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#51
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
"Alan Browne" wrote in message ... Neil Harrington wrote: "Alan Browne" wrote in message ... Neil Harrington wrote: Touchy, touchy. The 5D and the A100 are glorified P&S cameras. Any camera with pictograms (flowers, etc) is a P&S. Oh, it's the *pictograms* that make it so?! Then you should call 'em pictogram cameras, not P&S. They are certainly not point-and-shoots. Read my characters: POINT & SHOOT. Set little PICTOGRAM, Real point-and-shoot cameras don't have many little pictograms. Typically one or two. Basically you turn the camera on, point it at something and shoot. Hence the expression "point and shoot." (Duh.) turn off any knowledge of phogoraphy and press-de-button. By your definition ("Any camera with pictograms") a Nikon D2H or D2x is a P&S. I doubt you'll find many who agree with you on this. Thay have pictograms? BWAAAHHHAHAHAHA. What an insult to real photographers paying a high price for features aimed at well heeled P&Sers. (Reminds me of the fellow ....) It comes down to the LACK of *photographic* control on body buttons, dials, levers, switches, etc. Advanced dSLRs like the D2x have lots of those "body buttons, dials, levers, switches, etc." They also have lots of little pictograms that go with the body buttons, dials, levers, switches, etc. so the photographer will know what they do. The little pictograms make a lot more sense than printing out this information in 1.5-point type on the camera. The "pictograms" in question are the exposure mode ones such as little flowers, a background in or out of focus, "sunny" "backlit" etc. These are for people who really do not have a care for what goes into photography. The little flower is a logical pictogram for close-up mode. It takes up less space than printing "CLOSE-UP" on or near the button would, which is important for compact and ultracompact cameras. Since it's a function of the lens rather than the body, it does not appear on any digital SLR as far as I know, and the others you mention rarely if ever appear on any type of camera I've seen. Perhaps you have a camera with no pictograms at all. That sounds like a Baby Brownie. Some day you too may have a camera with lots of body buttons, dials, levers, switches, etc. and you will appreciate the little pictograms. I assure that my Maxxum 9 and 7D do not have any pictorgrams and they If your 7D doesn't have any pictograms it's a very unusual one, since the standard 7D has lots of them. are also replete with all the buttons/switches/levers/dials etc. that you can shale a stick at. I do lie a bit, the 7D has a pictogram for the anti-shake. It should have a lot more pictograms than that! Pictograms for single frame, continuous advance, self-timer and bracketing -- and that's just on the drive mode dial (you can find it under the exposure mode dial). On the back there are more pictograms for display, magnification, delete (see that cute little trash can?), playback, metering mode, etc. I think you need to look at your 7D more carefully. I further assure you that I know what depth of field, shutter speed and fill light do to an image so a pictogram is hardly needed. Despite all the above, the type size is approx 10 to 20 depending on function and quite legible. But I do invite you to get whatever P&S camera you need that might help you in your photography ... with the pictograms. Touchy, touchy. If you didn't have all those pictograms on your 7D you'd be at a serious disadvantage -- but of course it's possible you never use those features or adjustments anyway so it doesn't matter to you. For example, if you never have occasion to switch metering mode between center-weighted, matrix and spot, then I suppose you can just leave that switch in the position it came in out of the box, and never worry about it. Neil |
#52
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
According to Neil Harrington :
"Alan Browne" wrote in message ... [ ... ] The "pictograms" in question are the exposure mode ones such as little flowers, a background in or out of focus, "sunny" "backlit" etc. These are for people who really do not have a care for what goes into photography. The little flower is a logical pictogram for close-up mode. It takes up less space than printing "CLOSE-UP" on or near the button would, which is important for compact and ultracompact cameras. Since it's a function of the lens rather than the body, it does not appear on any digital SLR as far as I know, and the others you mention rarely if ever appear on any type of camera I've seen. Well ... there is a flower pictogram (icon) (along with others) on the "mode dial" to the left of the pentaprism hump