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On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said:
Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on the NEX is mind-boggling. That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other than hearsay that is. Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what setting do you use? Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options. My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been needed with my D300s. After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup & Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s, even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions. One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr. Giotto's handy "Rockets". -- Regards, Savageduck |
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On 12/10/2010 11:42 a.m., Savageduck wrote:
On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said: Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on the NEX is mind-boggling. That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other than hearsay that is. Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what setting do you use? Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options. My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been needed with my D300s. After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup & Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s, even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions. One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr. Giotto's handy "Rockets". I think he's got a D300. After 3 about years use, I finally had one speck of dust - just visible at f22 - that wouldn't budge with the ultrasonic cleaning, and I needed to wet clean it which took me about 3 minutes (I too had plenty of practice with D70). RichA is a bit nutty. One of the reasons that the Olympus is less troubled is that relative (to sensor size) distance between the filter and sensor is greater - also the reason why the original 5d was a huge pain in the arse for sensor dust - even worse than the D70. |
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On 2010-10-11 21:03:32 -0700, Rich said:
On Oct 11, 6:42*pm, Savageduck wrote: On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said: Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that Olympus pioneered in 2003. * The idea that cameras with sensors unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is insane. *I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be policed for it all the time. *That Sony doesn't have a good system on the NEX is mind-boggling. That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other than hearsay that is. Prolific? No, I wouldn't say that. Just noticeable from time to time. But I've been spoiled by the Olympus anti-dust system. As far as "evidence, reports and hearsay" that terminology sounds like Nikon- fan paranoia at work so I've said what I'm going to on it. I just haven't experienced a sensor dust problem with the D300 or D300s. As I said, the D70 is a different story and at times was a real PIA. How does making a remark regarding my satisfaction with one system from a manufacturer, and my dissatisfaction with the same manufacturer because of a lack of a function in a similar product, make me a paranoid "Nikon-fan"? I am old enough to know a good product from a mediocre one, and the D300s is a good, well functioning DSLR. From time to time I am disappointed with a manufacturer I favored in the past, but I don't whine about it. I buy the product which gives me the best cost/feature benefit I can afford. Sometimes I switch horses. With my move from 35mm to digital, I moved from Pentax and Yashica to Nikon (which I had never owned before) because of what at the time seemed a reasonable featuquality:value:cost set. The same thing applies to my car purchases. My costliest automotive education was a '75 Olds Cutlass. That damn car has soured me on GW ever since. I have owned several Fords, a Datsun, 2 Subarus, a VW, a BMW, a Chrysler, and 3 Mercedes, and my only regret was that damn Olds, and I do not consider myself a Ford-Chrysler-Datsun-VW-BMW-Subaru-Mercedes fan-boy. You have to be one of the most negative individuals in these groups. You withdraw whenever you are challenged on any issue. You throw out snide remarks on brand, or political bias without fear of retaliation whenever your xenophobic traits are exposed and challenged. You have yet to make any sort of constructive contribution of any type in these groups. -- Regards, Savageduck |
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On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 22:24:23 -0700, Savageduck
wrote: The same thing applies to my car purchases. My costliest automotive education was a '75 Olds Cutlass. That damn car has soured me on GW ever since. That's what you get for buying a knock-off Olds from GW. -- Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida |
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On 2010-10-11 22:28:44 -0700, tony cooper said:
On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 22:24:23 -0700, Savageduck wrote: The same thing applies to my car purchases. My costliest automotive education was a '75 Olds Cutlass. That damn car has soured me on GW ever since. That's what you get for buying a knock-off Olds from GW. Aaaaaagh! Phingrr Phawlt! -- Regards, Savageduck |
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On Mon, 11 Oct 2010 15:42:06 -0700, Savageduck
wrote: On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said: Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on the NEX is mind-boggling. That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other than hearsay that is. Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what setting do you use? Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options. My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been needed with my D300s. After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup & Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s, even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions. One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr. Giotto's handy "Rockets". My Olympus E1 which served me well for 3 years needed a clean once and a rocket blower did the job. My D300 on the other hand needs a regular wet clean far more often than my D5000 for example. Although very careful changing lenses I concluded that this is because the bigger lenses are more often than not on the D300 so more air is being moved around in the chamber increasing the chances of dust. I tend not to bother with small specks as cloning deals with them and I mostly do not stray into the smaller apertures. From time to time though with the D300 , say regular use every 4 months the swabs come out for a bit of open heart surgery. Its not worth worrying about, its like trying to keep your car clean, aint gonna happen for ever, and there is no 100% solution on the way anytime soon. Who really cares. What bothers me more is the cost of the swabs!! As for Nikons dust reference system .....yawn....life is too short! JY |
