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Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 11th 10, 11:42 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
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Posts: 16,487
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:

Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that
Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors
unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is
insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and
have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be
policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on
the NEX is mind-boggling.


That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of
such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other
than hearsay that is.

Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what
setting do you use?
Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options.

My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the
D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in
Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been
needed with my D300s.
After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning
dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup
& Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s,
even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions.
One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was
in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr.
Giotto's handy "Rockets".



--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #2  
Old October 12th 10, 12:24 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Me
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Posts: 796
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 12/10/2010 11:42 a.m., Savageduck wrote:
On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:

Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that
Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors
unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is
insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and
have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be
policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on
the NEX is mind-boggling.


That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of such
prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other than
hearsay that is.

Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what
setting do you use?
Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options.

My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the
D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in
Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been needed
with my D300s.
After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning
dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup &
Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s,
even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions.
One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was in
the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr.
Giotto's handy "Rockets".



I think he's got a D300. After 3 about years use, I finally had one
speck of dust - just visible at f22 - that wouldn't budge with the
ultrasonic cleaning, and I needed to wet clean it which took me about 3
minutes (I too had plenty of practice with D70).
RichA is a bit nutty. One of the reasons that the Olympus is less
troubled is that relative (to sensor size) distance between the filter
and sensor is greater - also the reason why the original 5d was a huge
pain in the arse for sensor dust - even worse than the D70.
  #3  
Old October 12th 10, 06:24 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
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Posts: 16,487
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 2010-10-11 21:03:32 -0700, Rich said:

On Oct 11, 6:42*pm, Savageduck wrote:
On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:

Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that
Olympus pioneered in 2003. * The idea that cameras with sensors
unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is
insane. *I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and
have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be
policed for it all the time. *That Sony doesn't have a good system on
the NEX is mind-boggling.


That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of
such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other
than hearsay that is.


Prolific? No, I wouldn't say that. Just noticeable from time to
time. But I've been spoiled by the Olympus anti-dust system. As far
as "evidence, reports and hearsay" that terminology sounds like Nikon-
fan paranoia at work so I've said what I'm going to on it.


I just haven't experienced a sensor dust problem with the D300 or
D300s. As I said, the D70 is a different story and at times was a real
PIA.

How does making a remark regarding my satisfaction with one system from
a manufacturer, and my dissatisfaction with the same manufacturer
because of a lack of a function in a similar product, make me a
paranoid "Nikon-fan"?

I am old enough to know a good product from a mediocre one, and the
D300s is a good, well functioning DSLR.
From time to time I am disappointed with a manufacturer I favored in
the past, but I don't whine about it. I buy the product which gives me
the best cost/feature benefit I can afford.
Sometimes I switch horses. With my move from 35mm to digital, I moved
from Pentax and Yashica to Nikon (which I had never owned before)
because of what at the time seemed a reasonable
featuquality:value:cost set.

The same thing applies to my car purchases. My costliest automotive
education was a '75 Olds Cutlass. That damn car has soured me on GW
ever since.
I have owned several Fords, a Datsun, 2 Subarus, a VW, a BMW, a
Chrysler, and 3 Mercedes, and my only regret was that damn Olds, and I
do not consider myself a Ford-Chrysler-Datsun-VW-BMW-Subaru-Mercedes
fan-boy.

You have to be one of the most negative individuals in these groups.
You withdraw whenever you are challenged on any issue. You throw out
snide remarks on brand, or political bias without fear of retaliation
whenever your xenophobic traits are exposed and challenged. You have
yet to make any sort of constructive contribution of any type in these
groups.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #4  
Old October 12th 10, 06:28 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Tony Cooper
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,748
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 22:24:23 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The same thing applies to my car purchases. My costliest automotive
education was a '75 Olds Cutlass. That damn car has soured me on GW
ever since.



That's what you get for buying a knock-off Olds from GW.


--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
  #5  
Old October 12th 10, 07:08 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 2010-10-11 22:28:44 -0700, tony cooper said:

On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 22:24:23 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The same thing applies to my car purchases. My costliest automotive
education was a '75 Olds Cutlass. That damn car has soured me on GW
ever since.



That's what you get for buying a knock-off Olds from GW.


Aaaaaagh!

Phingrr Phawlt!


--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #6  
Old October 12th 10, 08:30 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 27
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 15:42:06 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:

Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that
Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors
unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is
insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and
have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be
policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on
the NEX is mind-boggling.


That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of
such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other
than hearsay that is.

Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what
setting do you use?
Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options.

