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#11
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printing custom signs
On 15/04/2021 17:38, nospam wrote:
it's identical to a question 'arlen' asked a year or two ago, Plonk. Troll. Accuse someone else of being your favorite **** buddy. EOD. Regards, Martin Brown |
#12
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printing custom signs
In article , Ken Hart
wrote: I used a spreadsheet program once to print a sign that was two by three pieces of 8.5x11" paper. I don't remember the exact procedure, but basically I setup the spreadsheet so that the cells were a multiple of 8.5x11. Then I pasted a 'picture' of the text into the top left cell and sized it to cover 2x3 cells. there's nothing like taking the simplest of tasks and turning it into a convoluted process that gives poor results. why not just print the 'picture' from whatever software was used to generate said picture? set the page size to whatever size is needed and then choose print. done. the computer does the rest. the results will still be less than ideal, but not quite as bad as via a spreadsheet. for the record, the proper tool for large signs (or any size, actually) is adobe illustrator. Go back and re-read my first sentence. The sign was large enough that it required six pieces of paper- two by three sheets. i'm well aware of that. now go back and reread what i wrote, specifically this part: set the page size to whatever size is needed and then choose print. done. the computer does the rest. that's *it*. I didn't have a printer large enough for that, so I had to come up with a way to tile the sign. no you didn't. computers are there to do work *for* you. all you need to do is tell it the desired size. the computer does the rest. if the printer is not big enough for a single print, the image will *automatically* be tiled into multiple sheets. cut marks can be added if desired, or full bleed if the printer supports it. http://fashionclassroom.com/images/content/blog/page-tiling-03.png Since this was a one-off event, I wasn't going to invest in any additional software (even freeware). in other words, you deliberately chose to do a ****ty job. hopefully it was not for a client. The results, by the way, were just fine. The spreadsheet software (probably LibreOffice or OpenOffice) scaled the picture perfectly. no it didn't, since a spreadsheet was never designed for image processing. if you think that upsampling an image in a spreadsheet is fine then you don't know what good quality is, let alone high quality. this will be particularly apparent if there was any text in the sign, which there probably was. not only will the upsampling be poor, but there won't be any colour management either. The proper (first) tool for any large signs is a printer that can handle that size sign. nope. a printer is useless without something to send to it. the proper first tool is software to generate the document to be printed. once the document is created, it can then be printed on any printer. those who don't own a large format printer can send it to a print shop. if you sent them a spreadsheet, they'd laugh at you. a lot. |
#13
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printing custom signs
On Thursday, April 15, 2021 at 5:49:01 PM UTC-4, Ken Hart wrote:
... The sign was large enough that it required six pieces of paper- two by three sheets. I didn't have a printer large enough for that, so I had to come up with a way to tile the sign. Since this was a one-off event, I wasn't going to invest in any additional software (even freeware). The results, by the way, were just fine. The spreadsheet software (probably LibreOffice or OpenOffice) scaled the picture perfectly. The proper (first) tool for any large signs is a printer that can handle that size sign. That's one option. Another is to be content with "tiles" printed on 8.5x11" paper. What one can do that's KISS waterproof is to use office store sheet protectors: https://www.staples.com/Avery-Side-Insert-Clear-Sheet-Protectors/product_431492 I'd arrange the sheet protector in rows, stapling them on the binder hole side as its top edge. Then "shingle" the next row above it, with that row's bottom edge overlapping the binder hole edge to hide it (and make for a more continuously appearing image). FWIW, I'd probably use some paperclips on the open side of the sheet protectors, to stop them from billowing open in the wind & better protect from rain. Nice part about this is that to redo the sign with a new printout, its just take off the paperclips, slide the old papers out of each sleeve, & slide the new papers in. -hh |
#14
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printing custom signs
On 20/04/2021 18:37, -hh wrote:
The proper (first) tool for any large signs is a printer that can handle that size sign. That's one option. Another is to be content with "tiles" printed on 8.5x11" paper. What one can do that's KISS waterproof is to use office store sheet protectors: https://www.staples.com/Avery-Side-Insert-Clear-Sheet-Protectors/product_431492 KISS is always a good idea (as the objecdtive is to do it all at home). Thanks for that idea of printing directly to the plastic sheet protectors. Those plastic sheet protectors seem like a good idea for the printed stencil because I can probably laser print directly to them. Then I can cut out the stencil lettering which has a couple benefits over printing to paper. The plastic stencil can be cut directly and the plastic stencil won't get wet from the spray paint like cardboard might and it may even be easier to hold an edge for painting when cut than paper would (especially if I re-use the stencil more than once). The other KISS option is to tape the printed paper to thin cardboard & cut out the thin cardboard stencil using the printed paper as the outline. BTW I decided to hone the color to as close to the official blue & red for USA road signs I can get in a spray can. That official blue & red turned out to be Pantone Blue 294C & Pantone Red 187C according to this reference. https://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/kno-colorspec.htm Microsoft doesn't do Pantone apparently so I set Powerpoint to the closest RGB/HSV colors which for blue is RGB 0 47 108 & for red is RGB 166 25 46 according to this reference. https://www.pantone.com/color-finder/294-C https://www.pantone.com/color-finder/187-C (This exact color match isn't really necessary but it's easily enough done.) I've got the official road sign fonts embedded into PowerPoint (again not needed but useful if at some point I send it off to a professional printer). I'm writing up the full procedure so that we can make it better which as most of you understood it's designed to be as KISS as possible but still fully customizable using only a home printer and basic home materials. -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#15
