photos has nothing to do with
backups.

In this case it has everything to do with computer users who cannot
master anything above the basics, whether it is using backups or
something as complicated as plugging in and viewing the contents of a
USB memory stick.

I was illustrating how helpless untrained people can
be when faced with anything but the most basic of tasks.


what it illustrates is that computers are too complex for most people.


Which side of the argument are you on. Please make up your mind.


that continues to improve, but for some reason, many people are
fighting it.

however, it does further the point that people incorrectly assume
computers are hard to use, which requires technical skills and
extensive training.


For her, they are. Anything much beyond facebook or email is terra
icognito.


then you should have used facebook or email.

you chose the wrong method and are blaming her.

you should also have known that your own sister would not know what to
do with a usb stick. why even send her one in the first place?


Why should I? We have lived in different countries for 60 years.


because she's your sister.


Telepathy?

it's one thing if you sent it to a random unknown person, but you
should know that your sister would be confused with a usb stick full of
photos.

the easiest solution would have been to use photo sharing, then the
photos would have appeared on her devices without her needing to do
anything special, including an apple tv if she has one.

another option would have been to email or text the photos, or upload
them to a photo sharing site and then send her the links. it's not as
simple or as elegant, but it would have worked.


4GB?


doesn't matter, although texting would not be ideal.


That's one point we agree upon.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #79  
Old October 14th 18, 02:49 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:


They don't know what an external hard drive is, don't have one, and
need hours of training on how to use it. Similarly with the cloud, but
even worse because their internet is slow, and wifi is also slow.

there is no training. plug it in, click a button. done.

My sister has used Apple computers for many many years. I sent her a
batch of photographs (JPG) on a USB stick and despite seeking help
from her neighbours she never managed to view the photographs. In the
beginning she had not the faintest idea of what to do with the USB
stick. I am sure she is not alone.

that has nothing to do with backups, the topic under discussion.

Of course it has.


sending someone a usb stick full of photos has nothing to do with
backups.


In this case it has everything to do with computer users who cannot
master anything above the basics, whether it is using backups or
something as complicated as plugging in and viewing the contents of a
USB memory stick.


automatic backups and manual manipulation of files on a usb stick are
two very different tasks. one has no user interaction and the other is
completely manual.

I was illustrating how helpless untrained people can
be when faced with anything but the most basic of tasks.


what it illustrates is that computers are too complex for most people.


Which side of the argument are you on. Please make up your mind.


it hasn't changed.
  #80  
Old October 14th 18, 10:21 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,611
Default Windows 10 update wipes out files and photos

On Sun, 14 Oct 2018 09:49:35 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:


They don't know what an external hard drive is, don't have one, and
need hours of training on how to use it. Similarly with the cloud, but
even worse because their internet is slow, and wifi is also slow.

there is no training. plug it in, click a button. done.

My sister has used Apple computers for many many years. I sent her a
batch of photographs (JPG) on a USB stick and despite seeking help
from her neighbours she never managed to view the photographs. In the
beginning she had not the faintest idea of what to do with the USB
stick. I am sure she is not alone.

that has nothing to do with backups, the topic under discussion.

Of course it has.

sending someone a usb stick full of photos has nothing to do with
backups.


In this case it has everything to do with computer users who cannot
master anything above the basics, whether it is using backups or
something as complicated as plugging in and viewing the contents of a
USB memory stick.


automatic backups and manual manipulation of files on a usb stick are
two very different tasks. one has no user interaction and the other is
completely manual.

Viewing files on a USB stick is a simple task compared with setting up
an automatic backup.

I was illustrating how helpless untrained people can
be when faced with anything but the most basic of tasks.

what it illustrates is that computers are too complex for most people.


Which side of the argument are you on. Please make up your mind.


it hasn't changed.


Damn! I hoped the new one was an improvement.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
 




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