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#1
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
Here's Provia 100F in 6x7 womping all over the Canon 5D in detail capture. I had thought that Provia 100F, being not as snappy as the Velvias or as killer fine grain as TMX100, might not be all that much better than 12MP digital. But it is. http://www.pbase.com/image/102380922/original The bad news is that I haven't figured out how to persuade the Epson V700 to capture enough more detail than the 5D to be able to justify shooting film. Sigh. (The Nikon 8000 is old and dying, and probably won't be resurrectable, so I need an alternative.) -- David J. Littleboy Tokyo, Japan |
#2
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
"David J. Littleboy" writes:
(The Nikon 8000 is old and dying, and probably won't be resurrectable, so I need an alternative.) Spare part availability seemed pretty good less than a year ago, so unless you need everything inside swapped, it might not be all that hopeless. And, I'm hoping used Coolscan 9000's will become cheaper over time, tripling my scanning speed when I finally manage to get one... |
#3
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
David J. Littleboy wrote:
Here's Provia 100F in 6x7 womping all over the Canon 5D in detail capture. I had thought that Provia 100F, being not as snappy as the Velvias or as killer fine grain as TMX100, might not be all that much better than 12MP digital. But it is. http://www.pbase.com/image/102380922/original The bad news is that I haven't figured out how to persuade the Epson V700 to capture enough more detail than the 5D to be able to justify shooting film. Sigh. (The Nikon 8000 is old and dying, and probably won't be resurrectable, so I need an alternative.) How does it look w/o upsampling the 5D? The usual comparison is to crop from the film area and the digital camera using a lens that matches the FOV of the film camera. You're close enough with the 35mm v 65mm lenses. Nikon 9000 is fine. How many frames did you scan on the 8000 and over how long? -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. -- usenet posts from gmail.com and googlemail.com are filtered out. |
#4
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
"Alan Browne" wrote: David J. Littleboy wrote: Here's Provia 100F in 6x7 womping all over the Canon 5D in detail capture. I had thought that Provia 100F, being not as snappy as the Velvias or as killer fine grain as TMX100, might not be all that much better than 12MP digital. But it is. http://www.pbase.com/image/102380922/original The bad news is that I haven't figured out how to persuade the Epson V700 to capture enough more detail than the 5D to be able to justify shooting film. Sigh. (The Nikon 8000 is old and dying, and probably won't be resurrectable, so I need an alternative.) How does it look w/o upsampling the 5D? http://www.pbase.com/davidjl/image/57362779/original The 5D does make a nice 12x18" print. When the Moire isn't too bad, that is. (Which is the vast majority of the time.) The usual comparison is to crop from the film area and the digital camera using a lens that matches the FOV of the film camera. Uh, that's what I did: 65mm on 6x7 is essentially the same as 35mm on 24x36, You're close enough with the 35mm v 65mm lenses. Oh. You sounded as though you were arguing. They're really quite close 65mm against 70mm is only a hair wider than 35mm against 36mm. I prefer looking at just the horizontal for comparing formats with different aspect ratios. Someone who thinks the diagonal is a more meaningful comparison would prefer comparing the 65mm on 6x7 with a 32mm lens on 24x36. Which would make digital look even worse. Nikon 9000 is fine. But it costs US$3,000 over here. (I'm really going to want the new Fuji 6x7 folder if it actually appears in the stores, and that plus the Mamiya 7 with the 43/4.5 (a lens I don't currently own) would make a nice, easily luggable kit. But that's three seriously expensive toys at the same time. The claim that MF is getting cheaper does not seem to apply to the MF that I actually want.) How many frames did you scan on the 8000 and over how long? Quite a few; I shot a lot of 645 over the 4 years I was doing that, but the 5D showed up immediately after the Mamiya 7, so it's had a rest the last couple of years. I think it has collected too much dust and crud just sitting around. It's 7 or so years old now. It may also be that it just doesn't like Velvia 100F; it seems less unhappy with Provia. I accidentally started film photography with Provia, and I keep coming back to it. And it keeps surprising. There's still hope for the V700, though: one tiny crop scan I did nailed a snipped of Velvia 100F even better than the 8000. But I haven't been able to repeat that. (Flatbed scanners, even when the resolution is good, have registration problems (the R, G, and B channels for each pixel are each exposed after moving the film; Nikon exposes each channel and then moves the film) resulting in color fringing. Oops.) -- David J. Littleboy Tokyo, Japan |
#5
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
David J. Littleboy wrote:
"Alan Browne" wrote: David J. Littleboy wrote: Here's Provia 100F in 6x7 womping all over the Canon 5D in detail capture. I had thought that Provia 100F, being not as snappy as the Velvias or as killer fine grain as TMX100, might not be all that much better than 12MP digital. But it is. http://www.pbase.com/image/102380922/original The bad news is that I haven't figured out how to persuade the Epson V700 to capture enough more detail than the 5D to be able to justify shooting film. Sigh. (The Nikon 8000 is old and dying, and probably won't be resurrectable, so I need an alternative.) How does it look w/o upsampling the 5D? http://www.pbase.com/davidjl/image/57362779/original The 5D does make a nice 12x18" print. When the Moire isn't too bad, that is. (Which is the vast majority of the time.) The usual comparison is to crop from the film area and the digital camera using a lens that matches the FOV of the film camera. Uh, that's what I did: 65mm on 6x7 is essentially