on the Nikon D70. But what it does there is adjust the priorities of the automatic exposure control to favor close-ups. There are several other selections on the dial, other than "Auto", "Program", "Shutter-preferred", "Aperture-preferred" and "Manual". The close-up icon seems to change the color balance, among other things. It switches focus area to center focus (which can be overridden). It sets flash to front-curtain sync. The manual does not truly detail exactly what it does, this is (in part) from reading between the lines. Other fancy modes (with icons) offered: ================================================== ==================== Portrait Favors larger apertures Front curtain flash sync Landscape Apparently turns on image enhancement. Sports High shutter speeds. Continuous focus tracking while shutter is half-pressed. Turns *off* built in flash and autofocus assist (not that useful at a distance, anyway.) The continuous tracking mode for the autofocus might be a reason for me to use that mode, rather than diving into a menu to change from one-shot focus to continuous. Night Landscape Turns off flash and autofocus assist. Night Portrait Balances flash for foreground and background illumination. ================================================== ==================== I didn't bother to describe the icons. So -- I might wind up using the "sports" setting from time to time. (to get quick access to the continuous-focus AF) The rest, I can usually accomplish on my own in P, A, S, or M modes. So -- there are serious cameras with the icons to assist non-serious users. One (of many) thing that I wish the D70 had which the D200 does is the lock to keep the mode wheel from turning unless you push the lock to release it. Every so often, I discover that rubbing against my body or my arm has shifted the mode dial from my default "P" setting, used for quick response to sudden opportunities. Program "P" mode turns off the two most offensive auto features (autofocus zone selects the nearest subject in the viewfinder, and pops up the flash even when I don't want it), but gives me "quick grab" capabilities, otherwise. Enjoy, DoN. -- Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- |
#53
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message ... According to Neil Harrington : "Alan Browne" wrote in message ... [ ... ] The "pictograms" in question are the exposure mode ones such as little flowers, a background in or out of focus, "sunny" "backlit" etc. These are for people who really do not have a care for what goes into photography. The little flower is a logical pictogram for close-up mode. It takes up less space than printing "CLOSE-UP" on or near the button would, which is important for compact and ultracompact cameras. Since it's a function of the lens rather than the body, it does not appear on any digital SLR as far as I know, and the others you mention rarely if ever appear on any type of camera I've seen. Well ... there is a flower pictogram (icon) (along with others) on the "mode dial" to the left of the pentaprism hump on the Nikon D70. Right, I see it's on the D70s also. (Slightly red face. :-) ) I think I have too many cameras. But what it does there is adjust the priorities of the automatic exposure control to favor close-ups. There are several other selections on the dial, other than "Auto", "Program", "Shutter-preferred", "Aperture-preferred" and "Manual". I haven't had the D70s long enough to get really familiar with it, and have never even looked into that close-up mode. I knew it does have other icons on that dial that are more or less equivalent in purpose to those on the Maxxum 5D, just didn't remember the flower icon. The close-up icon seems to change the color balance, among other things. It switches focus area to center focus (which can be overridden). It sets flash to front-curtain sync. The manual does not truly detail exactly what it does, this is (in part) from reading between the lines. Other fancy modes (with icons) offered: ================================================== ==================== Portrait Favors larger apertures Front curtain flash sync Landscape Apparently turns on image enhancement. Sports High shutter speeds. Continuous focus tracking while shutter is half-pressed. Turns *off* built in flash and autofocus assist (not that useful at a distance, anyway.) The continuous tracking mode for the autofocus might be a reason for me to use that mode, rather than diving into a menu to change from one-shot focus to continuous. Night Landscape Turns off flash and autofocus assist. Night Portrait Balances flash for foreground and background illumination. ================================================== ==================== Interesting. Most