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Warm tone papers and developers



 
 
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  #11  
Old March 29th 06, 03:54 AM posted to rec.photo.darkroom
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Default Warm tone papers and developers


"Bogdan Karasek" wrote in message
...
Hi,

What should I know about this Agfa 120? It can't be
available anymore since Agfa gave up on us, unless you
have a stash. The warm tone developer I use is AGFA
Neutal WA. I'm down to my two 500ml bottles Neutal WA.
For me Neutal WA and Agfa Classic and 1:9 Selelium is the
wand for making magic.

Now Agfa is kaput. Have to get a new wand

Cheers,
Bogdan

Lew wrote:

The instruction sheets for the two papers I'll be trying
(Arista & Forte) recommend Dektol, why not a warm tone
developer (like Agfa 120)? Also, I goofed and mixed
the120 with sodium, not potassium carbonate. Will this
make a big difference?
-LS


--
__________________________________________________ ________________
Bogdan Karasek
Montr‚al, Qu‚bec e-mail:

Canada



Agfa/Ansco 120 is not so much a warm tone developer as a
"soft" developer, meant to produce somewhat lower contrast
than standard developers. I employs Metol as the sole
developing agent. Kodak Selectol Soft is probably nearly
identical.
Most warm tone developers, like Kodak D-52, are simply
less active than neutral/cold tone ones like Dektol/D-72.
However, there are some special developers, like the Agfa
Hydroquinone and Hydroquinone and Glycin developers I posted
a day or so ago, that produce noticably warmer tones than
the low activity ones. I am pretty sure Neutol WA is one of
these but can't be sure because Agfa MSDS often leave out
some ingredients. If you can mix your own, and can obtain
Glycin, I suggest trying Agfa/Ansco 115, which I posted
earlier. If you can't find it I will post again or send it
to you via e-mail.
As far as commercially packaged developers, Ilford now
has a warm tone and a cold tone developer sold under the
Harmon name. I have no idea of what is in these but they are
certainly worth a try. Check the Ilfordphoto web site for
details.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA



  #12  
Old March 29th 06, 04:59 AM posted to rec.photo.darkroom
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Default Warm tone papers and developers

When the hydroquinone only formula I posted earlier in this thread made no
discernable difference in my neutral toned paper, I added more carbonate to
shorten the developing times & now I can't tell the difference between it
and Dektol. (Begging the question: what does metol do?)
-LS

"Richard Knoppow" wrote in message
ink.net...

Agfa/Ansco 120 is not so much a warm tone developer as a "soft"
developer, meant to produce somewhat lower contrast than standard
developers. I employs Metol as the sole developing agent. Kodak Selectol
Soft is probably nearly identical.
Most warm tone developers, like Kodak D-52, are simply less active than
neutral/cold tone ones like Dektol/D-72. However, there are some special
developers, like the Agfa Hydroquinone and Hydroquinone and Glycin
developers I posted a day or so ago, that produce noticably warmer tones
than the low activity ones. I am pretty sure Neutol WA is one of these but
can't be sure because Agfa MSDS often leave out some ingredients. If you
can mix your own, and can obtain Glycin, I suggest trying Agfa/Ansco 115,
which I posted earlier. If you can't find it I will post again or send it
to you via e-mail.
As far as commercially packaged developers, Ilford now has a warm tone
and a cold tone developer sold under the Harmon name. I have no idea of
what is in these but they are certainly worth a try. Check the Ilfordphoto
web site for details.


  #13  
Old March 29th 06, 08:10 AM posted to rec.photo.darkroom
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Posts: n/a
Default Warm tone papers and developers

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 08:02:55 -0500, "Greg \"Blank\" - Lizard King."
wrote:

In article ,


Now Agfa is kaput. Have to get a new wand

Cheers,
Bogdan


Formulate.


These companies should be made to publish their older information to
the web so that it would be accessible but instead their taking their
technologies to their graves.

