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#71
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McLeod wrote:
On Sun, 22 May 2005 14:34:28 -0400, Alan Browne wrote: No, they merely need to let the spec (that they've already written) out and not encrypt the data. Then Adobe will hapilly add the plugin to the PS software. They did. That was the software developer kit. And Adobe has. You are repeating an urban legend over and over and can't seem to shake it. Answer the real question then. If they're making it so open to ever developer and his pet iguanna, why encrypt in the first place? -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
#72
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McLeod wrote:
I don't know how many times I have to repeat this. Adobe Camera Raw fully supports NEF. What do I have to do to convince you of this? It's you who seems to be baffled. It's not a big mystery about the less than full featured plug-ins either. If you install Nikon software after Photoshop is already installed the Nikon software installs a plug-in. If you install Photoshop after the Nikon software it doesn't. All you have to do is go to your plug-ins folder on your hard drive and delete it. Then, why, oh why, do they need to encrypt the data? -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
#73
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Jeremy Nixon wrote:
It also cuts the size of my raw files in half, with lossless compression, so that's pretty nice too. And once I do upgrade, CS will save the Camera Raw settings right in the DNG file itself, which is a nice thing as well. I tested 22 files last night with the DNG converter. Compression ranges from 26% to 41%, average 33%. So, I'm reconsidering it for storage logistics. Still haven't made up my mind, however. FWIW: Elements 3.0 cost US$89 (download version) and handles the RAW's up to the 350D (16 bit/color). Cheers, Alan -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
#74
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Barry Pearson wrote:
I worked for many years on a large complex software product, and maintaining and supporting changes to old versions DID hurt those on the latest versions. Development and support effort is always limited. Likewise. However, the nature of plugins is so modular in approach as to make this maintenance trivial. It remains, IMO, simple strategy of Adobe to force upgrades where CS is concerned. In effect, CS is *SO GOOD* that there are a lot of non-upgraded CS' out there and Adobe want these folks to upgrade for the u$ual rea$on$. And it can be galling to fix problems in old versions that have already been fixed in the latest version! I understand the frustration of those who want to stay on older versions. We used to withdraw support except for the last 2 versions. In aerospace [avionics] s/w you're stuck with the customer base and airplanes that serve for 20+ years. You might stop upgrading installed system capability/features, but when bugs are found they MUST be fixed. snp And, as has been said many times here, there is a way out! It is pushing things to say "I want new cameras supported in my old vesion, but don't tell me the answer is DNG". But that's the carrot to the no-CS-upgrade stick and Adobe are willing to trade those $ for higher adoption of DNG. Cheers, Alan -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. |
#75
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Alan Browne wrote:
[snip] In effect, CS is *SO GOOD* that there are a lot of non-upgraded CS' out there and Adobe want these folks to upgrade for the u$ual rea$on$. I agree that CS is good. In fact, had I not bought a digital SLR last year, I might still be on PS 6, which was also pretty good! (I never took PS 7). But, with my digital camera, I shoot (only) Raw, and I have built my CS workflow on Bruce Fraser's book. That concentrates on getting the Raw settings & choices for (say) a whole shoot sorted out, using just Browser & ACR, before getting into true-Photoshop. For anyone with this style of workflow, and the need to handle 100s of Raws at a time, CS2 is far better. The whole Bridge / ACR combination is designed to support this workflow well. (I have no idea whether it is any good with other types of workflow. Frankly, I suspect that someone who feeds Raw images through ACR & Photoshop one-by-one may not be happy). [snip] And, as has been said many times here, there is a way out! It is pushing things to say "I want new cameras supported in my old vesion, but don't tell me the answer is DNG". But that's the carrot to the no-CS-upgrade stick and Adobe are willing to trade those $ for higher adoption of DNG. Yes! And some people may wonder why Adobe are so keen on DNG. It appears to lose revenue, both by making it easier for others to enter the Raw processing business, and by reducing the need to upgrade. I believe DNG has a simple mission: "to accelerate the growth of Raw shooting worldwide". (I don't believe it has any direct revenue objectives). How? By making Raw distinctive, easy, credible, flexible, safe, etc. A question for anyone wondering whether to try DNG is: "do you want easy, flexible, safe, etc?" -- Barry Pearson http://www.barry.pearson.name/photography/ http://www.birdsandanimals.info/ |
#76
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Alan Browne wrote:
FWIW: Elements 3.0 cost US$89 (download version) and handles the RAW's up to the 350D (16 bit/color). Yeah, I know, but Elements isn't suitable for serious photo work, and if I'm going to pay, I'll just upgrade to CS2. The point is, I don't have to upgrade, now or ever. If I see no compelling reason to use CS2 over CS, I can skip this upgrade completely. But, as I read about Photoshop CS2, I am starting to see a couple of pretty good reasons for the upgrade -- curves in Camera Raw, and the new "merge to HDR" function. So, I may not skip this upgrade after all. But, thanks to DNG, I get to decide. (I'd be upgrading the whole suite, since I also use Illustrator and InDesign.) -- Jeremy | |
#77
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#78
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McLeod wrote:
No, only pointing out that most of the camera manufacturers do it. According to the article and interview by dpreview of Dave Coffin of dcraw Canon also encrypts and compresses their raw files and it seems to change with every new camera they release as well. Except that Canon has given them permission to decrypt them. -- Jeremy | |
#79
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#80
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In article .com,
Barry Pearson wrote: Paul Furman wrote: Alan Browne wrote: [snip] However, I just did a test of 22 files in a directory. The DNG's are 26% to 41% (33% avg) smaller than the K-M RAW files. So, I'll be giving this a re-think respecting backup/archive logistics. Watch out for lost EXIF data though. : - ( Yes, that is a problem. My experience is that the DNG Converter handles all the EXIF stuff in the same way that ACR does. For example, for my camera, I believe both ACR and the DNG Converter don't copy across the lens model. (Just the focal length). This appears to mean that anyone who is happy with ACR should also be happy with DNG. It is my understanding that this changed significantly with DNG/ACR 3.x With DNG 2, you either lost all that manufacturer-private data, or you chose to embed the entire original RAW file in the DNG, approximately doubling the size of the file. With DNG 3.x you can apparently just embed the MakerNote tag, which is where almost all the extra metadata can be found. You still can't get at the fields within it easily, but you haven't lost the data. If, at some time, EXIF gets extended to have a field for identifying the lens in use, or any of the other missing pieces of information, it would in principle be possible to re-process a DNG 3.x file (the DNG converter accepts DNG files as input ...), extract the values, and create a new DNG with the EXIF fields filled in. |
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