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DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 17th 09, 08:54 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
[email protected]
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Posts: 17
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From

I'm neither for nor against DSLRs, though I've noticed that there is/has
been lots of smoke about this subject. To put it in a rather different
perspective, I'd like to outline why I have (perhaps a little reluctantly)
chosen to buy a non-DSLR. First of all, I've had a long-time interest in
photography, over the years having owned a number of DSL cameras as well as
having my own darkroom. Pressure of work (or rather commuting into London)
in the latter period of my working life meant that my absorbing interest in
photography was put on the back burner. My last DSL camera was a Pentax LX,
with assorted expensive glass (I still have them in my loft). Since I've now
retired and moved to the coast only fifteen miles from a UK National Park, I
soon felt the urge to revisit my interest in photography. I suppose I've
been lucky in that I've come back to photography at a time when DSLRs and
Bridge cameras can, with higher pixel counts, match that of yesteryear's
image resolution. On the other hand, the banking failures and recession has
had a severe impact on my disposable income, so I couldn't spend willy-nilly
on camera(s) and accessories. I've also a wife who is very much a non-tekkie
who's limit is to adjust the zoom to frame her pictures but who does like to
be able to carry a camera that can take a "nice picture" which she sometimes
asks me to "blow-up". She does like to carry a camera when she goes out on
trips with the Women's Institute and Townswoman's Guild. So my choices were
already a little biased away from a DSLR. I was able to do some leisurely
research into what was available and at what cost. I did know that the DSLR
would offer an ability to buy new lenses but that it would soon become an
expensive extension to my hobby - and one that I felt I couldn't really
justify. I joined a local camera club and went out with them (at first
without camera) on some of their outings to see what others were using and
to what effect. They're very much a mixed bunch, ranging from
"point-and-shooters" through those who humped around a camera bag filled
with camera plus several lenes, to a few who were able to produce beautiful
images, pin-sharp (in the right areas) even when used to priduce large A3
prints. The first thing that struck me was that most of the DSLRers, like me
weren't able to afford extra lenses, and a good few who had the lenses but
rarely used them. I was impressed by the results of one guy who owned a
Canon Powershot G9 who (like me) found it hard to justify the expense of an
extensive assemblage of photographic kit - though he admitted that he had at
the beginning been sorely tempted to jump on the DSLR band-waggon. Our club
is fortunate in having some "old school" photographers to whom the results
were what mattered and not what equipment you carried. I won't go into all
the factors that swung me for or against the DSLR school, but the ability of
my new-found friend's ability to intelligently use aperture-priority and
shutter-priority with his G9 swung me in his direction. Canon had relatively
recently replaced the G9 with the G10, and its 14.7 mega-pixel imaging did
influence me, and at the time I finally puchased one when the price was
dropping when bought on-line. Now, in retrospect, I believe (in my
circumstances) that I have made the best choice. This has been confirmed now
that I've learned (from ny new-found friend) the advantages of shooting in
RAW, automatically bracketing each exposure, and then using Photomatix to
retain detail throuogh both shadows and highlights. The big downside with
the G10 is the noise that is introduced at 14.7 mpx at all but low ISO
settings, but now I have purchased an inexpensive tripod and an inexpensive
wireless electronic remote control (off EBay) I find it easy to work-around
the noise problem. I have noticed that DSLR owners also suffer (to a lesser
extent) suffer from this noise problem. All in all, I'm very pleased with my
decision to get the G10 rather than an entry-level DSLR at the same price,
and my wife is not intimidated by the various controls (I set my G10 to Auto
when I put it away!). I do find it bizarre tht so many of our camera club
members (as well as some here) rubbish anyone who does not have/buy a DSLR
and seem to view their camera selection as a sort of kudos. I can't speak
for those here, but certainly in my Camera Club, most of those who denigrate
the non-DSLR (aka Bridge camera) owners don't achieve/apply any advantage to
their image making. I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.
  #2  
Old October 17th 09, 11:21 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
N[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 362
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From