of those I knew or would have assumed, but the Landscape turning on image enhancement is news to me. Using Sports mode as a quickie way to get continuous AF is a good tip. In most cases, I suppose when you want continuous AF you want relatively high shutter speeds too. I didn't bother to describe the icons. So -- I might wind up using the "sports" setting from time to time. (to get quick access to the continuous-focus AF) The rest, I can usually accomplish on my own in P, A, S, or M modes. So -- there are serious cameras with the icons to assist non-serious users. Absolutely! I have no problem at all with icons or the modes they represent. With most compact cameras you can see in the Exif data what the mode does exactly, which I find useful, and in many cases it's just about what I'd want to do anyway. For example, in Pentax compacts going into "Autumn colors" (on a menu) mode changes exposure -1/3 stop and boosts saturation slightly. That works quite well. With Nikon compacts it's easier to go into "Library" mode which turns off the flash and sets the camera in Best Shot Selector mode, than to do those two things separately. And I find BSS to be extremely useful in low light -- almost a "poor man's image stabilization." One (of many) thing that I wish the D70 had which the D200 does is the lock to keep the mode wheel from turning unless you push the lock to release it. Every so often, I discover that rubbing against my body or my arm has shifted the mode dial from my default "P" setting, used for quick response to sudden opportunities. Program "P" mode turns off the two most offensive auto features (autofocus zone selects the nearest subject in the viewfinder, and pops up the flash even when I don't want it), but gives me "quick grab" capabilities, otherwise. I'm not familiar at all with the D200. However, a couple of my older Minolta DiMAGE cameras (7i, 7Hi) do have a lock on the mode dial and I find it annoying. It's a spring-loaded tab on the dial, so it's not always in the same place -- its location depends on what the dial is turned to, so you always have to look to see where it is before you can turn the dial, and though that's hardly a major impediment it often seems awkward to me. The mostly similar A200 doesn't have the lock and I like that a lot better. I see your point about accidentally moving the dial, though. Mostly that's happened to me with cameras that had too-weak detents in the dial, and that was a nuisance. Neil |
#54
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
Neil Harrington wrote:
"Alan Browne" wrote in message The "pictograms" in question are the exposure mode ones such as little flowers, a background in or out of focus, "sunny" "backlit" etc. These are for people who really do not have a care for what goes into photography. The little flower is a logical pictogram for close-up mode. It takes up less space than printing "CLOSE-UP" on or near the button would, which is important for compact and ultracompact cameras. Since it's a function of the lens rather than the body, it does not appear on any digital SLR as far as I know, and the others you mention rarely if ever appear on any type of camera I've seen. Maxxum 5. Several Canon EOS', Nikon 55, others. Perhaps you have a camera with no pictograms at all. That sounds like a Baby Brownie. Some day you too may have a camera with lots of body buttons, dials, levers, switches, etc. and you will appreciate the little pictograms. I assure that my Maxxum 9 and 7D do not have any pictorgrams and they If your 7D doesn't have any pictograms it's a very unusual one, since the standard 7D has lots of them. are also replete with all the buttons/switches/levers/dials etc. that you can shale a stick at. I do lie a bit, the 7D has a pictogram for the anti-shake. It should have a lot more pictograms than that! Pictograms for single frame, continuous advance, self-timer and bracketing -- and that's just on the drive mode dial (you can find it under the exposure mode dial). On the back there are more pictograms for display, magnification, delete (see that cute little trash can?), playback, metering mode, etc. I think you need to look at your 7D more carefully. Metering mode on my 7D is simply "P" "(P)" "A" "S" "M" "1" "2" "3". Where are the pictorgram? Nope. None. The "pictorgrams" being discussed are the exposure mode pictograms to give non photographers instant settings for those situations for which they can't remember a few simple concepts. (As I clarified a couple posts ago). A flower. A face. A figure with sun behind it. Things a photographer doesn't need a pictorgram for; things a photographer simply sets correctly in terms of aperture, speed and fill flash if required. A close up magnifying