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#31
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 19:00:09 -0600, M.L. wrote:
Forget Microsoft and Sony. Photostage Slideshow Maker http://www.nchsoftware.com/slideshow/index.html Hi M.L., Thank you for your helpful advice! PhotoStage SlideShow Producer v 1.12 looks like the only WinXP freeware suggested so far which can directly output DVD-Video format files from a combination of: a. digital pictures (from my digital camera) b. digital movies (from my digital camera) c. MP3 audio (ripped & encoded as MP3s off my WAV CDs) To be clear, all I'm looking for is Windows XP freeware that can take those three types of files as input and output DVD-Video format files (i.e., VIDEO_TS\*.IFO,*.VOB files). I'm not too worried if the program burns to DVD media (because ImgBurn freeware does that for me). I'm not even worried if the DVD-Video format files are larger than 4.7 GB because DVDShrink freeware will compress them back to fit on single-layer DVD media. The only step I don't want to manually do is the DVD-Video encoding (which we all know can be done using DVDFlick freeware but as I said, I've used that for years and it's problematic at best for me). I'll test whether PhotoStage SlideShow Producer can take, as input, my camera output to subsequently output DVD-Video format files. If it does, it will be the only suggested freeware that can do what Sonic MyDVD does today. |
#32
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 18:56:46 -0800, Bill Wells
wrote: On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 19:03:30 -0500, tony cooper wrote: I don't think you understand. *Any* program that creates a file that will be burned to a DVD may not result in a DVD that will not play on a particular DVD player. It's a *not* problem with MovieMaker or Picture Story 3; it's a problem with the compatibility of the DVD player and a DVD burned on a computer. Hi Tony, I think I understand, but, maybe I don't so I'll explain what I understand and others can more clearly tell me where I am mistaken. Here's what I've understood ever since DVD media came out: - You can put ANYTHING on DVD media ... - But that doesn't mean your average DVD player will play it ... - Your average DVD plays So what does your average DVD player play? - Most play only DVD-format files (IFO & VOB) - That means a mandatory VIDEO_TS at the top level (& optionally AUDIO_TS) - The AUDIO_TS folder is generally empty; the files are all in VIDEO_TS - In the VIDEO_TS folder are the mandatory IFO (information) files - You can read those IFO files with IFOedit freeware - In the VIDEO_TS folder are also VOB files (these are your video objects) - Essentially the IFO files act like a table of contents to the VOB files - Inside the VOB files are generally MPEG-2 encoded video streams - The audio streams inside the VOB are generally MPEG-1 encoded - The BUP (backup) files are just for the IFOs in case they're damaged ... etc... I can go on but the point is that I do think I understand the basics of what DVD-format data looks like, whether or not it's stored on DVD media. SUMMARY: If you're saying Microsoft Windows Movie Maker or Microsoft Picture Story 3 directly outputs these DVD-format files, then I stand corrected. - VIDEO_TS\{VIDEO_TS.IFO,VTS_O1_0.IFO,VTS_01_0.BUP,e tc.} No, they don't. But they don't claim they do, and you keep saying Microsoft is lying. The Microsoft programs will create a file that can be burned on to a DVD. Whether or not your DVD player will play those DVDs is not something Microsoft can claim. In my case, the files I create in the two Microsoft programs, that I burn to a DVD, play in one of my DVD players. They do not play in the other one, but I don't blame Microsoft. -- Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida |
#33
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 22:37:40 -0500, tony cooper wrote:
If you're saying Microsoft Windows Movie Maker or Microsoft Picture Story 3 directly outputs these DVD-format files, then I stand corrected. - VIDEO_TS\{VIDEO_TS.IFO,VTS_O1_0.IFO,VTS_01_0.BUP,e tc.} No, they don't. Thanks. That's what I was hoping to achieve. BTW, I'm aware that I can probably use something like DVD Flick to take the output that the Microsoft programs do output to convert it to DVD-Video format. And, I might have to go that route. But I was hoping to skip that extra step, mostly because I've used DVD Flick freeware for years and more often than I like, it takes 8 hours or it hangs forever or the sound is out of sync. But they don't claim they do, and you keep saying Microsoft is lying. Well, here's exactly what they say on their tutorial for "making DVDs": http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/u...savetodvd.mspx "Part of the tradition of home moviemaking is gathering the family around the TV to watch the movie. You donąt have to give up that tradition when you make the switch to digital video. You can save a Windows Movie Maker project to a high-quality video file, and then burn (or write) that file to a DVD using a DVD burner and video DVD burning program. You can then watch the DVD in almost any standard DVD player. DVDs are a great way to share movies with friends and family, and they make great gifts." Now, between you and me, they didn't directly LIE because everything they said is legally true .. but really .. we both know that the "high quality video" file output by Microsoft Windows Movie Maker is NOT a DVD-Video file. And, we both know that the chances of watching that non-DVD-Video movie "in almost any standard DVD player" is really really low. Now, we both also know that even a perfectly good DVD-Video format DVD won't play in every DVD player ... but c'mon ... you have to agree that Microsoft is asserting implications here that are patently untrue in practice. |
#34
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 18:56:46 -0800, Bill Wells
wrote: On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 19:03:30 -0500, tony cooper wrote: I don't think you understand. *Any* program that creates a file that will be burned to a DVD may not result in a DVD that will not play on a particular DVD player. It's a *not* problem with MovieMaker or Picture Story 3; it's a problem with the compatibility of the DVD player and a DVD burned on a computer. Hi Tony, I think I understand, but, maybe I don't so I'll explain what I understand and others can more clearly tell me where I am mistaken. Here's what I've understood ever since DVD media came out: - You can put ANYTHING on DVD media ... - But that doesn't mean your average DVD player will play it ... - Your average DVD plays So what does your average DVD player play? - Most play only DVD-format files (IFO & VOB) - That means a mandatory VIDEO_TS at the top level (& optionally AUDIO_TS) - The AUDIO_TS folder is generally empty; the files are all in VIDEO_TS - In the VIDEO_TS folder are the mandatory IFO (information) files - You can read those IFO files with IFOedit freeware - In the VIDEO_TS folder are also VOB files (these are your video objects) - Essentially the IFO files act like a table of contents to the VOB files - Inside the VOB files are generally MPEG-2 encoded video streams - The audio streams inside the VOB are generally MPEG-1 encoded - The BUP (backup) files are just for the IFOs in case they're damaged ... etc... I can go on but the point is that I do think I understand the basics of what DVD-format data looks like, whether or not it's stored on DVD media. SUMMARY: If you're saying Microsoft Windows Movie Maker or Microsoft Picture Story 3 directly outputs these DVD-format files, then I stand corrected. - VIDEO_TS\{VIDEO_TS.IFO,VTS_O1_0.IFO,VTS_01_0.BUP,e tc.} You're STILL mixing apples and oranges. Microsoft's Movie Maker does NOT create what you refer to as DVD-format files. Period. IF you have the right version of Microsoft's Vista there is an included SEPERATE program called Windows's DVD Maker. It comes with Vista Home Premium and Ultimate versions only. As you already know Microsoft is somewhat careless in how they state what their software does that only adds to the confusion. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/win...dvd-maker.aspx Movie Maker, will generate MPEG-2 files. The source of creating files that end up in a DVD's Video_TS folder. To further confuse the issue DVD Maker is supposedly capable of taking a project file from Movie Maker and will make a playable DVD from that or so others have told me, myself having Vista Business which does not include DVD Maker I don't know. Even if it did I would not use it since it is so limited in what it can do. I have played around with Microsoft's Movie Maker and it is garbage. True to Microsoft's legacy indifference for their customers the concept is good, but the implementation is horrible resulting in it being a very unstable program that will drive you crazy. More so if you try to add mixed file types to the timeline and if your project is more than a few minutes in length. Photo Story 3 can supposedly burn DVD's but only with a plug-in from Sonic that costs $20. http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/u...ryactives.mspx Surprise... looking at the Sonic site it hints that the plug-in only generates bland nearly featureless slideshow type presentations since Sonic offers an "advanced" option to tease you to buy their (dorky) MyDVD (I have version 9)which is really a Roxio product, a company they (Sonic) owns, which supports at least some true DVD features like chapters. I'll bet anything the basic plug-in does not. Having tried several versions of Roxio software over the years I'll add their products are at best one step above Microsoft's level of competence which isn't saying much. Besides Roxio has some of the most clumsy software out there. |
#35
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 19:47:59 -0800, Bill Wells
wrote: On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 22:37:40 -0500, tony cooper wrote: If you're saying Microsoft Windows Movie Maker or Microsoft Picture Story 3 directly outputs these DVD-format files, then I stand corrected. - VIDEO_TS\{VIDEO_TS.IFO,VTS_O1_0.IFO,VTS_01_0.BUP,e tc.} No, they don't. Thanks. That's what I was hoping to achieve. BTW, I'm aware that I can probably use something like DVD Flick to take the output that the Microsoft programs do output to convert it to DVD-Video format. And, I might have to go that route. But I was hoping to skip that extra step, mostly because I've used DVD Flick freeware for years and more often than I like, it takes 8 hours or it hangs forever or the sound is out of sync. But they don't claim they do, and you keep saying Microsoft is lying. Well, here's exactly what they say on their tutorial for "making DVDs": http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/u...savetodvd.mspx "Part of the tradition of home moviemaking is gathering the family around the TV to watch the movie. You dont have to give up that tradition when you make the switch to digital video. You can save a Windows Movie Maker project to a high-quality video file, and then burn (or write) that file to a DVD using a DVD burner and video DVD burning program. You can then watch the DVD in almost any standard DVD player. DVDs are a great way to share movies with friends and family, and they make great gifts." Now, between you and me, they didn't directly LIE because everything they said is legally true .. but really .. we both know that the "high quality video" file output by Microsoft Windows Movie Maker is NOT a DVD-Video file. And, we both know that the chances of watching that non-DVD-Video movie "in almost any standard DVD player" is really really low. Now, we both also know that even a perfectly good DVD-Video format DVD won't play in every DVD player ... but c'mon ... you have to agree that Microsoft is asserting implications here that are patently untrue in practice. Claim: "You can save a Windows Movie Maker project to a high-quality video file..." Truth: What Microsoft is talking about is creating a MPEG-2 file. Yes, their Movie Maker application does that. Still buggy and slow. Claim: "a DVD-Video file" Truth. I rarely see anyone so hung-up on a term. Hint. There is no specific thing as you keep referring to. The Video_TS structure containing VOB and other files is but ONE format that can be played off a DVD. With the right player you can encode a DVD to play a slideshow of just raw JPEG images, or DivX, even AVI or raw MPEG, even a mixture. The Video_TS structure is by far the most popular and most widely supported way to "burn" a DVD that has one or more videos and/or slideshow. Remember... a slideshow is really nothing but a string of still images converted to (usually) a MPEG-2 stream then made in VOB files. Big deal. I'll go way out on a limb and assume you know the difference between the various media formats like DVD- and DVD+. That is one reason a specific DVD may not play on some DVD players. Another reason is the bitrate. Most beginners encode too high thinking that will result in "better" image quality resulting in the DVD player stalling off and on if it is able to properly decode the files at all. As you can tell I'm no fan of Microsoft. They are simply using puffing. A common advertising style that lets say stretches the truth almost to the point it breaks. All software companies do it to some extent. Claim: Microsoft says it(DVD Maker)will create DVD's. Truth: Well to stretch the point, yes. Assuming you have the correct Vista version that includes DVD Maker which can (so I'm told) convert the completed Movie Maker files. Maybe I haven't made it clear yet. We're talking TWO separate programs Movie Maker comes in all versions of Vista, DVD Maker only comes with the Home Premium and Ultimate versions. So with Movie Maker you will get as far as making compliant MPEG-2 source files from WHICH another application can use to make the Video_TS file structure, but you can't do it with just Movie Make. If you have the RIGHT version of Vista, you also get DVD Maker which will make the Video_TS file structure. Claim: Chapters with DVD Maker? Truth: Only the Rube Goldberg method. Again I'm told, (I wouldn't be caught dead using Micrsoft crap) you have two choices, either accept default breaks where Microsoft puts them or go through the insane step of first making a separate project in Movie Maker for EACH Chapter then add these to DVD Maker, but (laughable) you still won't be able to add the chapter titles to any menu rendering any such attempt useless. Repeating until it sinks in === For video editing and even more importantly for DVD Authoring any and all Freeware solutions are crap and will not give you anything close to commercial grade DVD's. The reason is quite simple. Many of the more advanced programming tricks are copyright protected and no freeware author could afford to pay the royalties. It's been years since I checked. I think it's called the red book, if not some other color. Just to get the "book" which simply spells out the full specifications of the DVD format and HOW to code for it costs hundreds of dollars and isn't available to the general public even if you wanted to get a copy and then you would still need to be a professional grade programmer to understand the coding methods which are complex. The same is true for freeware video editors. The MPEG-2 encoding scheme is also copyright protected and to get a LEGAL copy royalties need to be paid to the owners. Again, something no freeware author can afford. So if that's what you're using and the result looks sort of crappy, now you know why. You're probably using a pirated knock-off decoder and the decoder/encoder is at the heart of any application that creates the necessary MPEG-2 files. A none standard encoder meaning some rip-off hack can introduce all kinds of issues into the files you need to make a DVD. Learning yet? |
