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LA life / Space shuttle



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 13th 12, 10:58 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Alan Browne
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Posts: 12,640
Default LA life / Space shuttle


Some interesting photos coming out of LA as they move the shuttle from
LAX to its new home. A logistical nightmare with some amusing side effects:

The plan:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...74/route_1.jpg

Of course you recognize this sign from driving school:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...move-again.jpg

Of course everyone has to take a snapshot:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../74/camera.jpg

A little perspective is nice:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...s/74/delay.jpg

Some guys can't keep their shadows out:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_29.jpg

No plan ever survives execution:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...ht-squeeze.jpg

New highway standards are needed:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...orum-photo.jpg

"Keeping up with the Jones's is getting a bit out of hand."
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_24.jpg

Watch for predators:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_25.jpg

Nuthin' special:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...4/traymond.jpg

All of the above from the LA Times
(Watch for the Toyota advert as at one point a Toyota Tundra was used to
tow the shuttle for a short segment over a highway...)
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../endeavour.jpg


--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald

  #2  
Old October 14th 12, 12:15 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
the Legend of LAX
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default LA life / Space shuttle

On 10/13/2012 2:58 PM, Alan Browne wrote:

Some interesting photos coming out of LA as they move the shuttle from
LAX to its new home. A logistical nightmare with some amusing side
effects:

The plan:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...74/route_1.jpg

Of course you recognize this sign from driving school:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...move-again.jpg

Of course everyone has to take a snapshot:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../74/camera.jpg

A little perspective is nice:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...s/74/delay.jpg

Some guys can't keep their shadows out:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_29.jpg

No plan ever survives execution:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...ht-squeeze.jpg

New highway standards are needed:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...orum-photo.jpg

"Keeping up with the Jones's is getting a bit out of hand."
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_24.jpg

Watch for predators:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_25.jpg

Nuthin' special:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...4/traymond.jpg

All of the above from the LA Times
(Watch for the Toyota advert as at one point a Toyota Tundra was used to
tow the shuttle for a short segment over a highway...)
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../endeavour.jpg


Very cool!


--
Dale G Elhardt AG6MA
Cypress Ca
I welcome change. But I prefer bills.
http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=7702

  #3  
Old October 14th 12, 02:15 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Alan Browne
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12,640
Default LA life / Space shuttle

On 2012.10.13 19:15 , the Legend of LAX wrote:
On 10/13/2012 2:58 PM, Alan Browne wrote:

Some interesting photos coming out of LA as they move the shuttle from
LAX to its new home. A logistical nightmare with some amusing side
effects:

The plan:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...74/route_1.jpg

Of course you recognize this sign from driving school:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...move-again.jpg

Of course everyone has to take a snapshot:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../74/camera.jpg

A little perspective is nice:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...s/74/delay.jpg

Some guys can't keep their shadows out:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_29.jpg

No plan ever survives execution:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...ht-squeeze.jpg

New highway standards are needed:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...orum-photo.jpg

"Keeping up with the Jones's is getting a bit out of hand."
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_24.jpg

Watch for predators:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_25.jpg

Nuthin' special:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...4/traymond.jpg

All of the above from the LA Times
(Watch for the Toyota advert as at one point a Toyota Tundra was used to
tow the shuttle for a short segment over a highway...)
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../endeavour.jpg


Very cool!


They are - did you get shots at LAX?



--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald

  #4  
Old October 14th 12, 11:56 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
the Legend of LAX
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default LA life / Space shuttle

On 10/14/2012 6:15 AM, Alan Browne wrote:

They are - did you get shots at LAX?




I got some shots of it in the hangar, but nothing of it on the move.
From what I have seen, there were some spectacular shots to be had
during the move. (Btw, it arrived at its new home an hour or so ago.)

Here is a link to a small website I put up. The second page is mostly
detail reference shots for model builders. In the last picture of the
first page, you can see me shooting the landing. I'm fourth from the right.

http://home.roadrunner.com/~laxet3/


--
Dale G Elhardt AG6MA
Cypress Ca
I welcome change. But I prefer bills.
http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=7702

  #5  
Old October 15th 12, 12:09 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Alan Browne
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12,640
Default LA life / Space shuttle

On 2012.10.14 18:56 , the Legend of LAX wrote:

Here is a link to a small website I put up. The second page is mostly
detail reference shots for model builders. In the last picture of the
first page, you can see me shooting the landing. I'm fourth from the right.

http://home.roadrunner.com/~laxet3/


Some nice shots there!

--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald

  #6  
Old October 15th 12, 03:09 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Robert Coe
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,901
Default LA life / Space shuttle

On Sun, 14 Oct 2012 19:09:06 -0400, Alan Browne
wrote:
: On 2012.10.14 18:56 , the Legend of LAX wrote:
:
: Here is a link to a small website I put up. The second page is mostly
: detail reference shots for model builders. In the last picture of the
: first page, you can see me shooting the landing. I'm fourth from the right.
:
: http://home.roadrunner.com/~laxet3/
:
: Some nice shots there!

I've often wondered what it must feel like to fly a 747 with that beast on its
back. I'd think that a plane that top-heavy would flip over at the slightest
erroneous tweak of the roll angle. I suppose what you have to do is fly the
entire trip on autopilot and hope like hell that the programmers got it right.

Loading the plane with extra weight might increase stability, but then how
would you get it off the ground? One hopes that the next generation of
spaceships will be able to take off as well as land.