glass; a trashcan are _functions_ for which those pictos are entirely logical. They have nothing to do with photography but data management, viewing, etc. The pictograms for the transport (bracketting, volley fire, etc.) are likewise modes for how the shutter button reacts. I have no objection to those and, in any case, if you showed them to a non-photgrapher he'd be as puzzled as could be without recourse to the manual. Touchy, touchy. If you didn't have all those pictograms on your 7D you'd be at a serious disadvantage -- but of course it's possible you never use those features or adjustments anyway so it doesn't matter to you. For example, if you never have occasion to switch metering mode between center-weighted, matrix and spot, then I suppose you can just leave that switch in the position it came in out of the box, and never worry about it. See above. You've missed the whole point. Entirely. The metering "weight" switch, like other functional switches, presents functional and useful symbols. It does not present a little rubber ducky or smiling sun to suggest what I should use it for. That is what the "pictograms" on the metering mode dial are for: non thinking photographers with a camera. Glorified P&S' in other words. The A100 has 6 such modes on the exposure mode dial. P&S. Cheers, Alan. -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
#55
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
"Alan Browne" wrote in message ... Neil Harrington wrote: "Alan Browne" wrote in message The "pictograms" in question are the exposure mode ones such as little flowers, a background in or out of focus, "sunny" "backlit" etc. These are for people who really do not have a care for what goes into photography. The little flower is a logical pictogram for close-up mode. It takes up less space than printing "CLOSE-UP" on or near the button would, which is important for compact and ultracompact cameras. Since it's a function of the lens rather than the body, it does not appear on any digital SLR as far as I know, and the others you mention rarely if ever appear on any type of camera I've seen. Maxxum 5. Several Canon EOS', Nikon 55, others. Sorry, I meant any type of digital cameras. My bad, I should have been more specific. Perhaps you have a camera with no pictograms at all. That sounds like a Baby Brownie. Some day you too may have a camera with lots of body buttons, dials, levers, switches, etc. and you will appreciate the little pictograms. I assure that my Maxxum 9 and 7D do not have any pictorgrams and they If your 7D doesn't have any pictograms it's a very unusual one, since the standard 7D has lots of them. are also replete with all the buttons/switches/levers/dials etc. that you can shale a stick at. I do lie a bit, the 7D has a pictogram for the anti-shake. It should have a lot more pictograms than that! Pictograms for single frame, continuous advance, self-timer and bracketing -- and that's just on the drive mode dial (you can find it under the exposure mode dial). On the back there are more pictograms for display, magnification, delete (see that cute little trash can?), playback, metering mode, etc. I think you need to look at your 7D more carefully. Metering mode on my 7D is simply "P" "(P)" "A" "S" "M" "1" "2" "3". Well, those are mostly exposure modes, not metering modes per se. Where are the pictorgram? Nope. None. Check the back of the camera, the switch around the AEL button. Icons (pictograms if you like) for center weighted, matrix, and spot metering. The "pictorgrams" being discussed are the exposure mode pictograms to give non photographers instant settings for those situations for which they can't remember a few simple concepts. (As I clarified a couple posts ago). Well, there are pictograms and pictograms. Now you seem to saying *some* pictograms are contemptible because they're "to give non photographers instant settings for those situations for which they can't remember a few simple concepts," while other pictograms are okay. This is quite different from your original insistence that *any* camera with pictograms must be a "P&S" or at best a "glorified P&S." A flower. A face. A figure with sun behind it. Things a photographer doesn't need a pictorgram for; things a photographer simply sets correctly in terms of aperture, speed and fill flash if required. Those are useful things for photographers as well as those you sniff at as "non photographers." I find those icons useful, and I've been a photography enthusiast for about 55 years. A close up magnifying glass; a trashcan are _functions_ for which those pictos are entirely logical. So? They are still just as much pictograms as a flower or anything else that conveys some operational idea to the user. How