Nikon announces new flagship **FILM** SLR – the F6!

"Matt Clara" wrote:

Sorry for the rant, I'm just sick of everyone bashing on Nikon. They've
come out with several fine cameras just now, with lots of attention to
detail and end user needs, and 90% of the discussion here is about what it's
not. Nikon hears the complaints about the F5's size and weight, so they par
the new one's size down, and yet pack in a lot of cutting edge technology,
and now it's called either an F200, or a rip of the EOS 1v, and not an
improvement over the F5, even though many of its features are improved.
/rant


If it is any consolation, you would feel much worse if you were a
Leica user and paid any attention to the vitriolic anti-Leica nonsense
for which this newsgroup is justly (in)famous.

;-)

"William Graham" wrote:

I wonder why they didn't design the F6 to take the F5 finders.....Then at
least, they would have a chance of getting rid of the ones they had on hand
that they had already made for the F5.


There is no excess stock of F5 finders.

Nikon must have learned from their experience with the F4 finders.

;-)

"William Graham" wrote:

I wonder why they didn't design the F6 to take the F5 finders.....Then at
least, they would have a chance of getting rid of the ones they had on hand
that they had already made for the F5.


There is no excess stock of F5 finders.

Nikon must have learned from their experience with the F4 finders.

;-)

Sander Vesik wrote:

Alan Browne wrote:

other bells and whistles, like the built in databack, inter-volvo-meter,
etc. Then there's the full metal body, including the back, beter meter,
better autofocus, mirror lockup, faster motordrive, shutter monitor, and a

Shutter monitor? WTF is that? Nikon shutters are extremely
reliable in this class ... not something of value to monitor it, IMO.


Something that will tell you when you need need to go to
a Nikon service center because your shutter just fired at
the wrong speed compared to what it was supposed to.

Shoot some slide film. You'll know if it needs to go.

It sounds like a feature that, for whatever reason having to do
with the design of the shutter, was a low extra effort to include
.... and so it was added as a marketing bonus.



Or do you have a use for a shuuter that fires at say 5% less on speeds
above 1/2000?

There is no way you would know (or care) about a 5% error on
shutter speed (at any speed). The effect would certainly not be
visible on a slide exposure.


super hightech shutter made in collaboration with DuPont. The list goes on

About time they caught up to Minolta (Max 9 [1998] uses carbon
fibre reinforced epoxy blades and shoots to 1/12,000 (1/300 sync)).


Are there really subjects needing more than 1/8000? And I don't
mean shooting bright sunlight dyatime scenes with ISO 1600 film
and large apertures.

I've shot shaddowgraphs of the sun at 1/12,000, f/22 and a 4xND
in place on ISO 100... but certainly not something I'd do every
day... the very fast Minolta shutter has its real benefit in the
1/300 sync speed. How they got there .... very light, stiff,
shutter blades... so it seems a bit odd to me that the sycn speed
of the F6 is less than on the F5.... (it really doesn't matter
*that* much either.

Cheers,
Alan
--
-- rec.photo.equipment.35mm user resource:
-- http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.--

Sander Vesik wrote:

Alan Browne wrote:

other bells and whistles, like the built in databack, inter-volvo-meter,
etc. Then there's the full metal body, including the back, beter meter,
better autofocus, mirror lockup, faster motordrive, shutter monitor, and a

Shutter monitor? WTF is that? Nikon shutters are extremely
reliable in this class ... not something of value to monitor it, IMO.


Something that will tell you when you need need to go to
a Nikon service center because your shutter just fired at
the wrong speed compared to what it was supposed to.

Shoot some slide film. You'll know if it needs to go.

It sounds like a feature that, for whatever reason having to do
with the design of the shutter, was a low extra effort to include
.... and so it was added as a marketing bonus.



Or do you have a use for a shuuter that fires at say 5% less on speeds
above 1/2000?