==
John S. Douglas
Photographer & Webmaster
www.legacy-photo,com
www.xs750.net
  #14  
Old March 29th 06, 08:23 AM posted to rec.photo.darkroom
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Default Warm tone papers and developers

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 22:59:31 -0500, "Lew" wrote:

(Begging the question: what does metol do?)


It help initiate the development (reduction) cascade. It also enables
processing at lower temperature than possible with most other
chemicals. Lastly, it help develop film speed by raising the to of the
film.

==
John S. Douglas
Photographer & Webmaster
www.legacy-photo,com
www.xs750.net
  #15  
Old March 29th 06, 03:23 PM posted to rec.photo.darkroom
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Default Warm tone papers and developers

"John" wrote:

These companies should be made to publish their older information to
the web so that it would be accessible but instead their taking their
technologies to their graves.


Ah ha! Exactly!

To keep manufacturing secrets from going to the grave the Lord created
patents. The inventor has to tell all to get protection. The inventor
would get no protection if the government [that's us] could get away
with it and patents don't exist in communist countries.

It is a myth that the patent system is there to protect the noble
inventor from the cruel world. There would be no secret syrup for making
Coke
if it had been patented.


  #16  
Old March 30th 06, 11:52 PM posted to rec.photo.darkroom
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Default Warm tone papers and developers


"Nicholas O. Lindan" wrote in message
ink.net...
"John" wrote:

These companies should be made to publish their older
information to
the web so that it would be accessible but instead their
taking their
technologies to their graves.


Ah ha! Exactly!

To keep manufacturing secrets from going to the grave the
Lord created
patents. The inventor has to tell all to get protection.
The inventor
would get no protection if the government [that's us]
could get away
with it and patents don't exist in communist countries.

It is a myth that the patent system is there to protect
the noble
inventor from the cruel world. There would be no secret
syrup for making Coke
if it had been patented.



Patents were intended to make technical developments
public after a time by allowing the inventor to have a
monopoly for a relatively short time. In the US its 17 years
from the date of issuance although there is some protection
as soon as a patent is applied for. Under some circumstances
current patents can run for 20 years.
One can also protect a process or mechanism as a trade
secret. There is a considerable body of law about trade
secrets so they are actually afforded considerable
protection. The decision as to whether to patent or not
depends on the expected life of an idea. For instance, in
the past, film manufacturers kept the exact details of
emulsion making extremely secret. About 40 years ago the
rapidity of the development of new techniques and methods
led them to patent such information because it was not
expected to be useful much beyond the patent life. It _is_
possible to get around a trade secret but not a patent.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA



  #17  
Old March 30th 06, 11:52 PM posted to rec.photo.darkroom
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Posts: n/a
Default Warm tone papers and developers


"Lew" wrote in message
t...
When the hydroquinone only formula I posted earlier in
this thread made no discernable difference in my neutral
toned paper, I added more carbonate to shorten the
developing times & now I can't tell the difference between
it and Dektol. (Begging the question: what does metol do?)
-LS

"Richard Knoppow" wrote in
message
ink.net...

Snipping...
Metol is a very efficient electron transfer agent.
Hydroquinone by itself is a very low activity developer.
When used at quite high pH it is suitable for very high
contrast developers but cab be a fine grain (and brown tone)
developer at lower pH provide one is willing to deal with
the great emulsion speed loss caused by its inefficiency.
In most Metol-Hydroquinone formulas the Metol is the
primary developing agent. The two agents in combination are
super-additive over a range of pH, meaning the resulting
densities are greater than either agent would produce by
itself. The combination also has a mutual regenerating
effect. At low pH, as in D-76, the regenerating effect
exists but the super additive effect does not. D-76 is
nearly as effective with the Hydroquinone left out.
Metol, OTOH, works well by itself and is an effective
developer even at neutral pH (as in D-25).


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA



 




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