is a flower meaning "close-up" or a lady's head meaning "portrait" any less "entirely logical" than those icons you approve of? They have nothing to do with photography but data management, viewing, etc. The pictograms for the transport (bracketting, volley fire, etc.) are likewise modes for how the shutter button reacts. I have no objection to those and, in any case, if you showed them to a non-photgrapher he'd be as puzzled as could be without recourse to the manual. In some cases yes, in other cases certainly not. What else would a trashcan icon convey to any user than what it means? As for those icons you approve of, for example a magnifying glass with a plus sign, how mysterious would this be to a brand-new inexperienced user? And for how long? Just until he read about it in the manual, or even just pressed it during replay. From that point it would be entirely clear to him and it's unlikely he'd ever forget it. So now he's a real, full-fledged photographer instead of a "non photographer"? Touchy, touchy. If you didn't have all those pictograms on your 7D you'd be at a serious disadvantage -- but of course it's possible you never use those features or adjustments anyway so it doesn't matter to you. For example, if you never have occasion to switch metering mode between center-weighted, matrix and spot, then I suppose you can just leave that switch in the position it came in out of the box, and never worry about it. See above. You've missed the whole point. Entirely. The metering "weight" switch, like other functional switches, presents functional and useful symbols. They *all* "present functional and useful symbols." Every icon has something to do with the operation of the camera. It's just that some represent shortcuts that you don't approve of. You apparently believe that doing every step individually and separately implies some higher, more arcane, more prestigious way of going about the business of taking photographs, and this is important to you for its own sake. It does not present a little rubber ducky or smiling sun to suggest what I should use it for. Well, I can't imagine a "little rubber ducky" icon -- maybe that would be for using the camera in an underwater case or something? That is what the "pictograms" on the metering mode dial are for: non thinking photographers with a camera. Glorified P&S' in other words. The A100 has 6 such modes on the exposure mode dial. P&S. Any camera with that dial on it cannot be "point and shoot" in anything remotely like the original, and still current, meaning of that term. Real point-and-shoot cameras don't offer different exposure modes. As soon as you add any sort of user controls over exposure, etc., you have taken the instrument out of the point-and-shoot category. Take a look at a Konica Big Mini, for example. There's a point-and-shoot for you. Icons? A couple, self timer and infinity focus. Exposure mode dial? No. Metering mode dial or switch? No. Any user controls at all over details of exposure or focus? No. Even something with a flower pictogram? No. That's what P&S means, Alan. Something you just point and shoot, no controls at all. Neil |
#56
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
Neil Harrington wrote:
"Alan Browne" wrote in message ... Neil Harrington wrote: "Alan Browne" wrote in message The "pictograms" in question are the exposure mode ones such as little flowers, a background in or out of focus, "sunny" "backlit" etc. These are for people who really do not have a care for what goes into photography. The little flower is a logical pictogram for close-up mode. It takes up less space than printing "CLOSE-UP" on or near the button would, which is important for compact and ultracompact cameras. Since it's a function of the lens rather than the body, it does not appear on any digital SLR as far as I know, and the others you mention rarely if ever appear on any type of camera I've seen. Maxxum 5. Several Canon EOS', Nikon 55, others. Sorry, I meant any type of digital cameras. My bad, I should have been more specific. Perhaps you have a camera with no pictograms at all. That sounds like a Baby Brownie. Some day you too may have a camera with lots of body buttons, dials, levers, switches, etc. and you will appreciate the little pictograms. I assure that my Maxxum 9 and 7D do not have any pictorgrams and they If your 7D doesn't have any pictograms it's a very unusual one, since the standard 7D has lots of them. are also replete with all the buttons/switches/levers/dials etc. that you can shale a stick at. I do lie a bit, the 7D has a pictogram for the anti-shake. It should have a lot more pictograms than that! Pictograms for single frame, continuous advance, self-timer and bracketing -- and that's