My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the
D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in
Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been
needed with my D300s.
After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning
dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup
& Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s,
even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions.
One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was
in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr.
Giotto's handy "Rockets".


My Olympus E1 which served me well for 3 years needed a clean once and
a rocket blower did the job. My D300 on the other hand needs a regular
wet clean far more often than my D5000 for example. Although very
careful changing lenses I concluded that this is because the bigger
lenses are more often than not on the D300 so more air is being moved
around in the chamber increasing the chances of dust.

I tend not to bother with small specks as cloning deals with them and
I mostly do not stray into the smaller apertures. From time to time
though with the D300 , say regular use every 4 months the swabs come
out for a bit of open heart surgery.

Its not worth worrying about, its like trying to keep your car clean,
aint gonna happen for ever, and there is no 100% solution on the way
anytime soon. Who really cares. What bothers me more is the cost of
the swabs!!

As for Nikons dust reference system .....yawn....life is too short!

JY
  #7  
Old October 12th 10, 09:15 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 2010-10-12 00:30:22 -0700, said:

On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 15:42:06 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:

Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that
Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors
unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is
insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and
have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be
policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on
the NEX is mind-boggling.


That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of
such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other
than hearsay that is.

Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what
setting do you use?
Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options.

My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the
D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in
Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been
needed with my D300s.
After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning
dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup
& Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s,
even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions.
One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was
in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr.
Giotto's handy "Rockets".


My Olympus E1 which served me well for 3 years needed a clean once and
a rocket blower did the job. My D300 on the other hand needs a regular
wet clean far more often than my D5000 for example. Although very
careful changing lenses I concluded that this is because the bigger
lenses are more often than not on the D300 so more air is being moved
around in the chamber increasing the chances of dust.


I have not needed to wet clean my D300s yet. However I do use a blower
regularly to clear the chamber. I also make sure my lenses are dust
free, by using a blower and/or a brush. If a lens has been mounted for
some time in dusty conditions, if circumstances permit I will clean
around the lens/body junction with a brush, or blower to reduce
contamination potential, before changing lenses. I hope that doesn't
sound too anal.

I am waiting for the day the Eclipse and swabs are going to be needed,
but not just yet,

I tend not to bother with small specks as cloning deals with them and
I mostly do not stray into the smaller apertures. From time to time
though with the D300 , say regular use every 4 months the swabs come
out for a bit of open heart surgery.


Yup! I have my various cleaning tools handy, but even though it isn't
used much now, it is the D70 which requires frequent cleaning. It has
got to the point with the D70, that if I use it after several months of
it sitting idle, there will be dust to be cleaned.

Its not worth worrying about, its like trying to keep your car clean,
aint gonna happen for ever, and there is no 100% solution on the way
anytime soon. Who really cares. What bothers me more is the cost of
the swabs!!


I guess it is like buying insurance. Best to have them, rather than
wishing you had them.

As for Nikons dust reference system .....yawn....life is too short!


Agreed. I tried the dust reference shot deal with the D70. What a joke.
I have no interest in using the current version matched to the sorry
Nikon software.

....but I still like my D300s.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #8  
Old October 12th 10, 04:33 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 2010-10-12 05:55:13 -0700, Bruce said:

Savageduck wrote:
On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:

Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that
Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors
unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is
insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and
have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be
policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on
the NEX is mind-boggling.


That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of
such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other
than hearsay that is.

Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what
setting do you use?
Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options.

My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the
D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in
Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been
needed with my D300s.
After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning
dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup
& Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s,
even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions.
One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was
in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr.
Giotto's handy "Rockets".



My experience also. The D300 and D700 have never given me problems
that the Giottos 'Rocket' cannot handle. (Chinese man very clever to
call his brand "Giottos"!)


Yup! I have three of them. One kept in each of the two bags I have, and
one which keeps vanishing in and around the house.
I have reduced my emergency cleaning kit to one of the neat
Photographic Solutions kits.
http://www.photosol.com/dskit.htm
That is there for my peace of mind, not for any cleaning in the field,
but useful when having that "Damn dust!" moment when back in the
motel/hotel room after a day out tripping the shutter.


My Canon EOS 5D bodies were a different matter and needed constant
attention with PEC pads and brushes. The 5D sensors seemed to have a
static charge which turned them into dust magnets. I had them both
cleaned four times a year and that wasn't often enough. Leaving one
lens (24-105mm f/4L IS) semi-permanently fitted didn't seem to help
either.

