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Extension rings for macro



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 19th 09, 01:00 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Gerrit
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Posts: 5
Default Extension rings for macro

I wish to buy a set of rings to give macro capability to my camera.
I have a Nikon D50 body married to a Tamron AF LD 28-200 lens.
My question to all you knowledgeable people is this: would a Kenko Automatic
Extension Tube Set DG for Nikon AF be suitable and would all the functions
on the D50 be enabled?

Thank you in advance.

Gerrit - Oz


  #2  
Old October 19th 09, 01:19 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Me
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Posts: 796
Default Extension rings for macro

Gerrit wrote:
I wish to buy a set of rings to give macro capability to my camera.
I have a Nikon D50 body married to a Tamron AF LD 28-200 lens.
My question to all you knowledgeable people is this: would a Kenko
Automatic
Extension Tube Set DG for Nikon AF be suitable and would all the functions
on the D50 be enabled?

Thank you in advance.

Gerrit - Oz



All functions should work.
You'd lose AF ability with screw-driven lenses, but with the electronic
contacts, still have AF with AF-s lenses. Not that this matters much,
as you'd probably want to use manual focus with macro anyway.
How much are the Kenko tubes BTW?
Just that almost any brand (Nikkor and third party Tamron/Sigma/Tokina -
and others?) make extremely good dedicated macro lenses, some of which -
especially the non-nikkors - might be able to be picked up used for not
much more than extension tubes.
  #3  
Old October 19th 09, 02:58 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Floyd L. Davidson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,138
Default Extension rings for macro

"Gerrit" wrote:
I wish to buy a set of rings to give macro capability to my camera.
I have a Nikon D50 body married to a Tamron AF LD 28-200 lens.
My question to all you knowledgeable people is this: would a Kenko Automatic
Extension Tube Set DG for Nikon AF be suitable and would all the functions
on the D50 be enabled?


Kenko Automatic Extension tubes will work on your D50.

Just be aware that your lens was never designed to work
well at close focusing distances, and hence your results
may not be as sharp as they could be.

But what you will definitely get is a very good
demonstration of photomacrography; and if you just
happen to like it a lot that lens will be great in terms
of indicating which kind of a macro lens you'd want to
buy. For example, if it turns out that most the fun
things you do happen with the Tamron set to about 28mm
(or 60mm or 180mm) it'll be a pretty good clue!

--
Floyd L. Davidson http://www.apaflo.com/floyd_davidson
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska)
  #6  
Old October 19th 09, 02:25 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
David Ruether[_3_]
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Posts: 681
Default Extension rings for macro


"Bruce" wrote in message ...
On Mon, 19 Oct 2009 08:00:33 +0800, "Gerrit"
wrote:


I wish to buy a set of rings to give macro capability to my camera.
I have a Nikon D50 body married to a Tamron AF LD 28-200 lens.
My question to all you knowledgeable people is this: would a Kenko Automatic
Extension Tube Set DG for Nikon AF be suitable and would all the functions
on the D50 be enabled?


Yes, this should work. But the lens will not be capable of producing
good, sharp results with the extension tubes. A dedicated macro lens
would give much better results.


The above is correct, but ***sometimes*** some combinations
of a ***good*** zoom and an achromat (a 2-element close-up
lens attached to the front of the lens), when used at some FLs, and
with the lens stopped down quite a bit (and either on a tripod or with
flash to make that possible) can produce good sharpness with a
zoom for taking macro photos. With the Tamron, playing with its
zoom range, focus, and aperture settings ***may*** produce a
combination with a not-too-strong achromat that is reasonably sharp
for the OP's purposes - but a dedicated macro lens would be an
easier (and likely better) solution. BTW, if an auto diaphragm is not
needed, old enlarger lenses adapted to tubes or a bellows can be
an inexpensive way to making sharp close-up images...
--DR


  #7  
Old October 19th 09, 11:03 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Troy Piggins[_31_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33
Default Extension rings for macro

* Gerrit wrote :
I wish to buy a set of rings to give macro capability to my camera.
I have a Nikon D50 body married to a Tamron AF LD 28-200 lens.
My question to all you knowledgeable people is this: would a Kenko Automatic
Extension Tube Set DG for Nikon AF be suitable and would all the functions
on the D50 be enabled?


G'day mate. My take on it is this. A 28-200 lens with extension
tubes will allow you to focus much closer than the lens can do
without, but it won't be macro sort of magnifications. I don't
think you'll be able to achieve 1:1 lifesize.

A commonly recommended cheap macro kit is something like a 50mm
prime lens with a full set of extension tubes (about 68mm). That
will give you 1:1 magnification, true macro. Not sure about
Nikkor, but I know the Canon 50mm f/1.8 is very reasonably priced
a around AU$100-$150.

Personally, I wouldn't buy the tubes and 50mm lens, though.
Well, actually I did do this originally. What I mean to say is I
wouldn't do that if I had my time again. I'd just get a true
macro lens first up. Something around 100mm focal length. I
have the Canon 100mm f/2.8, but have experience with the Sigma
105mm and the Tamron 90mm. Both are excellent and cheaper than
the Canon. I'm sure you'd find the same with Nikkors. That
focal length is a good balance of affordability and working
distance. These true macro lenses give you 1:1 magnification at
minimum focus distance and are much easier to use than the
extension tubes plus normal lens.

Plus, if and when you do get hooked on macro, if you buy the
extension tubes then, on lenses around 100mm focal length you can
get 2:1 magnification.

Next time we'll talk about lighting

--
Troy Piggins
  #8  
Old October 20th 09, 01:28 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
David J. Littleboy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,618
Default Extension rings for macro


"Troy Piggins" wrote in message
...
* Gerrit wrote :
I wish to buy a set of rings to give macro capability to my camera.
I have a Nikon D50 body married to a Tamron AF LD 28-200 lens.
My question to all you knowledgeable people is this: would a Kenko
Automatic
Extension Tube Set DG for Nikon AF be suitable and would all the
functions
on the D50 be enabled?


G'day mate. My take on it is this. A 28-200 lens with extension
tubes will allow you to focus much closer than the lens can do
without, but it won't be macro sort of magnifications. I don't
think you'll be able to achieve 1:1 lifesize.


With a 28mm or longer extension tube, you should be able to get to 1:1 at
28mm. You may not like the results, though. Wide angle lenses are especially
poor at close focus.

Another approach is closeup lenses. The single-element ones are OK (if you
don't mind CA), but on a good lens, the apochromatic (multi-element) ones
can be very good. I have a 67mm Kenko apochromatic 2-diopter (or "500") that
performs very well on the Canon 70-200/4.0 IS and the 5D2. It's not 1:1, but
it's OK for flowers and things that are 3x5" and larger. The subject ends up
at 500mm from the sensor plane, and I can adjust magnification with the
zoom. (With closeup lenses, the longer the lens, the greater the
magnification. Extension tubes are the opposite.) But holding the subject
within the range the lens can focus is a pain. See below.

A commonly recommended cheap macro kit is something like a 50mm
prime lens with a full set of extension tubes (about 68mm). That
will give you 1:1 magnification, true macro. Not sure about
Nikkor, but I know the Canon 50mm f/1.8 is very reasonably priced
a around AU$100-$150.

Personally, I wouldn't buy the tubes and 50mm lens, though.
Well, actually I did do this originally. What I mean to say is I
wouldn't do that if I had my time again. I'd just get a true
macro lens first up.


Agreed. Completely.

The reason, though, is not only quality. With extension tubes and/or closeup
lenses, the range one can focus over is extremely narrow. With a real macro
lens, you just aim at the thing you are thinking of shooting and the AF
grabs it. Want a different magnification? Move in closer or back off. With
zoom + tubes and/or closeup lenses you have to stay the exact same distance
away. This is, of course, not a problem with stationary subjects and a
tripod (if you have a macro rail), but a friggin bear handheld.

Something around 100mm focal length. I
have the Canon 100mm f/2.8, but have experience with the Sigma
105mm and the Tamron 90mm. Both are excellent and cheaper than
the Canon. I'm sure you'd find the same with Nikkors. That
focal length is a good balance of affordability and working
distance. These true macro lenses give you 1:1 magnification at
minimum focus distance and are much easier to use than the
extension tubes plus normal lens.


There's a new Tamron 60/2.0 macro lens for APS-C cameras only. The f/2.0
makes focusing easier, and the 60mm focal length gives you similar
compositions/perspectives you'd get with a 100mm lens on FF. (Actually, it
is better than a 100mm on FF, since you get a magnification effect due to
the crop (or due to the finer pixel pitch for people who perversely insist
on that distinction)). This guy should also be a good portrait lens on
APS-C.

--
David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan


  #9  
Old October 20th 09, 01:03 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Troy Piggins[_31_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33
Default Extension rings for macro

* David J. Littleboy wrote :

"Troy Piggins" wrote in message
...
[---=| Quote block shrinked by t-prot: 8 lines snipped |=---]

G'day mate. My take on it is this. A 28-200 lens with extension
tubes will allow you to focus much closer than the lens can do
without, but it won't be macro sort of magnifications. I don't
think you'll be able to achieve 1:1 lifesize.


With a 28mm or longer extension tube, you should be able to get to 1:1 at
28mm. You may not like the results, though. Wide angle lenses are especially
poor at close focus.

Another approach is closeup lenses. The single-element ones are OK (if you
don't mind CA), but on a good lens, the apochromatic (multi-element) ones
can be very good. I have a 67mm Kenko apochromatic 2-diopter (or "500") that
performs very well on the Canon 70-200/4.0 IS and the 5D2. It's not 1:1, but
it's OK for flowers and things that are 3x5" and larger. The subject ends up
at 500mm from the sensor plane, and I can adjust magnification with the
zoom. (With closeup lenses, the longer the lens, the greater the
magnification. Extension tubes are the opposite.) But holding the subject
within the range the lens can focus is a pain. See below.

A commonly recommended cheap macro kit is something like a 50mm
prime lens with a full set of extension tubes (about 68mm). That
will give you 1:1 magnification, true macro. Not sure about
Nikkor, but I know the Canon 50mm f/1.8 is very reasonably priced
a around AU$100-$150.

Personally, I wouldn't buy the tubes and 50mm lens, though.
Well, actually I did do this originally. What I mean to say is I
wouldn't do that if I had my time again. I'd just get a true
macro lens first up.


Agreed. Completely.

The reason, though, is not only quality. With extension tubes and/or closeup
lenses, the range one can focus over is extremely narrow. With a real macro
lens, you just aim at the thing you are thinking of shooting and the AF
grabs it. Want a different magnification? Move in closer or back off. With
zoom + tubes and/or closeup lenses you have to stay the exact same distance
away. This is, of course, not a problem with stationary subjects and a
tripod (if you have a macro rail), but a friggin bear handheld.

Something around 100mm focal length. I
have the Canon 100mm f/2.8, but have experience with the Sigma
105mm and the Tamron 90mm. Both are excellent and cheaper than
the Canon. I'm sure you'd find the same with Nikkors. That
focal length is a good balance of affordability and working
distance. These true macro lenses give you 1:1 magnification at
minimum focus distance and are much easier to use than the
extension tubes plus normal lens.


There's a new Tamron 60/2.0 macro lens for APS-C cameras only. The f/2.0
makes focusing easier, and the 60mm focal length gives you similar
compositions/perspectives you'd get with a 100mm lens on FF. (Actually, it
is better than a 100mm on FF, since you get a magnification effect due to
the crop (or due to the finer pixel pitch for people who perversely insist
on that distinction)). This guy should also be a good portrait lens on
APS-C.


All good points, David, and agree completely.

--
Troy Piggins
  #10  
Old October 20th 09, 03:17 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
David Ruether[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 681
Default Extension rings for macro


"Bruce" wrote in message ...
On Mon, 19 Oct 2009 09:25:24 -0400, "David Ruether"
wrote:
"Bruce" wrote in message ...
On Mon, 19 Oct 2009 08:00:33 +0800, "Gerrit"
wrote:


I wish to buy a set of rings to give macro capability to my camera.
I have a Nikon D50 body married to a Tamron AF LD 28-200 lens.
My question to all you knowledgeable people is this: would a Kenko Automatic
Extension Tube Set DG for Nikon AF be suitable and would all the functions
on the D50 be enabled?


Yes, this should work. But the lens will not be capable of producing
good, sharp results with the extension tubes. A dedicated macro lens
would give much better results.


The above is correct, but ***sometimes*** some combinations
of a ***good*** zoom and an achromat (a 2-element close-up
lens attached to the front of the lens), when used at some FLs, and
with the lens stopped down quite a bit (and either on a tripod or with
flash to make that possible) can produce good sharpness with a
zoom for taking macro photos.


I agree. I usually carry a B+W +1, +2 and +4 dioptre close-up set
with me for use only with fixed focal length lenses. But in general,
they don't tend to produce good results with 28-200mm lenses, which
tend to be at the edge of acceptability at the best of times (with the
sole exception of the Kiron 28-200mm).


Yes.

With the Tamron, playing with its
zoom range, focus, and aperture settings ***may*** produce a
combination with a not-too-strong achromat that is reasonably sharp
for the OP's purposes -


Perhaps, if the lens is stopped down to f/8 or f/11. it might be
*almost* acceptable.


I would say "f11-f16" or more...;-)
BTW, I've had excellent results with the Nikkor 200mm f4 (compact
version - non-zoom, non-macro, stopped well down) on tele converters
and/or with tubes and/or with an achromat on the front. Good for up to
3X on full-frame (it is hard to tell from this small photo, but it is VERY
sharp, http://www.donferrario.com/ruether/w.../bugs/b55.jpg).

but a dedicated macro lens would be an
easier (and likely better) solution.


Always! ;-)


No disagreement here (at least with a zoom...;-)! 8^)

Plus, there are some very cheap used AIS 55mm f/2.8 Micro-Nikkors
out there.


Watch out for the common oil-on-diaphragm syndrome with these,
though... The AF 55 or 60 would be better since the front elements
are not as recessed, making lighting less of a problem. BTW, the
compact MF 90mm f2.8 Sigma was a very competent macro lens
(and I "stole" its close-up lens for use on the 200mm for taking the
fly photo, likely with added tele converter and tubes, hand-held with
flash [my hands were ***_FAR_*** steadier back then!]).

BTW, if an auto diaphragm is not
needed, old enlarger lenses adapted to tubes or a bellows can be
an inexpensive way to making sharp close-up images...


I doubt that many younger photographers, brought up on a diet of
program exposure and autofocus, would know where to start. :-(


I think you are right......;-)
--DR


 




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