just on the drive mode dial (you can find it under the exposure mode dial). On the back there are more pictograms for display, magnification, delete (see that cute little trash can?), playback, metering mode, etc. I think you need to look at your 7D more carefully. Metering mode on my 7D is simply "P" "(P)" "A" "S" "M" "1" "2" "3". Well, those are mostly exposure modes, not metering modes per se. Where are the pictorgram? Nope. None. Check the back of the camera, the switch around the AEL button. Icons (pictograms if you like) for center weighted, matrix, and spot metering. The "pictorgrams" being discussed are the exposure mode pictograms to give non photographers instant settings for those situations for which they can't remember a few simple concepts. (As I clarified a couple posts ago). Well, there are pictograms and pictograms. Now you seem to saying *some* pictograms are contemptible because they're "to give non photographers instant settings for those situations for which they can't remember a few simple concepts," while other pictograms are okay. This is quite different from your original insistence that *any* camera with pictograms must be a "P&S" or at best a "glorified P&S." A flower. A face. A figure with sun behind it. Things a photographer doesn't need a pi lens capctorgram for; things a photographer simply sets correctly in terms of aperture, speed and fill flash if required. Those are useful things for photographers as well as those you sniff at as "non photographers." I find those icons useful, and I've been a photography enthusiast for about 55 years. A close up magnifying glass; a trashcan are _functions_ for which those pictos are entirely logical. So? They are still just as much pictograms as a flower or anything else that conveys some operational idea to the user. How is a flower meaning "close-up" or a lady's head meaning "portrait" any less "entirely logical" than those icons you approve of? They have nothing to do with photography but data management, viewing, etc. The pictograms for the transport (bracketting, volley fire, etc.) are likewise modes for how the shutter button reacts. I have no objection to those and, in any case, if you showed them to a non-photgrapher he'd be as puzzled as could be without recourse to the manual. In some cases yes, in other cases certainly not. What else would a trashcan icon convey to any user than what it means? As for those icons you approve of, for example a magnifying glass with a plus sign, how mysterious would this be to a brand-new inexperienced user? And for how long? Just until he read about it in the manual, or even just pressed it during replay. From that point it would be entirely clear to him and it's unlikely he'd ever forget it. So now he's a real, full-fledged photographer instead of a "non photographer"? Touchy, touchy. If you didn't have all those pictograms on your 7D you'd be at a serious disadvantage -- but of course it's possible you never use those features or adjustments anyway so it doesn't matter to you. For example, if you never have occasion to switch metering mode between center-weighted, matrix and spot, then I suppose you can just leave that switch in the position it came in out of the box, and never worry about it. See above. You've missed the whole point. Entirely. The metering "weight" switch, like other functional switches, presents functional and useful symbols. They *all* "present functional and useful symbols." Every icon has something to do with the operation of the camera. It's just that some represent shortcuts that you don't approve of. You apparently believe that doing every step individually and separately implies some higher, more arcane, more prestigious way of going about the business of taking photographs, and this is important to you for its own sake. It does not present a little rubber ducky or smiling sun to suggest what I should use it for. Well, I can't imagine a "little rubber ducky" icon -- maybe that would be for using the camera in an underwater case or something? That is what the "pictograms" on the metering mode dial are for: non thinking photographers with a camera. Glorified P&S' in other words. The A100 has 6 such modes on the exposure mode dial. P&S. Any camera with that dial on it cannot be "point and shoot" in anything remotely like the original, and still current, meaning of that term. Real point-and-shoot cameras don't offer different exposure modes. As soon as you add any sort of user controls over exposure, etc., you have taken the instrument out of the point-and-shoot category. Take a look at a Konica Big Mini, for example. There's a point-and-shoot for you. Icons? A couple, self timer and infinity focus. Exposure mode dial? No. Metering mode