#36
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
"tony cooper" wrote in message ... Best source for info on MovieMaker: http://www.papajohn.org/ Forgot to mention Photo Story 3...Papa John covers that well, too. It's free from Microsoft and makes DVD slide shows. http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/u...y/default.mspx -- Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida Photo story 3 is not entirely free if you want to burn a DVD. You have to buy a "Sonic" plugin that at best is a flakey bit of software that sometimes works, sometimes doesn't. What's wrong with spending a couple of bucks on ProShow? At least it works properly! D-Mac |
#37
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
Bill Wells wrote:
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 19:20:46 -0500, J. Clarke wrote: If it has to play on ANYONE's then you simply can't do it with a computer. This has nothing to do with the software. Some DVD players won't play a DVD+R no matter how it was burned. A few won't play a DVD-R no matter how it was burned. A few just plain don't like anything but a factory-pressed DVD. Some are even picky about brands. Hi John, OK. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you 'cuz you're the second person to tell me that Microsoft Windows MovieMaker does output DVD-Video format DVDs ... so, well, so I must be doing something wrong then. Let it be stated I KNOW not every DVD player plays every DVD-Video format DVD, even brand new DVD-Video format DVDs. We all know that. And yet you seem to be upset with Microsoft about this like they are somehow doing something different that causes this. Nobody has asserted that Windows Movie Maker will burn DVDs. It doesn't. That's not what it does, that's not what it is supposed to do. Its function is to edit video files. That is all it does. What you do with those video files after you have edited them is up to you. You need a different product to organize those files as required, generate the menus, and do the other things needed in order to create a DVD. In fact, as you noted, some DVD media is so crappy, it won't even burn properly no matter what you put on it (see this chart for the crappy ones): http://www.digitalfaq.com/media/dvdmedia.htm All I'm saying is that the Microsoft products don't seem to directly output 4.7GB DVD-Video format files (either NTSC or PAL). No, they do not. So what? Simply stated, if Microsoft tools don't directly output a top-level VIDEO_TS directory containing video object (VOB) and information (IFO) files, then the Microsoft products don't output DVD-Video data suitable to play on your average DVD player. Which "Microsoft tools"? Windows Movie Maker is not _supposed_ to do that anymore than Adobe Premiere or any other video editor is supposed to do that. The Microsoft tool for making DVDs is Windows DVD Maker, not Windows Movie Maker, and it is not available for XP. DVD authoring is a separate function from video editing. Why are you having so much trouble understanding this? Now maybe I'm wrong. And, if I am, I'll be glad 'cuz that means I can use the Microsoft product so please clarify for me. MY QUESTION: Are you saying Microsoft Windows Movie Maker outputs DVD-Video format data? (i.e., does MovieMaker create VIDEO_TS\{VIDEO_TS.IFO,VIDEO_TS.VOB} files?) No, I have never said that or anything that any reasonable person could have construed in that fashion. Windows Movie Maker creates files in a variety of formats incuding DV-AVI which should be accepeted by any DVD authoring program. Authoring the DVD is done using the DVD authoring program, not the video editor. -- -- --John to email, dial "usenet" and validate (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) |
#38
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 19:47:59 -0800, Bill Wells
