Teacher Recommendations

My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think a
cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to bring
the film to room temperature before use.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Richard

On Oct 11, 11:32 am, "Richard" wrote:
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think a
cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to bring
the film to room temperature before use.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Richard

Richard,
Storing some of the film in the refridgerator would be a better
idea. Then it would only take a short while for the film to come back
to ambiant temp. The rest can be stored, for faster use, in a cool,
dry place.
If this is her first class a skylight or skylight filter would
be just protection of the front element. A K2 would be for after she
has done some developing and printing. So she can see the difference.

I hope she is captured by the magic of B&W and starts a life long
enjoyment of the art.

Draco


Enjoy today.

Tomorrow is promised to no one.

Richard wrote:
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

Fortepan 400 is really grainy stuff. One should always do
what the teacher requests, but for personal use, Fuji Neopan
400 is not that much more money and is very similar to Tri-X.
If price weren't important to me I'd use Ilford HP5 or
Kodak Tri-x.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think a
cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to bring
the film to room temperature before use.

I'd agree with you. If you are going to be using the film
in the next year, a cool dry place is best.
I do have a bunch of Ilford Pan-F in the freezer which I
bought when it looked like Ilford was in trouble.
It is past its expiry date now, but seems as good as new.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

I'd go for no filter at all for normal use, and use the
#8 (K2) filter or something stronger when I think
a filter would help. Many modern lenses have some
UV filtering built into the lens. (Leitz lenses have
had UV filtering since 1965 and Pentax lenses have
had UV filtering since they introduced SMC coating
around 1970 or 71.)

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Go easy on the teacher. You may be right about everything
and the teacher wrong, but the teacher is still the
teacher. Your daughter will have plenty of time to
learn better later, but she should follow the teacher
when she is in the class.

I think it is great that there are still teachers doing
film and darkroom instruction. These are little things.
They aren't really important, and she will have plenty
of time to learn better later.

Peter.
--

"Richard" wrote in message
...
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think
a
cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to bring
the film to room temperature before use.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Richard

Any time I've used a yellow filter, I've lost
contrast, so I most always use a red. But if the teacher says UV, then I
would use a UV. I've found the Efke from Croatia really nice high silver
content stuff while I had no luck at all with Forte. Terrible. But I still
use HP- 5. Bob Hickey

"Richard" wrote in message
...
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think
a cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to
bring the film to room temperature before use.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Richard

Keeping the film frozen will essentially keep it from aging. But letting it
get up to room temp before opening it is critical. I'd split the difference
and put it in the refrigerator.

The skylight or UV filter is mainly to protect the lens without having much
effect on the image. The K2 yellow will make skies and clouds look nice (the
red filter more so). I think the better idea would be for her to do a series
of pictures with different filters: A puffy cloud sky with yellow, red,
green, and blue; A rosebush with red rose and yellow rose, and the same
filters; and maybe a closeup portrait with the same filters. (Possibly even
a portrait with serious acne and the same filters, see which filter clears
up the blemishes best!)

I don't think either you or the teacher are out of touch-- just different
opinions!

"Richard" wrote in message
...
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

I would have done the same when Arista was Ilford. I only have limited
experience with Efke 100 in 127 and it wasn't pleasant.

For teaching quantity of film is more important than quality. And
more will be learned in figuring out how to pull decent results from
indecent film

The problem is that 1, 2, 3, ?? shots are going to be real keepers except
for the choice of film.

So maybe I would have instructed the class to get 30 rolls of Tmax 100 -
as Techpan is no more.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think
a cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to
bring the film to room temperature before use.

For the past many (some number greater than two) years I have been trying to
get "condensation damage": Every roll/cassette I take from the freezer gets
unwrapped, breathed on, put it in the camera and promptly used or had a
test shot taken. Sheet film I don't breath on, but otherwise
freezer - holder - camera. And it gets very humid in Cleveland.

Results: zip, zilch, nada, and nothing.

Emailed Kodak asking for an example of condensation damage ... no reply.
Asked Usenet, ditto.

My conclusion: there is no "condensation damage" ...

It's worse than "wait two hours after lunch before you go swimming";
I could connive a situation where the swimming advice fits.

Short of liquid Nitrogen I can't make anything happen by using fresh
frozen film.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

Only with puffy clouds, and a K2 doesn't do much in my opinion - can't tell
with from without. IMO, an Orange filter, at minimum, is needed for clouds
and does as well as a #25 red if both are being used w/o a polarizer.

I don't think a skylight filter will make any difference at all in
B&W shot at altitudes less than 10,000 feet.

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

The teacher is handing out the grades. You can let it go, the teacher
won't.

The teacher's sins are pretty minor as far as sins committed by
teachers go.

OTOH, in my book there is nothing wrong with not telling Teach all
the details of how the homework was really done as long as one did
it oneself.

Overdid it once ...