There is no way you would know (or care) about a 5% error on
shutter speed (at any speed). The effect would certainly not be
visible on a slide exposure.


super hightech shutter made in collaboration with DuPont. The list goes on

About time they caught up to Minolta (Max 9 [1998] uses carbon
fibre reinforced epoxy blades and shoots to 1/12,000 (1/300 sync)).


Are there really subjects needing more than 1/8000? And I don't
mean shooting bright sunlight dyatime scenes with ISO 1600 film
and large apertures.

I've shot shaddowgraphs of the sun at 1/12,000, f/22 and a 4xND
in place on ISO 100... but certainly not something I'd do every
day... the very fast Minolta shutter has its real benefit in the
1/300 sync speed. How they got there .... very light, stiff,
shutter blades... so it seems a bit odd to me that the sycn speed
of the F6 is less than on the F5.... (it really doesn't matter
*that* much either.

Cheers,
Alan
--
-- rec.photo.equipment.35mm user resource:
-- http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.--

Matt Clara wrote:

"Alan Browne" wrote in message
.. .

Matt Clara wrote:


"Alan Browne" wrote in message

...not sure if anyone else posted on it ... but the F6 backs
off to 1/250 sync speed from 1/300. Yet another area where the
F6 is a watered down F5 or more likely an improved F100.




Whatever... Most modern Nikons will go to 1/300 (on manual), but it's

iffy,

even on the F5. Nikon's just playing it safe. Plus, look at the host

of

On the F5 it is spec so I would expect it to work within the temp
range of the camera flawlessly.


other bells and whistles, like the built in databack, inter-volvo-meter,
etc. Then there's the full metal body, including the back, beter meter,
better autofocus, mirror lockup, faster motordrive, shutter monitor, and

a

Shutter monitor? WTF is that? Nikon shutters are extremely
reliable in this class ... not something of value to monitor it, IMO.


super hightech shutter made in collaboration with DuPont. The list

goes on

About time they caught up to Minolta (Max 9 [1998] uses carbon
fibre reinforced epoxy blades and shoots to 1/12,000 (1/300 sync)).


and on.
If this is an improved F100, it's improvements are generational, at the

very

least.

I expected that the "F6" would be better than an "F5" in all
respects. Maybe that's the wrong way to look at it... but by
going to a fixed VF, slower sync, etc. etc. they've taken away
some of the king-of-the-hill pro appeal.




[Alan, I wrote this earlier in response to your post. I realize now your
point is that the F6 doesn't seem like an F5 x 2 (or 1.4, even), still, this
rant of mine is too good to let go...]

rant
Oh, I know. Whatever Nikon comes out with these days has to be defined in
terms of what it's not. It's as though they really haven't offered us
anything except big voids. They come out with a 12 megapixel dslr, it's not
full frame, it's not on time (should have been last year, right?). Hey, we
better not buy into Nikon, lest we get sucked into the void ourselves. Buy
a Nikon camera, get nothing, less than nothing, even, a great sucking
blackness, cleaning out your wallet, causing your wife to leave you, making
your life empty of meaning. And the pictures--all black. The void even
sucks at the light itself, so save yourself the trouble of developing your
film, there's nothing on it, except the emptiness that the Nikon Corp.
foists on the world! Move to Canon now--there's the light, there it is,
Carol Anne, move towards it. Or towards Minolta, like you, Alan, you willy
fox, you.

No regrets other than the Konica merger that caused them to slow
down on the DSLR... (who's 'willy'?).

Sorry for the rant, I'm just sick of everyone bashing on Nikon. They've
come out with several fine cameras just now, with lots of attention to
detail and end user needs, and 90% of the discussion here is about what it's
not. Nikon hears the complaints about the F5's size and weight, so they par
the new one's size down, and yet pack in a lot of cutting edge technology,
and now it's called either an F200, or a rip of the EOS 1v, and not an
improvement over the F5, even though many of its features are improved.
/rant

Don't rant too hard... I'm very pleased that Nikon have come out
with the F6. I just had an expectation (unreasonable as it is)
that it would be a real killer. Instead it's a very good pro
camera with compromise.