Is it a pipe dream that the shuttle's wings themselves may contribute to roll
resistance, at least in level flight? An aeronautical engineer I'm not,
obviously.

Bob
  #7  
Old October 15th 12, 09:53 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Alan Browne
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12,640
Default LA life / Space shuttle

On 2012.10.14 22:09 , Robert Coe wrote:

I've often wondered what it must feel like to fly a 747 with that beaston its
back. I'd think that a plane that top-heavy would flip over at the slightest
erroneous tweak of the roll angle. I suppose what you have to do is flythe


1. Aircraft do not operate on buoyancy so it's not like a ship with a
narrow buoyancy vector. It's a plane with wide wings and ailerons
far out near the tips (though at cruise altitude/speed only spoilers
are used for roll control to avoid adverse yaw).

2. The shuttle itself adds stability with its own wings and vertical
stabilizer.

3. The weight is not as much an issue as the raised drag vector.
But the shuttle itself is fairly aerodynamic, so not that bad.
Easily compensated.

4. The operating altitude is reduced because of the drag, the
aircraft can't maintain enough airspeed for the thinner air at
altitude. This will effect range because fuel consumption is higher
at lower altitude.

An "issue" is the turbulence generated by the shuttle on the 747's
rudder. For that they've added fins to the horizontal stabilizer and
the tailcone to the shuttle to reduce drag and turbulence.

Here's another hint that it's a very stable rig: if it were not stable
the FAA would not let them fly it. Or if they gave them mission by
mission permission to fly an unstable airplane, they certainly would
never be allowed to do all the low flyovers of all the cities they've
been visiting over the last many months. They would be forced to fly
routes where an accident would minimize danger to people on the ground.

entire trip on autopilot and hope like hell that the programmers got itright.


I doubt they changed the autopilot code at all and I bet (with
appropriate simulator preparation) the pilots are comfortable with it.


Loading the plane with extra weight might increase stability, but then how
would you get it off the ground?


It's simply a matter of:

- is the weight within the envelope of the 747 (Y)
- is the aircraft able to reach takeoff speed with the available runway
(Y)
- are the elevators able to raise the nose for rotation at takeoff (Y)

(The high drag point of the shuttle may actually help in that regard).

One hopes that the next generation of
spaceships will be able to take off as well as land.


There have been and are various experiments in that direction.


Is it a pipe dream that the shuttle's wings themselves may contribute to roll
resistance, at least in level flight? An aeronautical engineer I'm not,
obviously.


They will contribute slightly to lift (no free lunch as that imposes
induced drag) and marginally to roll stabilty v. the wide wings of the 747.

Here are some other unusual aircraft "carriers" with horrible drag
profiles - though not as bad as the shuttle carriers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:P...Guppy_NASA.jpg
ex B-377 (piston powered)
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ppy-F-BPPA.jpg
same Boeing airframe but turbine engines. Carried Airbus fuselage
sections (A-300/310) around Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:A...New_Colour.JPG
Based on Airbus A-300. Carries airbus fuselage sections around Europe.
(A-320/330/340/350).

--
"There were, unfortunately, no great principles on which parties
were divided – politics became a mere struggle for office."
-Sir John A. Macdonald



  #8  
Old October 15th 12, 11:36 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
the Legend of LAX
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default LA life / Space shuttle

On 10/14/2012 4:09 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2012.10.14 18:56 , the Legend of LAX wrote:

Here is a link to a small website I put up. The second page is mostly
detail reference shots for model builders. In the last picture of the
first page, you can see me shooting the landing. I'm fourth from the
right.

http://home.roadrunner.com/~laxet3/


Some nice shots there!

Thanks. Appreciate it.

--
Dale G Elhardt AG6MA
Cypress Ca
I welcome change. But I prefer bills.
http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=7702

  #9  
Old October 16th 12, 01:58 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Rich[_6_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,081
Default LA life / Space shuttle

Alan Browne wrote in
:


Some interesting photos coming out of LA as they move the shuttle from
LAX to its new home. A logistical nightmare with some amusing side
effects:

The plan:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...74/route_1.jpg

Of course you recognize this sign from driving school:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...-move-again.jp
g

Of course everyone has to take a snapshot:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../74/camera.jpg

A little perspective is nice:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...s/74/delay.jpg

Some guys can't keep their shadows out:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_29.jpg

No plan ever survives execution:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...ht-squeeze.jpg

New highway standards are needed:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...orum-photo.jpg

"Keeping up with the Jones's is getting a bit out of hand."
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_24.jpg

Watch for predators:
http://latimesphoto.files.wordpress....ttle_d2_25.jpg

Nuthin' special:
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e...4/traymond.jpg

All of the above from the LA Times
(Watch for the Toyota advert as at one point a Toyota Tundra was used
to tow the shuttle for a short segment over a highway...)
http://timelines.latimes.com/media/e.../endeavour.jpg



Would have been nice if they'd had some kind of replacement in-place
before killing the Shuttle. Now, it's "hat-in-hand" begging to the
Russians to launch American astronauts. I never thought I'd see this day
come...
  #10  
Old October 16th 12, 08:22 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
jdanield
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Posts: 31
Default LA life / Space shuttle

Le 15/10/2012 22:53, Alan Browne a écrit :


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:A...New_Colour.JPG
Based on Airbus A-300. Carries airbus fuselage sections around Europe.
(A-320/330/340/350).

and seen every days here in Toulouse (France) :-)

jdd
 




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