Had a University assignment of making a Daguerreotype-like photograph
using 35mm. I contacted a 4x5 negative. The Prof. suspected foul play.
I swore on my mother's grave that it _wasn't_ a MF shot. The Prof. was
satisfied. I discoursed on H&W developer and HCC film. Very impressed
the Prof. was. WTF: Daguerreotypes are 1:1 - no enlargement - where do
D'types fit with 35mm? Nothing else looked faintly Daguerrish. Maybe
I should have contacted 35mm. I dropped the course.



--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Darkroom Automation: F-Stop Timers, Enlarging Meters
http://www.darkroomautomation.com/index.htm
n o lindan at ix dot netcom dot com
"Richard" wrote in message
...
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think
a cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to
bring the film to room temperature before use.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Richard

"Richard" wrote in message
...
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.
I wonder why an Eastern European film? Surely Kodak, Ilford or Fuji would be
more consistent, so it would be easier to exclude film problems. I've never
used eastern european films, but if their quality is anything similar to
anything else made in eastern europe i'd avoid like the plague.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think
a cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to
bring the film to room temperature before use.
If it's going to be used before the expiry, then the fridge or even a cool
room will be fine. I keep all my film in the fridge, because a cool room in
my house will still be mid 30's celsius in the middle of summer.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.
Not sure why she'd mention a skylight - they are a slight warming filter,
only applicable for colour film. I think she's advising it's use purely as a
lens protector.
I would hope that at some point in the course the teacher will cover the use
of colour filters for contrast control. I generally use orange or yellow for
outdoor use, occasionally putting on a red filter. For really punchy
sky/cloud contrast a Polariser+Red will give you almost jet black skies &
bright white clouds.
I also use Green and Yellow/Green for portraits.

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Richard

"Peter Irwin" wrote in message
...
Richard wrote:
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

Fortepan 400 is really grainy stuff. One should always do
what the teacher requests, but for personal use, Fuji Neopan
400 is not that much more money and is very similar to Tri-X.
If price weren't important to me I'd use Ilford HP5 or
Kodak Tri-x.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think
a
cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to bring
the film to room temperature before use.

I'd agree with you. If you are going to be using the film
in the next year, a cool dry place is best.
I do have a bunch of Ilford Pan-F in the freezer which I
bought when it looked like Ilford was in trouble.
It is past its expiry date now, but seems as good as new.

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for
outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

I'd go for no filter at all for normal use, and use the
#8 (K2) filter or something stronger when I think
a filter would help. Many modern lenses have some
UV filtering built into the lens. (Leitz lenses have
had UV filtering since 1965 and Pentax lenses have
had UV filtering since they introduced SMC coating
around 1970 or 71.)

Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Go easy on the teacher. You may be right about everything
and the teacher wrong, but the teacher is still the
teacher. Your daughter will have plenty of time to
learn better later, but she should follow the teacher
when she is in the class.

I think it is great that there are still teachers doing
film and darkroom instruction. These are little things.
They aren't really important, and she will have plenty
of time to learn better later.

I agree with this.....Some of the best teachers I have had were
idiots.....But they got their classes to learn on their own just to show the
teacher "what for" if nothing else. I remember one teacher who was a
drunk....She missed every Monday morning, and during the rest of the week
she just stared at the rear wall of the classroom and never said
anything.....One third of the class left the first couple of days, and the
rest of us organized ourselves into study groups and learned all the
material on our own. It was great not having to put up with that other 1/3
who wasn't interested in learning anything anyway. And, it proved that old
adage: You can't learn anything from other people. Everything you really
learn in life, you learn on your own.

Richard wrote:
My 15 year old is taking a film course in HS. Her teacher had her order
about 30 rolls of an Eastern European BW 35mm film 400 ASA.

The teacher instructed the kids to store the film in the freezer. I think a
cool dark dry place is better since the kids don't take the time to bring
the film to room temperature before use.

Don't worry about it if she can understand that she should warm up the
film for a couple hours before hand. If she knows she's shooting the
next day, then take the film out the night before.

Did I mention common sense?

The teacher instructed the kids to use a skylight or UV filter for outdoor
use. I think a K2 yellow filter is the way to go.

Filter for effect. Skylight is somewhat useless for B&W,

UV will improve the contrast somewhat, esp for wide open landscapes.

Yellow for blue sky/clouds contrast

Orange for contrasts in the fall*

Green for outdoor portraits*

* Never tried orange and green filters myself.

Cheers,
Alan.






Am I out of touch or is it the teacher?

Richard




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Thanks for the feedback.

The film the teacher had us order is EDU Ultra ISO 400 35X24 Arista. It was
$1.89 a roll. I can't find any technical information on this film. I picked
up a used Nikormat and a 50mm 1.4 and a 105mm lens, both from Nikon. I
forgot how great a camera this is.

Richard