Cheers,
Alan


--
-- rec.photo.equipment.35mm user resource:
-- http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.--

Matt Clara wrote:

"Alan Browne" wrote in message
.. .

Matt Clara wrote:


"Alan Browne" wrote in message

...not sure if anyone else posted on it ... but the F6 backs
off to 1/250 sync speed from 1/300. Yet another area where the
F6 is a watered down F5 or more likely an improved F100.




Whatever... Most modern Nikons will go to 1/300 (on manual), but it's

iffy,

even on the F5. Nikon's just playing it safe. Plus, look at the host

of

On the F5 it is spec so I would expect it to work within the temp
range of the camera flawlessly.


other bells and whistles, like the built in databack, inter-volvo-meter,
etc. Then there's the full metal body, including the back, beter meter,
better autofocus, mirror lockup, faster motordrive, shutter monitor, and

a

Shutter monitor? WTF is that? Nikon shutters are extremely
reliable in this class ... not something of value to monitor it, IMO.


super hightech shutter made in collaboration with DuPont. The list

goes on

About time they caught up to Minolta (Max 9 [1998] uses carbon
fibre reinforced epoxy blades and shoots to 1/12,000 (1/300 sync)).


and on.
If this is an improved F100, it's improvements are generational, at the

very

least.

I expected that the "F6" would be better than an "F5" in all
respects. Maybe that's the wrong way to look at it... but by
going to a fixed VF, slower sync, etc. etc. they've taken away
some of the king-of-the-hill pro appeal.




[Alan, I wrote this earlier in response to your post. I realize now your
point is that the F6 doesn't seem like an F5 x 2 (or 1.4, even), still, this
rant of mine is too good to let go...]

rant
Oh, I know. Whatever Nikon comes out with these days has to be defined in
terms of what it's not. It's as though they really haven't offered us
anything except big voids. They come out with a 12 megapixel dslr, it's not
full frame, it's not on time (should have been last year, right?). Hey, we
better not buy into Nikon, lest we get sucked into the void ourselves. Buy
a Nikon camera, get nothing, less than nothing, even, a great sucking
blackness, cleaning out your wallet, causing your wife to leave you, making
your life empty of meaning. And the pictures--all black. The void even
sucks at the light itself, so save yourself the trouble of developing your
film, there's nothing on it, except the emptiness that the Nikon Corp.
foists on the world! Move to Canon now--there's the light, there it is,
Carol Anne, move towards it. Or towards Minolta, like you, Alan, you willy
fox, you.

No regrets other than the Konica merger that caused them to slow
down on the DSLR... (who's 'willy'?).

Sorry for the rant, I'm just sick of everyone bashing on Nikon. They've
come out with several fine cameras just now, with lots of attention to
detail and end user needs, and 90% of the discussion here is about what it's
not. Nikon hears the complaints about the F5's size and weight, so they par
the new one's size down, and yet pack in a lot of cutting edge technology,
and now it's called either an F200, or a rip of the EOS 1v, and not an
improvement over the F5, even though many of its features are improved.
/rant

Don't rant too hard... I'm very pleased that Nikon have come out
with the F6. I just had an expectation (unreasonable as it is)
that it would be a real killer. Instead it's a very good pro
camera with compromise.

Cheers,
Alan


--
-- rec.photo.equipment.35mm user resource:
-- http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.--

Matt Clara wrote:

"Alan Browne" wrote in message
.. .

Matt Clara wrote:


"Alan Browne" wrote in message

...not sure if anyone else posted on it ... but the F6 backs
off to 1/250 sync speed from 1/300. Yet another area where the
F6 is a watered down F5 or more likely an improved F100.