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printing custom signs
On Thursday, April 22, 2021 at 2:25:50 AM UTC-4, Martin Brown wrote:
On 20/04/2021 18:37, -hh wrote: The proper (first) tool for any large signs is a printer that can handle that size sign. That's one option. Another is to be content with "tiles" printed on 8.5x11" paper. What one can do that's KISS waterproof is to use office store sheet protectors: https://www.staples.com/Avery-Side-Insert-Clear-Sheet-Protectors/product_431492 KISS is always a good idea (as the objecdtive is to do it all at home). Thanks for that idea of printing directly to the plastic sheet protectors. Those plastic sheet protectors seem like a good idea for the printed stencil because I can probably laser print directly to them. Then I can cut out the stencil lettering which has a couple benefits over printing to paper. Ah, I think I misunderstood your intent. I was assuming print onto paper which would be the "end product" that's used on the sign. Each sheet of said paper would then be slid into its own sheet protector on the sign, which would protect the paper from the elements. -hh The plastic stencil can be cut directly and the plastic stencil won't get wet from the spray paint like cardboard might and it may even be easier to hold an edge for painting when cut than paper would (especially if I re-use the stencil more than once). The other KISS option is to tape the printed paper to thin cardboard & cut out the thin cardboard stencil using the printed paper as the outline. BTW I decided to hone the color to as close to the official blue & red for USA road signs I can get in a spray can. That official blue & red turned out to be Pantone Blue 294C & Pantone Red 187C according to this reference. https://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/kno-colorspec.htm Microsoft doesn't do Pantone apparently so I set Powerpoint to the closest RGB/HSV colors which for blue is RGB 0 47 108 & for red is RGB 166 25 46 according to this reference. https://www.pantone.com/color-finder/294-C https://www.pantone.com/color-finder/187-C (This exact color match isn't really necessary but it's easily enough done.) I've got the official road sign fonts embedded into PowerPoint (again not needed but useful if at some point I send it off to a professional printer). I'm writing up the full procedure so that we can make it better which as most of you understood it's designed to be as KISS as possible but still fully customizable using only a home printer and basic home materials. -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#16
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printing custom signs
On 22/04/2021 12:45, -hh wrote:
Ah, I think I misunderstood your intent. I was assuming print onto paper which would be the "end product" that's used on the sign. Each sheet of said paper would then be slid into its own sheet protector on the sign, which would protect the paper from the elements. Actually I misunderstood you because I thought you meant to print on the clear sheets of plastic. Do home laser printers print onto clear sheets? Probably right? Anyway I printed a B&W test signs & while it's good enough for what I need I don't like the Powerpoint to GIF to Posterazor tiles to PDF printing steps. I am testing out a Powerpoint to SVG (via Inkscape) to vector format which if I ever do hand to a printer to make vinyl sheets would have nicer edges. I picked up the road sign fonts from the suggestions shown in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr1UAdiek5w I embedded the fonts in Powerpoint such that when I copied and pasted the entire sign into Inkscape the sign fonts worked great in both programs. In Inkscape I convert to vector format using the two simple steps shown here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoPDzyphwJ4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bObBvmXlHRc The steps to convert Powerpoint to vector format in Inkscape are Copy the entire page in powerpoint (control A & control C) Open Inkscape to "File" - "New from Template" - "Blank Page" Set the "Page size" to the final size of the sign (eg 11x17) If needed set the "Page orientation" & "Page background" Then press the "Create from Template" button to create a blank page Now paste that entire Powerpoint page into Inkscape (control V) Convert to vector format using Inkscape Path Object to Path And then using Inkscape Path Trace Bitmap OK Save There's an Inkscape SVG & a Plain SVG that I'm not sure which to use There's also an Inkscape save to PDF which can use the document's page size Once I have the sign saved either as vector PDF or SVG I can send the SVG to a professional printer (if desired) or open the PDF if I'm home printing. Adobe Acrobat will open the PDF as the full size (in this case 11x17 because I haven't yet figured out how to make a blank Inkscape template of the exact desired sizes). The Acrobat print dialog can tile the output using the Acrobat settings Page Scaling = Tile all pages Tile Scale = 100% Overlap = 1 inch Cut Marks = Western-style I need to figure out how to create an Inkscape blank page template of the right size (eg 17.5 x 11.5) but for now I can fit it into an existing Inkscape blank page 11x17 template for my testing. Starting from the Inkscape step how would you improve on what it outputs? -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#17
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printing custom signs
