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#31
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On 21 May 2005 05:15:29 -0700, "Barry Pearson"
wrote: Has Adobe itself made a statement on this subject? I have seen a straightforward factual explanation from Thomas Knoll. But I thought he was not an Adobe employee. (I wonder if an urban legend is developing about Adobe's part in the debate?) I thought the SDK didn't give access to the sensor data? If so, it is not suitable for alternative Raw processors. I don't think Adobe's competitors take it any more seriously than Adobe do. (Actually, I think Nikon won't supply it to individuals writing Raw-processing software). http://photoshopnews.com/?p=226 Nikon Advisory - For Immediate Release The Nikon D2X professional Digital Single Lens Reflex camera has received widely positive acclaim for its overall performance and image processing quality. Recently, speculative statements which appear to be based on misunderstandings and misinformation about the D2X camera’s “encryption” of certain white balance data have propagated on the internet. The purpose of this advisory is to clarify this matter with facts and explanations. The Nikon D2X is capable of producing high quality images that can be saved in a variety of file formats, including the proprietary Nikon Electronic Format (NEF), standard TIFF and several levels of standard JPEG compressed files. The NEF, a Nikon proprietary raw file design, was introduced with the Nikon D1 Camera and Nikon’s original Capture software. The combination of Nikon camera, in-camera image processing, NEF file format and in-computer image processing with original Nikon Capture software was developed as a system that faithfully saved image files that represent the camera settings made manually or automatically by the photographer at the time a picture was taken. Nikon’s preservation of its unique technology in the NEF file is employed as an action that protects the uniqueness of the file. At the same time, Nikon makes available a software developer kit (SDK) that, when implemented appropriately, enables a wide range of NEF performance, including white balance, for Nikon photographers and their productive use of the NEF file. Since the inception of the system, Nikon has always provided photographers with choices about how they might use the system’s performance and enjoy high quality images. Nikon’s choices for opening and processing NEF files have been and continue to include: Nikon Capture software Plug-in for Adobe’s Photoshop Nikon PictureProject software Nikon View software Availability of Nikon Software Developer Kit (SDK) and the software that has been developed using the SDK Through use of the Nikon Software Developer Kit, authorized developers can produce software by applying creative concepts to their implementation and adding capabilities to open Nikon’s NEF file and use NEF’s embedded Instructions and Nikon’s Libraries. Nikon photographers reap benefits from independent developers’ approaches, because it allows the photographer to open and process their NEF images. After a developer’s software is created using the Nikon SDK, a NEF file can be opened, edited in either TIFF or JPEG format, and then saved in formats available in the developers’ software. This process has been available since the first Nikon SDK for NEF. With each introduction of a new Nikon digital Single Lens Reflex model, Nikon updates the available SDK selection to provide new information; this is the situation with the D2X, D2Hs and D50 models. As stated above, application for the Nikon SDK is possible for bona fide software companies that send Nikon a written application for the SDK. Once approved, the SDK is provided to the developer at no charge and they are authorized to use it. Nikon has provided its confidential SDK software to many software developers. With the Nikon SDK, developers may design excellent and creative compatibility between the NEF and their software, all without compromising the integrity of the NEF’s original concept, and ensuring that work done by the photographer during the picture taking process can be incorporated into the rendering of the image. The trilogy of performance, from Camera-to-NEF-to-Capture, has evolved though several generations of Nikon Digital SLR models, improving along the way. As a proprietary format, Nikon secures NEF’s structure and processing through various technologies. Securing this structure is intended for the photographer’s benefit, and dedicated to ensuring faithful reproduction of the photographer’s creative intentions through consistent performance and rendition of the images. Discussions propagated on the internet suggesting otherwise are misinformed about the unique structure of NEF. Nikon’s Camera System, NEF and Capture software are a tightly knit system, and they are all developed through the cooperative efforts of Nikon’s design teams, and this collaboration results in achieving the highest image quality. Nikon strives to provide photographers with excellent picture taking performance, compatible Nikon in-system image processing performance and by extension, compatibility with additional software developers’ products, with the ultimate goal of delivering a high level of integrity for a photographer’s creative vision. Nikon continues to welcome dialogue with bona fide software developers. |