However, my worst ever DSLR for dust is the Kodak DCS Pro 14n. If it
wasn't such a sheer delight to use in so many other ways (13.5 MP full
frame, incredible sharpness, outstanding colour rendition) I would
get rid of it because cleaning its sensor is such a thankless task. I
do it myself because even my trusted technician seems unable to do as
good a job as I can. :-(


Yup! There were times it seemed I could use the D70 as one of those
electronic ionizing air purifiers to remove dust and pollen from the
local environment.

However, the boy Rich is right about one thing. The Olympus anti-dust
system is just about unbeatable.


That's nice. I couldn't verify that one way or another, as I have no
experience with any of the Olympus DSLR's.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #9  
Old October 12th 10, 06:56 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 2010-10-12 10:33:57 -0700, RichA said:

On Oct 12, 11:33*am, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2010-10-12 05:55:13 -0700, Bruce said:



Savageduck wrote:
On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:


Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that
Olympus pioneered in 2003. * The idea that cameras with sensors
unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is
insane. *I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and
have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be
policed for it all the time. *That Sony doesn't have a good system

on
the NEX is mind-boggling.


That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of
such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other
than hearsay that is.


Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what
setting do you use?
Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options.


My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the
D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in
Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been
needed with my D300s.
After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning
dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup
& Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s,
even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions.
One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was
in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr

.
Giotto's handy "Rockets".


My experience also. *The D300 and D700 have never given me problems
that the Giottos 'Rocket' cannot handle. *(Chinese man very clever to
call his brand "Giottos"!)


Yup! I have three of them. One kept in each of the two bags I have, and
one which keeps vanishing in and around the house.
I have reduced my emergency cleaning kit to one of the neat
Photographic Solutions kits.
http://www.photosol.com/dskit.htm
That is there for my peace of mind, not for any cleaning in the field,
but useful when having that "Damn dust!" moment when back in the
motel/hotel room after a day out tripping the shutter.



My Canon EOS 5D bodies were a different matter and needed constant
attention with PEC pads and brushes. *The 5D sensors seemed to have a
static charge which turned them into dust magnets. *I had them both
cleaned four times a year and that wasn't often enough. *Leaving one
lens (24-105mm f/4L IS) semi-permanently fitted didn't seem to help
either.


However, my worst ever DSLR for dust is the Kodak DCS Pro 14n. *If it
wasn't such a sheer delight to use in so many other ways (13.5 MP full
frame, incredible sharpness, outstanding colour rendition) *I would
get rid of it because cleaning its sensor is such a thankless task. *

I
do it myself because even my trusted technician seems unable to do as
good a job as I can. *:-(


Yup! There were times it seemed I could use the D70 as one of those
electronic ionizing air purifiers to remove dust and pollen from the
local environment.


You can actually build a better dust brush than the ones for sale.
Get a cheap smoke detector, remove the Americium-241 source from it
(alpha particle emitter) and attach it to a good sensor or lens
brush. The alpha particles ionize the air and cause the static charge
of the dust to be eliminated, allowing for easy removal of it. This
is something like the old Polonium brushes made by various companies
for vinyl records. Of course, brushing is what you'd do after using a
non-contacting blower like the Rocket.


Yup!
I still have a 30 year old one of those brushes buried in with some of
my audio stuff.
....and in my hand I have a still functioning Zerostat gun, also about
30+ years old. The grip is wrapped with 20+ year old masking tape!

Now I wonder how much that would help de-ionizing the D70 chamber???
Might be worth a try.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #10  
Old October 12th 10, 10:14 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default Sensor auto-cleaning, ultrasonic or bust

On 2010-10-12 13:51:16 -0700, John A. said:

On Tue, 12 Oct 2010 10:56:23 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On 2010-10-12 10:33:57 -0700, RichA said:

On Oct 12, 11:33*am, Savageduck
wrote:


Le Snip



Yup! There were times it seemed I could use the D70 as one of those
electronic ionizing air purifiers to remove dust and pollen from the
local environment.

You can actually build a better dust brush than the ones for sale.
Get a cheap smoke detector, remove the Americium-241 source from it
(alpha particle emitter) and attach it to a good sensor or lens
brush. The alpha particles ionize the air and cause the static charge
of the dust to be eliminated, allowing for easy removal of it. This
is something like the old Polonium brushes made by various companies
for vinyl records. Of course, brushing is what you'd do after using a
non-contacting blower like the Rocket.


Yup!
I still have a 30 year old one of those brushes buried in with some of
my audio stuff.
...and in my hand I have a still functioning Zerostat gun, also about
30+ years old. The grip is wrapped with 20+ year old masking tape!

Now I wonder how much that would help de-ionizing the D70 chamber???
Might be worth a try.


What's the worst that could happen?


....er nothing.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

 




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