dial or switch? No. Any user controls at all over details of exposure or focus? No. Even something with a flower pictogram? No. That's what P&S means, Alan. Something you just point and shoot, no controls at all. There's a reason for the pictograms by the way, which incidentally are not normally called "pictograms" but "icons". The alternative is to make dozens of different shells with writing in Arabic, Hebrew, English, German, Mandarin, Cantonese, Japanese, Sanskrit, Swahili, and every other language on Earth. A picture of a flower is universal. Now, one could put the word "macro" in its place with the assumption that anybody who cares about photography could learn the English word as well as he could learn the icon, but in the real world it's not quite that simple--someone whose written language uses a Roman-derived character set could probably deal with it easily, but someone who doesn't would have as much trouble with it as a typical American would have with, say, Hebrew. Neil -- --John to email, dial "usenet" and validate (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) |
#57
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
Neil Harrington wrote: I'm not familiar at all with the D200. However, a couple of my older Minolta DiMAGE cameras (7i, 7Hi) do have a lock on the mode dial and I find it annoying. It's a spring-loaded tab on the dial, so it's not always in the same place -- its location depends on what the dial is turned to, so you always have to look to see where it is before you can turn the dial, and though that's hardly a major impediment it often seems awkward to me. The mostly similar A200 doesn't have the lock and I like that a lot better. I see your point about accidentally moving the dial, though. Mostly that's happened to me with cameras that had too-weak detents in the dial, and that was a nuisance. The D200 has a little lock button next to the dial, but the dial's function is completely different than that of the D70. The D70 dial sets modes like AUTO, P, A, S, M, and a few programmed modes. The D200 dial sets the multiple shot function for the shutter -- single frame, slow (programmable) multiple mode, fast multiple shot mode, self-timer, and "Mup" (mirror up). The D200 has no AUTO mode, nor does it have any of the programmed modes found on the D70 or D80 (which has the same mode dial as the D70), but it has P, S, A, and M. These are selected by pressing the MODE button next to the ON/OFF/LCD Light switch and rotating the primary function dial. I really have not got a clue why the D70 and the D80 have an AUTO mode. The first thing anyone does with them is to turn it off in order to get rid of the annoying pop-up flash. No one I know uses AUTO. (Or if they did, I would not admit knowing them. :-) ) The chief function of AUTO is to turn the camera into a point and shoot. I have no objection to that, but it seems to be a waste of a lot of good features. |
#58
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
"cjcampbell" wrote in message ups.com... Neil Harrington wrote: I'm not familiar at all with the D200. However, a couple of my older Minolta DiMAGE cameras (7i, 7Hi) do have a lock on the mode dial and I find it annoying. It's a spring-loaded tab on the dial, so it's not always in the same place -- its location depends on what the dial is turned to, so you always have to look to see where it is before you can turn the dial, and though that's hardly a major impediment it often seems awkward to me. The mostly similar A200 doesn't have the lock and I like that a lot better. I see your point about accidentally moving the dial, though. Mostly that's happened to me with cameras that had too-weak detents in the dial, and that was a nuisance. The D200 has a little lock button next to the dial, but the dial's function is completely different than that of the D70. The D70 dial sets modes like AUTO, P, A, S, M, and a few programmed modes. The D200 dial sets the multiple shot function for the shutter -- single frame, slow (programmable) multiple mode, fast multiple shot mode, self-timer, and "Mup" (mirror up). The D200 has no AUTO mode, nor does it have any of the programmed modes found on the D70 or D80 (which has the same mode dial as the D70), but it has P, S, A, and M. These are selected by pressing the MODE button next to the ON/OFF/LCD Light switch and rotating the primary function dial. I really have not got a clue why the D70 and the D80 have an AUTO mode. The first thing anyone does with them is to turn it off in order to get rid of the annoying pop-up flash. No one I know uses AUTO. (Or if they did, I would not admit knowing them. :-) ) The chief function of AUTO is to turn the camera into a point and shoot. I have no objection to