Whatever... Most modern Nikons will go to 1/300 (on manual), but it's

iffy,

even on the F5. Nikon's just playing it safe. Plus, look at the host

of

On the F5 it is spec so I would expect it to work within the temp
range of the camera flawlessly.


other bells and whistles, like the built in databack, inter-volvo-meter,
etc. Then there's the full metal body, including the back, beter meter,
better autofocus, mirror lockup, faster motordrive, shutter monitor, and

a

Shutter monitor? WTF is that? Nikon shutters are extremely
reliable in this class ... not something of value to monitor it, IMO.


super hightech shutter made in collaboration with DuPont. The list

goes on

About time they caught up to Minolta (Max 9 [1998] uses carbon
fibre reinforced epoxy blades and shoots to 1/12,000 (1/300 sync)).


and on.
If this is an improved F100, it's improvements are generational, at the

very

least.

I expected that the "F6" would be better than an "F5" in all
respects. Maybe that's the wrong way to look at it... but by
going to a fixed VF, slower sync, etc. etc. they've taken away
some of the king-of-the-hill pro appeal.




[Alan, I wrote this earlier in response to your post. I realize now your
point is that the F6 doesn't seem like an F5 x 2 (or 1.4, even), still, this
rant of mine is too good to let go...]

rant
Oh, I know. Whatever Nikon comes out with these days has to be defined in
terms of what it's not. It's as though they really haven't offered us
anything except big voids. They come out with a 12 megapixel dslr, it's not
full frame, it's not on time (should have been last year, right?). Hey, we
better not buy into Nikon, lest we get sucked into the void ourselves. Buy
a Nikon camera, get nothing, less than nothing, even, a great sucking
blackness, cleaning out your wallet, causing your wife to leave you, making
your life empty of meaning. And the pictures--all black. The void even
sucks at the light itself, so save yourself the trouble of developing your
film, there's nothing on it, except the emptiness that the Nikon Corp.
foists on the world! Move to Canon now--there's the light, there it is,
Carol Anne, move towards it. Or towards Minolta, like you, Alan, you willy
fox, you.

No regrets other than the Konica merger that caused them to slow
down on the DSLR... (who's 'willy'?).

Sorry for the rant, I'm just sick of everyone bashing on Nikon. They've
come out with several fine cameras just now, with lots of attention to
detail and end user needs, and 90% of the discussion here is about what it's
not. Nikon hears the complaints about the F5's size and weight, so they par
the new one's size down, and yet pack in a lot of cutting edge technology,
and now it's called either an F200, or a rip of the EOS 1v, and not an
improvement over the F5, even though many of its features are improved.
/rant

Don't rant too hard... I'm very pleased that Nikon have come out
with the F6. I just had an expectation (unreasonable as it is)
that it would be a real killer. Instead it's a very good pro
camera with compromise.

Cheers,
Alan


--
-- rec.photo.equipment.35mm user resource:
-- http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.--

"TP" wrote in message
...
"William Graham" wrote:

I wonder why they didn't design the F6 to take the F5 finders.....Then at
least, they would have a chance of getting rid of the ones they had on
hand
that they had already made for the F5.


There is no excess stock of F5 finders.

Nikon must have learned from their experience with the F4 finders.

;-)


So, I guess the only loss is that their advertising department can't say,
"And it has a titanium finder"....The finder must be removable however, or
there would be no way to replace/clean the screen.......Somehow, it just
doesn't seem like it makes a lot of sense to not offer different
finders......

"TP" wrote in message
...
"William Graham" wrote:

I wonder why they didn't design the F6 to take the F5 finders.....Then at
least, they would have a chance of getting rid of the ones they had on
hand
that they had already made for the F5.


There is no excess stock of F5 finders.

Nikon must have learned from their experience with the F4 finders.

;-)


So, I guess the only loss is that their advertising department can't say,
"And it has a titanium finder"....The finder must be removable however, or
there would be no way to replace/clean the screen.......Somehow, it just
doesn't seem like it makes a lot of sense to not offer different
finders......