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On 2010-10-12 05:55:13 -0700, Bruce said:
Savageduck wrote: On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said: Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that Olympus pioneered in 2003. The idea that cameras with sensors unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is insane. I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be policed for it all the time. That Sony doesn't have a good system on the NEX is mind-boggling. That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other than hearsay that is. Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what setting do you use? Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options. My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been needed with my D300s. After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup & Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s, even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions. One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr. Giotto's handy "Rockets". My experience also. The D300 and D700 have never given me problems that the Giottos 'Rocket' cannot handle. (Chinese man very clever to call his brand "Giottos"!) Yup! I have three of them. One kept in each of the two bags I have, and one which keeps vanishing in and around the house. I have reduced my emergency cleaning kit to one of the neat Photographic Solutions kits. http://www.photosol.com/dskit.htm That is there for my peace of mind, not for any cleaning in the field, but useful when having that "Damn dust!" moment when back in the motel/hotel room after a day out tripping the shutter. My Canon EOS 5D bodies were a different matter and needed constant attention with PEC pads and brushes. The 5D sensors seemed to have a static charge which turned them into dust magnets. I had them both cleaned four times a year and that wasn't often enough. Leaving one lens (24-105mm f/4L IS) semi-permanently fitted didn't seem to help either. However, my worst ever DSLR for dust is the Kodak DCS Pro 14n. If it wasn't such a sheer delight to use in so many other ways (13.5 MP full frame, incredible sharpness, outstanding colour rendition) I would get rid of it because cleaning its sensor is such a thankless task. I do it myself because even my trusted technician seems unable to do as good a job as I can. :-( Yup! There were times it seemed I could use the D70 as one of those electronic ionizing air purifiers to remove dust and pollen from the local environment. However, the boy Rich is right about one thing. The Olympus anti-dust system is just about unbeatable. That's nice. I couldn't verify that one way or another, as I have no experience with any of the Olympus DSLR's. -- Regards, Savageduck |
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On 2010-10-12 10:33:57 -0700, RichA said:
On Oct 12, 11:33*am, Savageduck wrote: On 2010-10-12 05:55:13 -0700, Bruce said: Savageduck wrote: On 2010-10-11 14:40:56 -0700, RichA said: Pentax is now using the kind of ultrasonic sensor cleaning that Olympus pioneered in 2003. * The idea that cameras with sensors unprotected and close to them mouth of the bayonet not having it is insane. *I never, ever had any dust show up on my Olympus DSLRs and have only had one incidence of it with the G1, but the D300 has to be policed for it all the time. *That Sony doesn't have a good system on the NEX is mind-boggling. That is quite a slight of the D300(s). What evidence and reports of such prolific sensor dust problems do you have with the D300(s)? Other than hearsay that is. Do you actually have the "Dust removal" feature activated? If so, what setting do you use? Check your Setup menu & "Clean image sensor" options. My schooling with sensor dust removal and wet cleaning came with the D70, which is truly a dust magnet, and remains so. I remain awash in Eclipse fluid, PEC pads and sensor swabs, none of which have been needed with my D300s. After dealing with the D70 I am truly thankful to have a functioning dust removal system in the D300s. I have mine set to "Clean at startup & Shutdown" and I have never had to wet clean either my D300 or D300s, even after changing lenses in windy, dust filled conditions. One time I detected a piece of fluff through the viewfinder. That was in the chamber, on the mirror, and that was taken care of by one on Mr . Giotto's handy "Rockets". My experience also. *The D300 and D700 have never given me problems that the Giottos 'Rocket' cannot handle. *(Chinese man very clever to call his brand "Giottos"!) Yup! I have three of them. One kept in each of the two bags I have, and one which keeps vanishing in and around the house. I have reduced my emergency cleaning kit to one of the neat Photographic Solutions kits. http://www.photosol.com/dskit.htm That is there for my peace of mind, not for any cleaning in the field, but useful when having that "Damn dust!" moment when back in the motel/hotel room after a day out tripping the shutter. My Canon EOS 5D bodies were a different matter and needed constant attention with PEC pads and brushes. *The 5D sensors seemed to have a static charge which turned them into dust magnets. *I had them both cleaned four times a year and that wasn't often enough. *Leaving one lens (24-105mm f/4L IS) semi-permanently fitted didn't seem to help either. However, my worst ever DSLR for dust is the Kodak DCS Pro 14n. *If it wasn't such a sheer delight to use in so many other ways (13.5 MP full frame, incredible sharpness, outstanding colour rendition) *I would get rid of it because cleaning its sensor is such a thankless task. * I do it myself because even my trusted technician seems unable to do as good a job as I can. *:-( Yup! There were times it seemed I could use the D70 as one of those electronic ionizing air purifiers to remove dust and pollen from the local environment. You can actually build a better dust brush than the ones for sale. Get a cheap smoke detector, remove the Americium-241 source from it (alpha particle emitter) and attach it to a good sensor or lens brush. The alpha particles ionize the air and cause the static charge of the dust to be eliminated, allowing for easy removal of it. This is something like the old Polonium brushes made by various companies for vinyl records. Of course, brushing is what you'd do after using a non-contacting blower like the Rocket. Yup! I still have a 30 year old one of those brushes buried in with some of my audio stuff. ....and in my hand I have a still functioning Zerostat gun, also about 30+ years old. The grip is wrapped with 20+ year old masking tape! Now I wonder how much that would help de-ionizing the D70 chamber??? Might be worth a try. -- Regards, Savageduck |
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On 2010-10-12 13:51:16 -0700, John A. said:
On Tue, 12 Oct 2010 10:56:23 -0700, Savageduck wrote: On 2010-10-12 10:33:57 -0700, RichA said: On Oct 12, 11:33*am, Savageduck wrote: Le Snip Yup! There were times it seemed I could use the D70 as one of those electronic ionizing air purifiers to remove dust and pollen from the local environment. You can actually build a better dust brush than the ones for sale. