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#1
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About "the photo groups" for news.groups regulars
"Lisa Horton" wrote
Perhaps elbow bending and good sense don't go together? *ah!* so you *do* see I'm not connected with the anonymous troll |
#2
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About "the photo groups" for news.groups regulars
In article , "Steve Young"
bowtieATbrightdslDOTnet says... *ah!* so you *do* see I'm not connected with the anonymous troll No, we still think you're guilty Steve. -- http://www.pbase.com/bcbaird/ |
#3
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About "the photo groups" for news.groups regulars
Brian C. Baird wrote in
: In article , "Steve Young" bowtieATbrightdslDOTnet says... *ah!* so you *do* see I'm not connected with the anonymous troll No, we still think you're guilty Steve. Brian is correct. -- "Live fast. Die young." (Nikki Sixx) -Richard Cockburn |
#4
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About "the photo groups" for news.groups regulars
"Steve Young" bowtieATbrightdslDOTnet on 27 Jul 2004 posted
[groups added, follow-up set] "Lisa Horton" wrote in message ... For those of you who are regulars in this group and are wondering why all the fuss about the "photo groups", let me give you some background. Last summer, a troll or trolls started attacking the photo newsgroups, using religion, politics, and sexuality to set us against each other. The group was going downhill. Along with some others, I came up with the idea of an activity that might help build a sense of community, and bring us back together around the one thing we all do have in common, photography. The project was called the Shoot In, a sort of non competitive variation on a photo contest. Its definitely a good idea, are there any other newsgroups for photography that do this? for some reason, rec.photo.35mm doesn't seem to have anything like this. Perhaps this group should go moderated? Community *is* important to a better user experience. And *kudos* on your effort toward that The SI was a roaring success, welcomed by a great many newsgroup regulars. There were a few who were not enthusiastic, so in response it was agreed to preface all SI related traffic with [SI], which did mollify almost all of those who didn't like the SI. In fact, the SI did help build community, and did help turn the groups attention away from the trolling. Why not cure the trolling, so others aren't harassed? Now, strictly speaking, the SI is not on topic for rec.photo.equipment.35mm, as that group nominally exists to discuss 35mm photographic equipment. Ah, so you do agree, there is validity to the fundamentalist's claim. Does anyone deny that anything not specifically involving recreational use of 35mm photographic camera equipment is'nt strictly speaking off topic? Does your killfilter not work? Do you not have scoring or anything like that? However, a number of topics regularly discussed and generally accepted as appropriate are also strictly speaking, off topic. Like camera, tripods and the like. In general, the group doesn't have a problem with topics that are at least related to 35mm photographic equipment. And OTOH, as I recall, the charter does not forbid personal hobbyist 'for sale' ads. Some folks say they would rather not see them in the group. (In fact, this may be an understatement. Not long after the SI became a success, the troll(s) started attacking the SI. And Steve Young appeared on the scene, with his project of modifying existing group charters. So much for research Lisa, I've been a participant in the photo groups for nearly six years. Throughout the course, I've witnessed raging flame wars over the shortcomings of the charter. charter? Who the hell cares about any charter? any charter is a toothless unenforcable completely meaningless peice of nothing. A newsgroup certainly doesn't need a charter to allow members to complain about spam. snip Also this year, an anonymous post in alt.troll invited trolls to attack the photo groups. The "snuh" brigade appear to have acted on the invitation, and are now rampaging through the photo groups as well. Oh my god no! Not the terrible onslaught of trolls and such?! What can stop them! Oh, wait, they're totally obvious, so i can just ignore them, and, oh look, whats this shiny red button that says 'killfile' do? Seriously, its relatively obvious when a thread or post is a work of trolling, and killfiles are great. Anyone that doesn't have a newsreader with decent killfiling and scoring should look into getting one. That is, if they are having that much trouble pressing the 'delete' key. Notably, they appear to like and think highly of Steve Young. Perhaps they see me as fair, unbiased, reasonably read and articulate? Getting to the crux of the matter, listening *and* *respecting* other peoples opinion. What'reyou serious? So now, in the Summer of 2004, a year after the initial attacks, here we are. The attacks continue, the RL harassment continues. Quite a few people in the photo groups believe that Steve Young is involved in the trolling. None of the group regulars agree with Steve Young about the charters. Other than what I've posted, I'm no more involved with it than you, but it does make for a great story and a common bad guy within the clique. As you may have noticed, Steve seems to spend considerable time going on about some "dog pack". This appears to be his term for the great majority of newsgroup regulars who disagree with Steve. But I'll tell you right now, there is no "dog pack" that runs the group. How, in the world, would ther even be such a thing? THis is -usenet-. This is an unmoderated newsgroup in usent. People have killfiles and scoreing filters, and outside of exhanging the text of those files, there isn't even a way to assert control on a group. There is, however, like all newsgroups a core group of participants who do much to encourage the health of the newsgroup. As a participant of 8 years in the photo groups, I guess I'm in that group. But we're no cabal, we're not organized, we're just people with a common interest in photography. So it has now slipped to; at least "we're no cabal" Even this is debatable, IMHO Ok, how is it debateable? HOw are some powerless people who can only post messages to a newsgroup a cabal? And even if they were, what would it matter? How does their being in a cabal somehow keep them out of anyone's personal killfile? An interest that Steve Young does not appear to share, since he never posts about photography, just about trolls and charter and things like that. While he's posting all this off topic stuff, he goes on and on and on and on about how the photography related SI is off topic. You need to do better with your history Lisa. Even in regards to it being off-topic Who cares if there is off topic traffic here? Every newsgroup has tons of off topic traffic. Any newsgroup that has traffic as relevant to it as the Shoot-In is to this newsgroup would be benefiting from it. snip |
