New Mamiya 645 may influence DSLR prices

deryck lant wrote:

The new 22 Meg Mamiya ZD 645 format DSLR with 36x48mm imager is rumoured
to sell
at around 10K US Dollars:

http://www.letsgodigital.org/html/ev...iya/ZD_en.html

If so it will dampen down the price of the new 1DsMkII Canon and maybe
influence
Nikon as well.


Not sure about the effect on prices for "35mm" format DSLR's, if any.

However, this announcement is very interesting in its presentation of a body
with integrated digital _and_ a same spec back for the 645AF series.

It is odd in that the A/D is 14 bit/chan, saved as 12 bit/chan. While there is
noise in the bottom end, it seems they are throwing out some detail... (How the
1Ds Mk II compares in this regard remains unclear ... to date all we've seen
about it are mentions of processed 24 bit ... 8b/chan no specifics on A/D or
maximum saveable dynamic (that I've seen)).

They don't mention the sync speed, probably the ordinary 1/125 of the other
645AF's (unless a leaf shutter'd lens is used which is not always the case).

Cheers,
Alan



--
-- rec.photo.equipment.35mm user resource:
-- http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.--

Alan Browne wrote:
deryck lant wrote:

The new 22 Meg Mamiya ZD 645 format DSLR with 36x48mm imager is
rumoured
to sell
at around 10K US Dollars:


http://www.letsgodigital.org/html/ev...iya/ZD_en.html

If so it will dampen down the price of the new 1DsMkII Canon and
maybe
influence
Nikon as well.


I am a newbie in the world of photography and still have to get my
first SLR (digi or film) but I read the specs of the Mamiya dSLR and
couldn't help noticing a few things:
- the ISO range is 50-400. Even all "35 mm" dSLRs go upto 1600 atleast
and the mid to high end do 3200.
- The max shutter speed is 1/4000. Again, most mid to high end SLRs are
1/8000.
- Continuous shooting speed is just 1.5fps. Again, this is even slower
than the Canon 300D. I do realise that its 22MP, so file sizes will be
big and therefore write times will be higher but someone buying a
$15-20k camera would expect more. No?
- MLU is assumed. Right?
- the specs say nothing about AF (9-point, 35-point etc etc)

Or maybe there is something about medium format cameras that I just
don't know.

Cheers,

Siddhartha

Alan Browne wrote:
deryck lant wrote:

The new 22 Meg Mamiya ZD 645 format DSLR with 36x48mm imager is
rumoured
to sell
at around 10K US Dollars:


http://www.letsgodigital.org/html/ev...iya/ZD_en.html

If so it will dampen down the price of the new 1DsMkII Canon and
maybe
influence
Nikon as well.


I am a newbie in the world of photography and still have to get my
first SLR (digi or film) but I read the specs of the Mamiya dSLR and
couldn't help noticing a few things:
- the ISO range is 50-400. Even all "35 mm" dSLRs go upto 1600 atleast
and the mid to high end do 3200.
- The max shutter speed is 1/4000. Again, most mid to high end SLRs are
1/8000.
- Continuous shooting speed is just 1.5fps. Again, this is even slower
than the Canon 300D. I do realise that its 22MP, so file sizes will be
big and therefore write times will be higher but someone buying a
$15-20k camera would expect more. No?
- MLU is assumed. Right?
- the specs say nothing about AF (9-point, 35-point etc etc)

Or maybe there is something about medium format cameras that I just
don't know.

Cheers,

Siddhartha

In article . com,
Siddhartha Jain wrote:

- Continuous shooting speed is just 1.5fps. Again, this is even slower
than the Canon 300D. I do realise that its 22MP, so file sizes will be
big and therefore write times will be higher but someone buying a
$15-20k camera would expect more. No?

The main use for high framerates is sports and photojournalism, for which 22
megapixels is possibly overkill.

- the specs say nothing about AF (9-point, 35-point etc etc)

Manual focus is more common in the medium format world. Where autofocus
exists, it's generally fairly basic. Both of my medium format cameras are
manual focus models, and I don't have any direct experience with MF SLRs,
but I would expect this to be a single-point AF.

On 29 Sep 2004 13:21:52 -0700, "Siddhartha Jain"
wrote:

Alan Browne wrote:
deryck lant wrote:

The new 22 Meg Mamiya ZD 645 format DSLR with 36x48mm imager is
rumoured
to sell
at around 10K US Dollars:


http://www.letsgodigital.org/html/ev...iya/ZD_en.html

If so it will dampen down the price of the new 1DsMkII Canon and
maybe
influence
Nikon as well.