wrote in message
...
I'm neither for nor against DSLRs, though I've noticed that there is/has
been lots of smoke about this subject. To put it in a rather different
perspective, I'd like to outline why I have (perhaps a little reluctantly)
chosen to buy a non-DSLR. First of all, I've had a long-time interest in
photography, over the years having owned a number of DSL cameras as well
as
having my own darkroom. Pressure of work (or rather commuting into London)
in the latter period of my working life meant that my absorbing interest
in
photography was put on the back burner. My last DSL camera was a Pentax
LX,
with assorted expensive glass (I still have them in my loft). Since I've
now
retired and moved to the coast only fifteen miles from a UK National Park,
I
soon felt the urge to revisit my interest in photography. I suppose I've
been lucky in that I've come back to photography at a time when DSLRs and
Bridge cameras can, with higher pixel counts, match that of yesteryear's
image resolution. On the other hand, the banking failures and recession
has
had a severe impact on my disposable income, so I couldn't spend
willy-nilly
on camera(s) and accessories. I've also a wife who is very much a
non-tekkie
who's limit is to adjust the zoom to frame her pictures but who does like
to
be able to carry a camera that can take a "nice picture" which she
sometimes
asks me to "blow-up". She does like to carry a camera when she goes out on
trips with the Women's Institute and Townswoman's Guild. So my choices
were
already a little biased away from a DSLR. I was able to do some leisurely
research into what was available and at what cost. I did know that the
DSLR
would offer an ability to buy new lenses but that it would soon become an
expensive extension to my hobby - and one that I felt I couldn't really
justify. I joined a local camera club and went out with them (at first
without camera) on some of their outings to see what others were using and
to what effect. They're very much a mixed bunch, ranging from
"point-and-shooters" through those who humped around a camera bag filled
with camera plus several lenes, to a few who were able to produce
beautiful
images, pin-sharp (in the right areas) even when used to priduce large A3
prints. The first thing that struck me was that most of the DSLRers, like
me
weren't able to afford extra lenses, and a good few who had the lenses but
rarely used them. I was impressed by the results of one guy who owned a
Canon Powershot G9 who (like me) found it hard to justify the expense of
an
extensive assemblage of photographic kit - though he admitted that he had
at
the beginning been sorely tempted to jump on the DSLR band-waggon. Our
club
is fortunate in having some "old school" photographers to whom the results
were what mattered and not what equipment you carried. I won't go into all
the factors that swung me for or against the DSLR school, but the ability
of
my new-found friend's ability to intelligently use aperture-priority and
shutter-priority with his G9 swung me in his direction. Canon had
relatively
recently replaced the G9 with the G10, and its 14.7 mega-pixel imaging did
influence me, and at the time I finally puchased one when the price was
dropping when bought on-line. Now, in retrospect, I believe (in my
circumstances) that I have made the best choice. This has been confirmed
now
that I've learned (from ny new-found friend) the advantages of shooting in
RAW, automatically bracketing each exposure, and then using Photomatix to
retain detail throuogh both shadows and highlights. The big downside with
the G10 is the noise that is introduced at 14.7 mpx at all but low ISO
settings, but now I have purchased an inexpensive tripod and an
inexpensive
wireless electronic remote control (off EBay) I find it easy to
work-around
the noise problem. I have noticed that DSLR owners also suffer (to a
lesser
extent) suffer from this noise problem. All in all, I'm very pleased with
my
decision to get the G10 rather than an entry-level DSLR at the same price,
and my wife is not intimidated by the various controls (I set my G10 to
Auto
when I put it away!). I do find it bizarre tht so many of our camera club
members (as well as some here) rubbish anyone who does not have/buy a DSLR
and seem to view their camera selection as a sort of kudos. I can't speak
for those here, but certainly in my Camera Club, most of those who
denigrate
the non-DSLR (aka Bridge camera) owners don't achieve/apply any advantage
to
their image making. I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.


How do feel about writing legible prose?


  #3  
Old October 17th 09, 03:09 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
David Ruether[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 681
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From


"N" wrote in message . au...
wrote in message ...


[.....]
I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.


How do feel about writing legible prose?


What an odd comment to make about an intelligently written
detailed description of the author's camera selection process...
--DR


  #4  
Old October 17th 09, 03:38 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Floyd L. Davidson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,138
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From

"David Ruether" wrote:
"N" wrote in message . au...
wrote in message ...


[.....]
I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.


How do feel about writing legible prose?


What an odd comment to make about an intelligently written
detailed description of the author's camera selection process...


You should put a smiley on your jokes. Somebody will think
you're serious.

--
Floyd L. Davidson http://www.apaflo.com/floyd_davidson
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska)
  #5  
Old October 17th 09, 04:07 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
David Ruether[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 681
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From


"Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ...
"David Ruether" wrote:
"N" wrote in message . au...
wrote in message ...


[.....]
I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.


How do feel about writing legible prose?


What an odd comment to make about an intelligently written
detailed description of the author's camera selection process...