wrote: On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 22:37:40 -0500, tony cooper wrote: If you're saying Microsoft Windows Movie Maker or Microsoft Picture Story 3 directly outputs these DVD-format files, then I stand corrected. - VIDEO_TS\{VIDEO_TS.IFO,VTS_O1_0.IFO,VTS_01_0.BUP,e tc.} No, they don't. Thanks. That's what I was hoping to achieve. BTW, I'm aware that I can probably use something like DVD Flick to take the output that the Microsoft programs do output to convert it to DVD-Video format. And, I might have to go that route. But I was hoping to skip that extra step, mostly because I've used DVD Flick freeware for years and more often than I like, it takes 8 hours or it hangs forever or the sound is out of sync. But they don't claim they do, and you keep saying Microsoft is lying. Well, here's exactly what they say on their tutorial for "making DVDs": http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/u...savetodvd.mspx "Part of the tradition of home moviemaking is gathering the family around the TV to watch the movie. You donąt have to give up that tradition when you make the switch to digital video. You can save a Windows Movie Maker project to a high-quality video file, and then burn (or write) that file to a DVD using a DVD burner and video DVD burning program. You can then watch the DVD in almost any standard DVD player. DVDs are a great way to share movies with friends and family, and they make great gifts." Now, between you and me, they didn't directly LIE because everything they said is legally true .. but really .. we both know that the "high quality video" file output by Microsoft Windows Movie Maker is NOT a DVD-Video file. And, we both know that the chances of watching that non-DVD-Video movie "in almost any standard DVD player" is really really low. Now, we both also know that even a perfectly good DVD-Video format DVD won't play in every DVD player ... but c'mon ... you have to agree that Microsoft is asserting implications here that are patently untrue in practice. Microsoft is guilty of no more than what is called in the law "puffery". (Look it up. It's a real legal term.) The term "high quality" is a user-defined term (unless they define it) and the quality is high enough for most home movie applications. Any software program I've ever seen or read about does the same as Microsoft. What I don't understand is that you seem to want high quality output that will work on any DVD, but you are looking to create it for free. If it's that important to you, pop for a real program. You want professional results without being willing to pay for the professionalism. Nor do I understand why you keep turning down suggestions to try the various programs that have been suggested. You don't seem to have attempted to use either MovieMaker or Picture Story 3, and really have no idea if they will work for your application or not. It's no big deal to download, install, and try a program. You just uninstall if they don't work. -- Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida |
#39
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slideshow
tony cooper wrote:
The problem is that not all DVD players will play DVDs made on computers no matter what program creates the DVD. If you create a DVD on your computer, and it plays on your computer, you don't really know that it will play on a DVD player hooked to a television. I have two DVD players; each connected to a different TV set. One plays DVDs I create on the computer and the other doesn't. I have no idea what the difference is in players. You can probably find out which CD and DVD formats each of your DVD players supports by searching he http://www.videohelp.com/dvdplayers VideoHelp.com - DVD Player and Blu-ray Player Compatibility List Susan -- Posted to alt.comp.freeware Search alt.comp.freeware (or read it online): http://www.google.com/advanced_group....comp.freeware Pricelessware & ACF: http://www.pricelesswarehome.org Pricelesswa http://www.pricelessware.org (not maintained) |
#40
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Freeware to mix photos & music & video to create a DVD slide show
On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:11:04 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:
Nobody has asserted that Windows Movie Maker will burn DVDs. Its function is to edit video files. That is all it does. You need a different product to organize those files Hi John, It's OK now. I appreciate the clarification (and I apologize if I didn't understand initially). I think we totally agree on the main points. I somehow thought when I asked for a 1:1 freeware replacement for Sonic MyDVD that the suggested Microsoft Windows Movie Maker might be a perfect fit. That's all. Hence I was confused. I now know, and I think we all agree, that to replace the major functionality of Sonic MyDVD, we'd need to add two additional software actions to the output from Windows MovieMaker, the first to "organize" the output from Windows Movie Maker into DVD-Video format files, and the second to burn those DVD-Video format files to good-quality DVD media. For me, the first freeware choice of those two programs would be: 1. Feed JPEG + MP3 + MOV into Windows MovieMaker, then feed that to 2. DVD Flick - To convert to 4.7 GB DVD-Video format, then feed that to 3. ImgBurn - To burn the results to single-layer 4.7GB DVD media The good news is we now all agree on what Microsoft Windows MovieMaker does and doesn't do - and, we can agree, it's certainly not a 1:1 replacement to Sonic MyDVD, but, in defense of Windows Movie Maker, by adding this additional key functionality, it probably would be a decent replacement. Thanks for all your insight; it is much appreciated. |
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