GPS

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 07:21:41 -0000, Jeremy Nixon
wrote:

No, it will work for them if they decide they want the same thing that
you evidently want. If they want something else, it will not work for
them.

A rather common misconception.
Wanting something other than what's available does not make what's
available not work.
If there were a *need* for something else, then what's avaiable might
not work, but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
The problem is that you're insisting that I'm wrong for wanting
something other than the same thing that you want. You're insisting
that you know the only way anyone should ever want or need to use a
GPS receiver. Maybe the manufacturers are listening to you, which
would be a shame.

I think we all knwo that the manufacturers are doing what they do
simply to show the consumers who's boss.
Oh, wait, that doesn't work, either. The market will decide what it
wants; the manufacturers will make what the market says it wants.
That's the path to riches.
IOW, the manufacturers are listening to the market that promises the
most money. If that's not you, well, that's life.

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 03:40:32 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:

Big Bill wrote:

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:14:24 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:


Jeremy Nixon wrote:

Big Bill wrote:



So you're saying that the reason people (who, according to you, want
to buy them) won't buy a GPS is because they can't figure out how to
use a serial port?


Nope. I'm saying that's part of it; it's a symptom of the fact that GPS
manufacturers aren't making units for normal people. And I can see why,
when there are all these folks who so strongly insist that people
should not be allowed to have one that works the way they would want
it to, and should instead have to adapt to the technology.


Worse, that they should adapt to ancient techonolgy that is nor
appropriate to the needs of today.


And yet, look at all the people who have broadband available to them,
and still use dialup.
I suppose you think that's because they can't figure out that
connector they only need to plug into the back of their computer? Just
like a serial cable plugs in?

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

Except that Ethernet/USB connectors are standard, no buying an adapter
to make it fit the connector on the equipment, and require no tools to
attach it.

Are you actually saying that serial ports aren't standard?
Are you actually saying that all computers (desktop or laptop) have
ethernet ports?
What tools do you need to plug in a serial cable?

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 03:40:32 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:

Big Bill wrote:

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:14:24 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:


Jeremy Nixon wrote:

Big Bill wrote:



So you're saying that the reason people (who, according to you, want
to buy them) won't buy a GPS is because they can't figure out how to
use a serial port?


Nope. I'm saying that's part of it; it's a symptom of the fact that GPS
manufacturers aren't making units for normal people. And I can see why,
when there are all these folks who so strongly insist that people
should not be allowed to have one that works the way they would want
it to, and should instead have to adapt to the technology.


Worse, that they should adapt to ancient techonolgy that is nor
appropriate to the needs of today.


And yet, look at all the people who have broadband available to them,
and still use dialup.
I suppose you think that's because they can't figure out that
connector they only need to plug into the back of their computer? Just
like a serial cable plugs in?

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

Except that Ethernet/USB connectors are standard, no buying an adapter
to make it fit the connector on the equipment, and require no tools to
attach it.

Are you actually saying that serial ports aren't standard?
Are you actually saying that all computers (desktop or laptop) have
ethernet ports?
What tools do you need to plug in a serial cable?

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

In article , Ron Hunter
writes
Prometheus wrote:

In article , Ron Hunter
writes

Prometheus wrote:

In article , Ron Hunter
writes

Prometheus wrote:

Or he could buy a GPS Rx with USB.



where? How much? Models?
I checked throughly about this time last year and found ONLY a
model intended for connection to a particular model of pocket
computer, and the interface wasn't USB.

http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap276c/


very nice, and a definite step in the right direction. But a bit
out of my price range. Maybe another year will do it. For now the
old Magellan 315 will have to do.
I thought you were willing to pay the cost of developing and
fabricating a new chip set with USB; I never did say your "$20"
increase in retail price was realistic for recouping the required
investment entailed.

I think USB chip sets are an 'off the shelf' item. Very little would
be needed to get them in a new product, proof of which is those Garmin
models.

I doubt that you will find any NEMA to USB chip sets. The final
processing of the GPS data, display output, key input serial output is
likely to be on one chip (it's the only way to get it small and reduce
manufacturing costs). The LCD will have its own driver chip, and there
might be a few support chips, the data from the GPS Rx core will not be
available at USB speeds, hence the re-design of the chip set.
--
Ian G8ILZ

In article , Ron Hunter
writes
Prometheus wrote:

In article , Ron Hunter
writes

Prometheus wrote:

In article , Ron Hunter
writes

Prometheus wrote:

Or he could buy a GPS Rx with USB.



where? How much? Models?
I checked throughly about this time last year and found ONLY a
model intended for connection to a particular model of pocket
computer, and the interface wasn't USB.

http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap276c/


very nice, and a definite step in the right direction. But a bit
out of my price range. Maybe another year will do it. For now the
old Magellan 315 will have to do.
I thought you were willing to pay the cost of developing and
fabricating a new chip set with USB; I never did say your "$20"
increase in retail price was realistic for recouping the required
investment entailed.