#32
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On Sat, 21 May 2005 11:04:39 -0400, Alan Browne
wrote: Nikon are not doing anyone a service in this regard. Don't be fooled. Unless you'll be implementing that dev kit yourself, you will pay someone. Hmm. Seems like you want it both ways. First you say it's encrypted and then you say it's not good enough they provide the tools for 3rd party software developers. Nikon has no control over Adobe and whether they decide to charge a premium for it, or DCRaw, Capture One, or anyone else. When people buy a Nikon digital Camera, they should get, FREE OF CHARGE, the software that gets the FULL potential out of that camera. Period. Not the promisse that a software developer kit is 'available'. Same for the other OEM's. You do, or at least I did with the D1x 3 years ago. I don't know what software ships with the D2x but I have been able to upgrade all of my Nikon software for free whenever they update it, just by providing my camera's serial number. |
#33
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On 21 May 2005 05:15:29 -0700, "Barry Pearson"
wrote: Has Adobe itself made a statement on this subject? I have seen a straightforward factual explanation from Thomas Knoll. But I thought he was not an Adobe employee. (I wonder if an urban legend is developing about Adobe's part in the debate?) Thomas Knoll is the considered the chief author of Photoshop, is a full time employee, and the press release was released on the adobe website. |
#34
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On Sat, 21 May 2005 11:08:45 -0400, Alan Browne
wrote: In effect, regardless of the Adobe version, NIKON should be supplying FREE OF CHARGE, the plugins that will allow myriad photoshop versions to read the camera data in full. So Nikon should build the software for a 3rd party software developer? When you're done at your work why don't you just swing by my house and wash my car? |
#35
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McLeod wrote:
On 21 May 2005 05:15:29 -0700, "Barry Pearson" wrote: Has Adobe itself made a statement on this subject? I have seen a straightforward factual explanation from Thomas Knoll. But I thought he was not an Adobe employee. (I wonder if an urban legend is developing about Adobe's part in the debate?) Thomas Knoll is the considered the chief author of Photoshop, is a full time employee, and the press release was released on the adobe website. I believe Adobe has never issued a press release on this topic. I believe a myth is growing up about Adobe's involvement in this debate. Here are their press releases for April and Photoshop: http://www.adobe.com/aboutadobe/pres...in.html#200504 http://www.adobe.com/aboutadobe/pres...tegory.html#28 Thomas Knoll posted a factual statement about the matter to the User-to-User forums. Here is what he said: http://tinyurl.com/az7pc Thomas Knoll does indeed have that sort of role with Photoshop, but as far as I know he is not an employee of Adobe. However, that is not relevant here. His statement is a simple explanation, and the debate since then has been driven by Nikon's users, and industry commentators, with little or probably no Adobe involvement. I understand that what Nikon do really is encryption, involving the camera serial number and the image number. The only reason to encrypt any of the Raw file is to COERCE photographers into using the decryption software, which means Nikon Capture. That is an attack on their customers, instead of giving them a free choice. What we have here is Nikon, apparently trying to coerce their D2X customers to buy software they may not want; and Adobe, who give away a free DNG Converter that users of CS can use instead of having to upgrade to CS2 to handle the D2X. How interesting that Nikon, primarily a hardware company, is trying to force people to buy their software, and Adobe, a software company, is giving away free software that may reduce the number of upgrades they sell! Here is a website dedicated to causing camera manufacturers to open up their Raw formats, for various reasons, including long term readability: http://www.openraw.org/ -- Barry Pearson http://www.barry.pearson.name/photography/ http://www.birdsandanimals.info/ |
#36
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Alan Browne wrote:
[snip] In effect, regardless of the Adobe version, NIKON should be supplying FREE OF CHARGE, the plugins that will allow myriad photoshop versions to read the camera data in full. Or, Nikon should be supplying FREE OF CHARGE, the full capability to read the data from the camera. But no, they want to pad on some more revenue for giving you what you already bought! [snip] The problem with Nikon's plug-ins is that they don't provide the same capability as Camera Raw. The question of how to remove the Nikon plug-ins so that Photoshop / Camera Raw can work properly is a frequent question in Adobe forums. Even if Nikon provided their software free, some photographers wouldn't want it in their workflow. (I don't want the software for my Pentax in my workflow). In the short term, photographers should be putting pressure on the camera manufacturers to stop playing games with Raw formats, and ensure that they can be decoded by other companies. For the future, the answer is for camera manufacturers to use a common specification. For that, at the moment, DNG is the only game in town. -- Barry Pearson http://www.barry.pearson.name/photography/ http://www.birdsandanimals.info/ |
#37
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Alan Browne wrote:
[snip] For their part, Adobe are not doing anyone a service wrt plugins that aren't released for the very expensive CS. This is an argument that Adobe can't win! I want Adobe to put their development effort into either the Photoshop release I have, or future releases. That means CS2 and CS3, etc. That way, I will benefit from that effort. I do NOT want Adobe putting development effort into releases that I will never use because I have upgraded from them! (Because of the considerable enhancements in ACR 3.x compared with ACR 2.x, including the plug-in interface, it would take extra effort to back-fit support for the new cameras). In other words, this isn't a dispute between Adobe and its customers. It is between different customers. Between you and me, in fact! Pistols at dawn? -- Barry Pearson http://www.barry.pearson.name/photography/ http://www.birdsandanimals.info/ |
#38
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McLeod wrote:
On 21 May 2005 05:15:29 -0700, "Barry Pearson" wrote: [snip] I thought the SDK didn't give access to the sensor data? If so, it is not suitable for alternative Raw processors. I don't think Adobe's competitors take it any more seriously than Adobe do. (Actually, I think Nikon won't supply it to individuals writing Raw-processing software). [snip] Nikon Advisory - For Immediate Release [snip] Nikon's statements on this topic have obscured things, not clarified them. I think their PR people are trying to work out how to salvage Nikon's position, but even here they dig themselves in a bit deeper: http://avondale.typepad.com/rawforma..._pr_reps_.html http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000960042753/ You can see what Dave Coffin said he http://www.dpreview.com/news/0504/05...ninterview.asp -- Barry Pearson http://www.barry.pearson.name/photography/ http://www.birdsandanimals.info/ |
#39
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On 22 May 2005 00:22:49 -0700, "Barry Pearson"
wrote: I understand that what Nikon do really is encryption, involving the camera serial number and the image number. The only reason to encrypt any of the Raw file is to COERCE photographers into using the decryption software, which means Nikon Capture. That is an attack on their customers, instead of giving them a free choice. http://www.dpreview.com/news/0504/05...ninterview.asp |
#40
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McLeod wrote:
On 22 May 2005 00:22:49 -0700, "Barry Pearson" wrote: I understand that what Nikon do really is encryption, involving the camera serial number and the image number. The only reason to encrypt any of the Raw file is to COERCE photographers into using the decryption software, which means Nikon Capture. That is an attack on their customers, instead of giving them a free choice. http://www.dpreview.com/news/0504/05...ninterview.asp Are you agreeing with me or disagreeing? (I have already posted that URL in reply to one of your posts). Note, from that interview with Dave Coffin: 8. It's clear that many photographers are concerned over the current situation between Adobe and Nikon because they feel it may be an indicator of worse to come (harder encryption, more 'locking down' of file data). So is this a storm in a teacup or a sign of more to come? Photographers have reason to feel scared. Not being computer hackers, they feel powerless to stop Nikon from asserting property rights over their images. I'm not so worried. Whatever scheme Nikon tries next, I'll just reverse-engineer it. 9. Is there a place for a standard 'Open' RAW format or does that raise too many issues to do with the sharing of proprietary image processing between competitive manufacturers? Adobe Digital Negative (DNG) is a great format -- I totally redesigned dcraw for maximum DNG compatibility. -- Barry Pearson http://www.barry.pearson.name/photography/ http://www.birdsandanimals.info/ |
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