On 22/04/2021 19:48, Martin Brown wrote:
I need to figure out how to create an Inkscape blank page template of the right size (eg 17.5 x 11.5) but for now I can fit it into an existing Inkscape blank page 11x17 template for my testing. Well that was easy to create a blank sign template of any desired size. https://graphicdesign.stackexchange....lt-canvas-size Start Inkscape 1.0.2-2 on Windows 10 File - New from Template - Blank Page - (pick the closest available) Page size = Ledger/Tabloid - 11x17in (the exact size doesn't matter) Page orientation = vertical (Portrait) Page background = White Opaque Create from Template File - Document Properties - Custom size Orientation = Portrait Width = 11.5 Height = 17.25 File - Save Template Name = blank_sign_portrait_11.5x17.25 Description = Template blank_sign_portrait_11.5x17.25 (You can check the box to "Set as default template" if desired Save You can repeat that process for "blank_sign_landscape_17.25x11.5" and any other sizes you may have (eg 23.75x17.8 landscape & portrait). Results for my tests were (in alphabetical order as listed in Inkscape) blank_sign_landscape_17.25x11.5 blank_sign_landscape_23.75x17.8 blank_sign_portrait_11.5x17.25 blank_sign_portrait_17.8x23.75 Then you can open the template using Inkscape File - New from Template - (choose your blank template) And when you paste in the Powerpoint graphics & text and convert to vector format and then save as a vector PDF you end up with a PDF of the right size which then can be printed using the Adobe Acrobat print tiling menus. Obviously I could have started the edits in Inkscape but given I already created the signs in Powerpoint do you think the process of converting the pasted Powerpoint text (and minor graphics such as the border and separation lines between text) to vector format is good enough for printing? Paste the entire Powerpoint page into Inkscape (control V) Convert to vector format using Inkscape Path Object to Path And then using Inkscape Path Trace Bitmap OK Save Save to a vector PDF from Inkscape This creates a vector PDF of the size needed for Adobe print tiling. I think. -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#18
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printing custom signs
On Thursday, April 22, 2021 at 1:47:59 PM UTC-4, Martin Brown wrote:
On 22/04/2021 12:45, -hh wrote: Ah, I think I misunderstood your intent. I was assuming print onto paper which would be the "end product" that's used on the sign. Each sheet of said paper would then be slid into its own sheet protector on the sign, which would protect the paper from the elements. Actually I misunderstood you because I thought you meant to print on the clear sheets of plastic. Do home laser printers print onto clear sheets? Probably right? I used to print on clear acetate sheets for making overhead transparencies, but its been years (and years). But that material is different than the plastic used on sheet protectors. I'd not risk sending a sheet protector through the heat of a laser printer, as its probably got a high risk of melting & trashing the printing drum(s). My recollection is that ink pen plotters did an okay job printing on acetate; B&W Laser was okay too ... but you needed the "laser printer compatible" acetate sheets for this. Inkjet could look pretty good, but would often have a big smear risk (usually since one was in a hurry) & ample time to dry. Finally, for all of the above, you need to print only on the "rough" side of the clear acetate sheet. This primer offers some tips: https://www.printerland.co.uk/blog/guide-to-printing-transparencies/ The stuff gets relatively expensive pretty quick, plus since they are transparent, you need to make sure you have an appropriate (eg, white) background on the sign. -hh |
#19
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printing custom signs
On 22/04/2021 21:05, -hh wrote:
My recollection is that ink pen plotters did an okay job printing on acetate; B&W Laser was okay too ... but you needed the "laser printer compatible" acetate sheets for this. Thanks for the advice on how to print to the clear acetate sheets at home. I've tested this a few times now where I made pseodo acetate by sticking clear packing tape on both sides of the already printed paper and then trying to cut out the stencil with a sharp knife. The plastic isn't the problem so much as the letters when they get smaller than about an inch are unfortunately not worth the effort to cut out by hand. For whatever reason the lower case letters are even harder to cut. I did learn that Adobe Acrobat is the way to go! There's just no reason for any other tiling program unless you know of one that works even better than does Acrobat. My printer doesn't print to the edge so I need a lot of overlap. Acrobat printer tiling gives me all the user selectable overlap I could ask for and Acrobat adds the cut marks I need to line up the paper cutter. Plus Acrobat outputs a vector graphics PDF whereas Posterazor didn't as far as I could tell (although with stencils rasterization doesn't matter). The vector graphics PDF matters though if I were to send it to a printer. As it is the steps are really simple for the setup -1- I prefer to edit in Powerpoint (that's just me as any editor works) -2- I embed the TTF road fonts using a set on the net everyone seems to use -3- I set the official Pantone colors for road signs to their RGB values The printing steps are similarly really simple -1- I copy & paste Powerpoint into an Inkscape template of the right size -2- I convert to vector (but it seems to already be in vector format!) -3- I save as SVG, eps, PDF & PostScript (which seem to handle vector files) -4- I print from Adobe Acrobat using tiling cut marks & overlap options Bear in mind I'm confused about whether or not Inkscape is even needed because the PDF from PowerPoint already seems to be in vector graphics. As it is, if anyone knows of a better or simpler way that uses only typical home materials let me know as this is already pretty simple but it could always improve. -- Regards, Martin Brown |
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