You should put a smiley on your jokes. Somebody will think
you're serious.
--
Floyd L. Davidson


But, I *was* serious... Note that commenting on the style of
writing in posts is more than a little OT, and that in this particular
case, the OP is from the UK and writing in a style that may be
unfamiliar to "Ah-mare-ih-kunz" (which is to say, he is writing
in "real English", unlike what most of us do here - hence the
unfamiliarity with his style...;-). He was quite capable of writing
well and expressing what he wished to, and he did so IMHO...
--DR


  #6  
Old October 17th 09, 04:20 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Robert Coe
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,901
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From

On Sat, 17 Oct 2009 14:13:45 +0100, "P&S Pete"
wrote:
:
: wrote in message
: ...
: I'm neither for nor against DSLRs, though I've noticed that there is/has
: SNIP
:
: Paragraph breaks are your friends.
:
: BTW, noise is visible on the lower pixel-density G9 at above ISO 200 - I
: shudder to think what it's like on the G10.
: Canon's decision to reduce pixel density on the G11 is a brave and welcome
: move, IMHO.

A few observations:

The OP's long, rambling disquisition suggests a lingering uncertainty about
his choice. At the same time, he did his homework and is apparently satisfied,
at least for now.

Since the OP is retired, he probably has grandchildren. Maybe things have
improved in more recent G-series cameras, but the shutter lag on my G-5 made
it very difficult to take pictures of small children. What you saw was never
what you got.

The controls on my G-5 and those on the XTi I bought two years later were as
nearly identical as the cameras' slightly different feature sets would allow.
Indeed, my impression is that the controls are fairly similar across Canon's
entire product line. So I'm puzzled that the OP considered the layout of the
controls to be an issue.

Bob
  #7  
Old October 17th 09, 04:30 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Floyd L. Davidson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,138
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From

"David Ruether" wrote:
"Floyd L. Davidson" wrote in message ...
"David Ruether" wrote:
"N" wrote in message . au...
wrote in message ...


[.....]
I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.


How do feel about writing legible prose?


What an odd comment to make about an intelligently written
detailed description of the author's camera selection process...


You should put a smiley on your jokes. Somebody will think
you're serious.
--
Floyd L. Davidson


But, I *was* serious... Note that commenting on the style of
writing in posts is more than a little OT, and that in this particular
case, the OP is from the UK and writing in a style that may be
unfamiliar to "Ah-mare-ih-kunz" (which is to say, he is writing
in "real English", unlike what most of us do here - hence the
unfamiliarity with his style...;-). He was quite capable of writing
well and expressing what he wished to, and he did so IMHO...
--DR


His writing was not legible. No paragraphs, no continuity.

--
Floyd L. Davidson http://www.apaflo.com/floyd_davidson
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska)
  #8  
Old October 17th 09, 05:52 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Ray Fischer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,136
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From

wrote:
I'm neither for nor against DSLRs, though I've noticed that there is/has
been lots of smoke about this subject. To put it in a rather different
perspective, I'd like to outline why I have (perhaps a little reluctantly)
chosen to buy a non-DSLR.


1) Don't care
2) There are many fine P&S cameras if you can live with the limitations
3) There are many fine dSLR cameras if you can live with the limitations
4) It's your camera and your money - you don't have to justify yourself.
5) Pictures count - cameras don't.

--
Ray Fischer


  #9  
Old October 17th 09, 07:07 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Tony Cooper
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,748
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From

On Sat, 17 Oct 2009 10:09:23 -0400, "David Ruether"
wrote:


"N" wrote in message . au...
wrote in message ...


[.....]
I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.


How do feel about writing legible prose?


What an odd comment to make about an intelligently written
detailed description of the author's camera selection process...
--DR

"Legible" was the wrong word because that indicates visual aspect of
the letters. However, the writing could certainly benefit from the
use of the "enter" key to delineate paragraphs.


--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
  #10  
Old October 17th 09, 07:50 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
David Ruether[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 681
Default DSLR or Not - Or Where I've Come From


"tony cooper" wrote in message ...
On Sat, 17 Oct 2009 10:09:23 -0400, "David Ruether"
wrote:
"N" wrote in message . au...
wrote in message ...


[.....]
I can't help but remember (and compare) the problems
that film cameras used to have with the film-speed/noise issues. Then, I
learned to shoot in 64ASA Kodachrome with a tripod to get those sharp
noise/grain-free images of yesteryear.


How do feel about writing legible prose?


What an odd comment to make about an intelligently written
detailed description of the author's camera selection process...
--DR


"Legible" was the wrong word because that indicates visual aspect of
the letters. However, the writing could certainly benefit from the
use of the "enter" key to delineate paragraphs.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida


Ah, shucks, wutz rong wi' th' "streem-o'-consciousness"
ah-proech, 'specially inna NG post - wich iz naht a sy-en-tiffic
pay-pr, ner nuttin'...! 8^) (The post wasn't long enough to
warrant chapters, let alone paragraphs...)
--DR


 




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