#5
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About "the photo groups" for news.groups regulars
"Steve Young" bowtieATbrightdslDOTnet on 27 Jul 2004 posted
[groups added, follow-up set] "Lisa Horton" wrote in message ... For those of you who are regulars in this group and are wondering why all the fuss about the "photo groups", let me give you some background. Last summer, a troll or trolls started attacking the photo newsgroups, using religion, politics, and sexuality to set us against each other. The group was going downhill. Along with some others, I came up with the idea of an activity that might help build a sense of community, and bring us back together around the one thing we all do have in common, photography. The project was called the Shoot In, a sort of non competitive variation on a photo contest. Its definitely a good idea, are there any other newsgroups for photography that do this? for some reason, rec.photo.35mm doesn't seem to have anything like this. Perhaps this group should go moderated? Community *is* important to a better user experience. And *kudos* on your effort toward that The SI was a roaring success, welcomed by a great many newsgroup regulars. There were a few who were not enthusiastic, so in response it was agreed to preface all SI related traffic with [SI], which did mollify almost all of those who didn't like the SI. In fact, the SI did help build community, and did help turn the groups attention away from the trolling. Why not cure the trolling, so others aren't harassed? Now, strictly speaking, the SI is not on topic for rec.photo.equipment.35mm, as that group nominally exists to discuss 35mm photographic equipment. Ah, so you do agree, there is validity to the fundamentalist's claim. Does anyone deny that anything not specifically involving recreational use of 35mm photographic camera equipment is'nt strictly speaking off topic? Does your killfilter not work? Do you not have scoring or anything like that? However, a number of topics regularly discussed and generally accepted as appropriate are also strictly speaking, off topic. Like camera, tripods and the like. In general, the group doesn't have a problem with topics that are at least related to 35mm photographic equipment. And OTOH, as I recall, the charter does not forbid personal hobbyist 'for sale' ads. Some folks say they would rather not see them in the group. (In fact, this may be an understatement. Not long after the SI became a success, the troll(s) started attacking the SI. And Steve Young appeared on the scene, with his project of modifying existing group charters. So much for research Lisa, I've been a participant in the photo groups for nearly six years. Throughout the course, I've witnessed raging flame wars over the shortcomings of the charter. charter? Who the hell cares about any charter? any charter is a toothless unenforcable completely meaningless peice of nothing. A newsgroup certainly doesn't need a charter to allow members to complain about spam. snip Also this year, an anonymous post in alt.troll invited trolls to attack the photo groups. The "snuh" brigade appear to have acted on the invitation, and are now rampaging through the photo groups as well. Oh my god no! Not the terrible onslaught of trolls and such?! What can stop them! Oh, wait, they're totally obvious, so i can just ignore them, and, oh look, whats this shiny red button that says 'killfile' do? Seriously, its relatively obvious when a thread or post is a work of trolling, and killfiles are great. Anyone that doesn't have a newsreader with decent killfiling and scoring should look into getting one. That is, if they are having that much trouble pressing the 'delete' key. Notably, they appear to like and think highly of Steve Young. Perhaps they see me as fair, unbiased, reasonably read and articulate? Getting to the crux of the matter, listening *and* *respecting* other peoples opinion. What'reyou serious? So now, in the Summer of 2004, a year after the initial attacks, here we are. The attacks continue, the RL harassment continues. Quite a few people in the photo groups believe that Steve Young is involved in the trolling. None of the group regulars agree with Steve Young about the charters. Other than what I've posted, I'm no more involved with it than you, but it does make for a great story and a common bad guy within the clique. As you may have noticed, Steve seems to spend considerable time going on about some "dog pack". This appears to be his term for the great majority of newsgroup regulars who disagree with Steve. But I'll tell you right now, there is no "dog pack" that runs the group. How, in the world, would ther even be such a thing? THis is -usenet-. This is an unmoderated newsgroup in usent. People have killfiles and scoreing filters, and outside of exhanging the text of those files, there isn't even a way to assert control on a group. There is, however, like all newsgroups a core group of participants who do much to encourage the health of the newsgroup. As a participant of 8 years in the photo groups, I guess I'm in that group. But we're no cabal, we're not organized, we're just people with a common interest in photography. So it has now slipped to; at least "we're no cabal" Even this is debatable, IMHO Ok, how is it debateable? HOw are some powerless people who can only post messages to a newsgroup a cabal? And even if they were, what would it matter? How does their being in a cabal somehow keep them out of anyone's personal killfile? An interest that Steve Young does not appear to share, since he never posts about photography, just about trolls and charter and things like that. While he's posting all this off topic stuff, he goes on and on and on and on about how the photography related SI is off topic. You need to do better with your history Lisa. Even in regards to it being off-topic Who cares if there is off topic traffic here? Every newsgroup has tons of off topic traffic. Any newsgroup that has traffic as relevant to it as the Shoot-In is to this newsgroup would be benefiting from it. snip |
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