that, but it seems to be a waste of a lot of good features. Yes, it's a major annoyance indoors with that pesky flash popping up. I tried Auto mode out of curiosity the first day I got the camera and don't think I've used it since. And I agree that it doesn't seem to have any place on an SLR. But I suppose Nikon put it there because they figure a lot of new SLR users will feel more comfortable having a "green camera" mode such as they are already familiar with on their compact / ultracompact cameras. My first auto-everything SLR (as far as I know, the world's first) was the original Maxxum 7000. A friend of mine was enormously impressed with it and bought one for himself. He still has it, about 20 years later. As far as I know he has never taken it out of P mode -- the closest thing to a "green camera" mode on that camera. I'm about 99% sure he never has. And I'm about 95% sure he never pays the slightest attention to the exposure information provided in the viewfinder. There are, I think, a lot of people who buy an SLR because it's "the best kind of camera," not because they have any real interest in how it works or what its capabilities are. They are the "green camera" folks, and Nikon may as well sell SLRs to them too. If they don't, Canon will. Neil |
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
"J. Clarke" wrote in message ... Neil Harrington wrote: "Alan Browne" wrote in message ... [ . . . ] That is what the "pictograms" on the metering mode dial are for: non thinking photographers with a camera. Glorified P&S' in other words. The A100 has 6 such modes on the exposure mode dial. P&S. Any camera with that dial on it cannot be "point and shoot" in anything remotely like the original, and still current, meaning of that term. Real point-and-shoot cameras don't offer different exposure modes. As soon as you add any sort of user controls over exposure, etc., you have taken the instrument out of the point-and-shoot category. Take a look at a Konica Big Mini, for example. There's a point-and-shoot for you. Icons? A couple, self timer and infinity focus. Exposure mode dial? No. Metering mode dial or switch? No. Any user controls at all over details of exposure or focus? No. Even something with a flower pictogram? No. That's what P&S means, Alan. Something you just point and shoot, no controls at all. There's a reason for the pictograms by the way, which incidentally are not normally called "pictograms" but "icons". Yes. Alan prefers "pictograms," and while non-standard in this usage I don't think it's incorrect. I've used both terms interchangeably here. The alternative is to make dozens of different shells with writing in Arabic, Hebrew, English, German, Mandarin, Cantonese, Japanese, Sanskrit, Swahili, and every other language on Earth. A picture of a flower is universal. Now, one could put the word "macro" in its place with the assumption that anybody who cares about photography could learn the English word as well as he could learn the icon, but in the real world it's not quite that simple--someone whose written language uses a Roman-derived character set could probably deal with it easily, but someone who doesn't would have as much trouble with it as a typical American would have with, say, Hebrew. That's a good point, although those people do have to cope with our language and character set to some extent anyway, since there are words and abbreviations in English on the cameras too. Neil |
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More photo semiliteracy (was Got my Nikon back - still broken.)
Neil Harrington wrote:
Well, there are pictograms and pictograms. Now you seem to saying *some* pictograms are contemptible because they're "to give non photographers instant settings for those situations for which they can't remember a few simple concepts," while other pictograms are okay. This is quite different from your original insistence that *any* camera with pictograms must be a "P&S" or at best a "glorified P&S." I'm bored with this. The original context was exposure aids (what to use when it's sunny/people/backlit). You've cleaved (several meaning here) this to mean what you want. The basic fact: a camera that has pictograms in lieu of exposure modes (Aperture, Speed, etc.) is not for serious photographers. The other symbols you refer to are fine. They are functional meanings, not aids to people with poor memory or skills. Such symbols have been on cameras for decades. Only when P&S infection came to 35mm for things like "sunny"/"people"/"backlit" did some 'lean' 35mm cameras become glorified P&S. Like the Maxxum 5, 5D and A100. Cheers, Alan. -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
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