I think USB chip sets are an 'off the shelf' item. Very little would
be needed to get them in a new product, proof of which is those Garmin
models.

I doubt that you will find any NEMA to USB chip sets. The final
processing of the GPS data, display output, key input serial output is
likely to be on one chip (it's the only way to get it small and reduce
manufacturing costs). The LCD will have its own driver chip, and there
might be a few support chips, the data from the GPS Rx core will not be
available at USB speeds, hence the re-design of the chip set.
--
Ian G8ILZ

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 03:42:32 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:

Big Bill wrote:

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:17:48 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:


They have always been, and I have been dealing with them for about 37
years! I read the instructions that came with the program I bought to
transfer data to my GPS and I was stumped at the first decision, which
protocol to use, and what settings I needed to set in the COM: port to
do the connection, since each was different. I probably could have
leaped that hurdle had the program not been written in a totally
non-intuitive way, and the instructions looked like they were written by
the programmer. It was hopeless. When a modern interface exists for
data transfer between my computer and a GPS, then I will buy a new one,
not before.


Interestingly enough, we just got a Streetpilot III.
It worked right out of the box. Nop tweaking needed, the instructions
were just fine.
It does use a serial port; HORRORS! it worked forst time, no
confusion, no wondering how it should be set up.
Maybe you're just not trying the right GPS.
Would USB be easier? Maybe. Is serial up to the job? Obviously.

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

Do you want to spend 12 hours transferring detailed mapping information
and database information? If so, fine, but if I am to spend $1300 on a
device, it will have a MUCH faster way to transfer data, period.

I only spent $600; maybe that's part of your problem, that you can't
find info whan you need it.

As for ther time involved, I really don't know what you are talking
about when you talk about 12 hours. When did you have this problem?
What are you talking about that takes that much time to transfer? I
really want to understand your complaints, but it's thngs like this
that make me wonder if you're dealing with reality, or just making an
over the top point.

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

On Wed, 01 Sep 2004 03:42:32 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:

Big Bill wrote:

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:17:48 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:


They have always been, and I have been dealing with them for about 37
years! I read the instructions that came with the program I bought to
transfer data to my GPS and I was stumped at the first decision, which
protocol to use, and what settings I needed to set in the COM: port to
do the connection, since each was different. I probably could have
leaped that hurdle had the program not been written in a totally
non-intuitive way, and the instructions looked like they were written by
the programmer. It was hopeless. When a modern interface exists for
data transfer between my computer and a GPS, then I will buy a new one,
not before.


Interestingly enough, we just got a Streetpilot III.
It worked right out of the box. Nop tweaking needed, the instructions
were just fine.
It does use a serial port; HORRORS! it worked forst time, no
confusion, no wondering how it should be set up.
Maybe you're just not trying the right GPS.
Would USB be easier? Maybe. Is serial up to the job? Obviously.

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

Do you want to spend 12 hours transferring detailed mapping information
and database information? If so, fine, but if I am to spend $1300 on a
device, it will have a MUCH faster way to transfer data, period.

I only spent $600; maybe that's part of your problem, that you can't
find info whan you need it.

As for ther time involved, I really don't know what you are talking
about when you talk about 12 hours. When did you have this problem?
What are you talking about that takes that much time to transfer? I
really want to understand your complaints, but it's thngs like this
that make me wonder if you're dealing with reality, or just making an
over the top point.

Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

writes:

Indeed, the standard model with the standard serial interface and the
restricted model with only USB.

And then there are the Garmin models with *both* serial and USB ports.
I do wonder why the people who won't buy a GPS receiver without USB
don't know about them; perhaps they aren't really looking?

Dave

writes:

Indeed, the standard model with the standard serial interface and the
restricted model with only USB.

And then there are the Garmin models with *both* serial and USB ports.
I do wonder why the people who won't buy a GPS receiver without USB
don't know about them; perhaps they aren't really looking?

Dave

Ron Hunter writes:

I Googled for a while this morning and STILL found that there are no
models with USB intended for data transfer with the computer, only
special units that connect via USB to laptops/palmtops for GPS
functions. Will check for flash card units later, but I have little
hope that these are not also fantasies of the dedicated serial interface
people who want to continue to drive nails with a screwdriver.

Try looking at the Garmin GPSMAP 76C and 76CS. USB *and* serial
connections. The USB port provides fast map data transfer, while the
serial port speaks NMEA so it will still connect to all the usual data
consumers you might find on a boat (radar, autopilot, etc).

It doesn't say that you can use the USB port for tracking, so if you
bought a laptop with no serial port, you may still need a serial-USB
adapter for position tracking on your laptop.

Dave