I am a newbie in the world of photography and still have to get my
first SLR (digi or film) but I read the specs of the Mamiya dSLR and
couldn't help noticing a few things:
- the ISO range is 50-400. Even all "35 mm" dSLRs go upto 1600 atleast
and the mid to high end do 3200.
- The max shutter speed is 1/4000. Again, most mid to high end SLRs are
1/8000.
- Continuous shooting speed is just 1.5fps. Again, this is even slower
than the Canon 300D. I do realise that its 22MP, so file sizes will be
big and therefore write times will be higher but someone buying a
$15-20k camera would expect more. No?
- MLU is assumed. Right?
- the specs say nothing about AF (9-point, 35-point etc etc)

Or maybe there is something about medium format cameras that I just
don't know.

Cheers,

Siddhartha

Siddhartha,

Please don't take this as an insult, but your last sentence is closest
to the truth. Medium format cameras are far more about resolution and
tonality rather than speed.

For a focal plane shutter, the larger image capture area requires a
larger shutter and heavier shutter leaves, which by merit of basic
physics will be a bit less responsive. I'm not saying its not useful
to some, but when is the last time you acutually needed a 1/8000s
shutter speed.

Again, the ISO range doesn't seem far off the mark, although wedding
shooters might find an 800 ISO option useful on location. Dedicated
portrait and commercial types won't be fazed in the least. Same for
1.5fps.

If you need a more responsive camera, buy one of the many fine DSLR's
with the 35mm, or smaller, chips and be happy. If you have the
bucks/desire for ultimate image quality, at some expense in handling,
and of course dollars, then the Mamiya may be your camera.

While the price is certainly not insignificant, dedicated high end
types have been buying $15k and up digital backs for their medium
format cameras for some time. If you can stand the costs and sometimes
tricky workflow (huge files, tethers, etc.) you will be rewarded with
some eyepopping quality. If Mamiya can get this one out the door for
$10k, it will be a new low price point for this level of system.

If your object doesn't move (studio advertising, graphic arts,
archiving/documentation, etc.), check out some of the images made with
scanning backs. DAGS on Better Light.


David Glos

"Alan Browne" wrote in message
...
deryck lant wrote:

The new 22 Meg Mamiya ZD 645 format DSLR with 36x48mm imager is rumoured
to sell
at around 10K US Dollars:


http://www.letsgodigital.org/html/ev...iya/ZD_en.html

If so it will dampen down the price of the new 1DsMkII Canon and maybe
influence
Nikon as well.


Not sure about the effect on prices for "35mm" format DSLR's, if any.

Sensor prices rely on the economy of scale, if the Mamiya sensor sells in
volume, whether in a Mamiya, Bronica, Hasselblad, the end result is the
prices will come down. If this sensor was split in half we would then have
to 24x36mm sensors. This is a simplistic view, but silicon sort of works
like that...

The new 22 Meg Mamiya ZD 645 format DSLR with 36x48mm imager is rumoured
to sell at around 10K US Dollars:

Gee, that much money would buy me a year off with film and supplies.

Alan Browne wrote:





http://www.letsgodigital.org/html/ev...iya/ZD_en.html

If so it will dampen down the price of the new 1DsMkII Canon and maybe
influence
Nikon as well.


As well as making the images taken with those DSLR's look as pathetic as
35mm images do compared to MF film cameras. Maybe this will shut up some of
the morons posting the "Dslr's are taking over medformat" garbage that
get's posted almost daily now in the film newsgroups. Somehow I doubt it
will.

--

Stacey

Alan Browne wrote:





http://www.letsgodigital.org/html/ev...iya/ZD_en.html

If so it will dampen down the price of the new 1DsMkII Canon and maybe
influence
Nikon as well.


As well as making the images taken with those DSLR's look as pathetic as
35mm images do compared to MF film cameras. Maybe this will shut up some of
the morons posting the "Dslr's are taking over medformat" garbage that
get's posted almost daily now in the film newsgroups. Somehow I doubt it
will.

--

Stacey

Stacey wrote:
As well as making the images taken with those DSLR's look as pathetic as
35mm images do compared to MF film cameras. Maybe this will shut up
some of
the morons posting the "Dslr's are taking over medformat" garbage that
get's posted almost daily now in the film newsgroups.

This new Mamiya *is* a digital SLR, so I expect it will re-enforce
the position.


--
--Bryan