the same as 35mm on 24x36, You're close enough with the 35mm v 65mm lenses. Oh. You sounded as though you were arguing. They're really quite close 65mm against 70mm is only a hair wider than 35mm against 36mm. I prefer looking at just the horizontal for comparing formats with different aspect ratios. Someone who thinks the diagonal is a more meaningful comparison would prefer comparing the 65mm on 6x7 with a 32mm lens on 24x36. Which would make digital look even worse. Where I was going with that is really the upsampling. No need, and I thought that had exaggerated the moire. Looking at the rest of the 5D image, there were probably other "fair" places for comparison where I suspect the 5D would have matched the 6x7 close enough. Nikon 9000 is fine. But it costs US$3,000 over here. Tax-in I paid about $2,400 in Montreal ... (Given Nikon's inane warranty and support and the Nikon reputation for less than stellar reliability in scanners, I didn't take the chance of buying at at B&H (about $1950 at the time). (I'm really going to want the new Fuji 6x7 folder if it actually appears in the stores, and that plus the Mamiya 7 with the 43/4.5 (a lens I don't currently own) would make a nice, easily luggable kit. But that's three seriously expensive toys at the same time. The claim that MF is getting cheaper does not seem to apply to the MF that I actually want.) What kind of price is guess-imated for the folder? Doh! I'm waiting for the FF Sony... which is guessed to be in the $3000 - $4000 range... How many frames did you scan on the 8000 and over how long? Quite a few; I shot a lot of 645 over the 4 years I was doing that, but the 5D showed up immediately after the Mamiya 7, so it's had a rest the last couple of years. I think it has collected too much dust and crud just sitting around. It's 7 or so years old now. I really need to put mine under a dust cover... It may also be that it just doesn't like Velvia 100F; it seems less unhappy with Provia. I accidentally started film photography with Provia, and I keep coming back to it. And it keeps surprising. Provia has delighted and bitten me many times... Velvia has usually delighted all the time (other than a recent 'doh' that I undershot by a stop... sigh). There's still hope for the V700, though: one tiny crop scan I did nailed a snipped of Velvia 100F even better than the 8000. But I haven't been able to repeat that. (Flatbed scanners, even when the resolution is good, have registration problems (the R, G, and B channels for each pixel are each exposed after moving the film; Nikon exposes each channel and then moves the film) resulting in color fringing. Oops.) I believe that's improved with the 9000 and the use of LED's instead of fluorescent. I may be mistaken. -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. -- usenet posts from gmail.com and googlemail.com are filtered out. |
#6
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
Interesting test. The lens on the Canon also shows some red/blue CA?
It is possible to guess how much MP the DSLR should have been to match the 6x7? Resoultion seems to be at least the double in the 6x7 scan which means 4x12MP at least? Max "David J. Littleboy" skrev i en meddelelse ... Here's Provia 100F in 6x7 womping all over the Canon 5D in detail capture. I had thought that Provia 100F, being not as snappy as the Velvias or as killer fine grain as TMX100, might not be all that much better than 12MP digital. But it is. http://www.pbase.com/image/102380922/original The bad news is that I haven't figured out how to persuade the Epson V700 to capture enough more detail than the 5D to be able to justify shooting film. Sigh. (The Nikon 8000 is old and dying, and probably won't be resurrectable, so I need an alternative.) -- David J. Littleboy Tokyo, Japan |
#7
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
Shiva Das wrote:
In article , "David J. Littleboy" wrote: It may also be that it just doesn't like Velvia 100F; it seems less unhappy with Provia. I accidentally started film photography with Provia, and I keep coming back to it. And it keeps surprising. Ever since the demise of E100S, Provia 100 is the only color emulsion I shoot (6x6, x7, x9, x12, and 35mm). I was pretty ****ed at Kodak but it only took a few rolls to convince me that Provia was for me. Nothing like those big ol' transparencies! E100G and GX are quite nice and scan well. Velvia 100 and 100F too if you like ultra blue sky.. -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. -- usenet posts from gmail.com and googlemail.com are filtered out. |
#8
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
Alan Browne writes:
E100G and GX are quite nice and scan well. E100G is what it's intended for: neutral look, boring shots E100GX I should try some time. |
#9
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
Toni Nikkanen wrote:
Alan Browne writes: E100G and GX are quite nice and scan well. E100G is what it's intended for: neutral look, boring shots E100GX I should try some time. It's up to the photog to make it exciting. I'll be scanning some shortly and I'll post the better examples... -- -- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm -- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm -- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin -- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch. -- usenet posts from gmail.com and googlemail.com are filtered out. |
#10
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Provia 100F (in 6x7) ain't bad!
"Alan Browne" wrote: Where I was going with that is really the upsampling. No need, and I thought that had exaggerated the moire. Looking at the rest of the 5D image, there were probably other "fair" places for comparison where I suspect the 5D would have matched the 6x7 close enough. This is something I've said at other places and times; that 6x7 film needs high-contast detail to beat out 12MP digital. Given how blatant the difference is here though, I'm thinking that there may be more difference than I had thought. -- David J. Littleboy Tokyo, Japan |
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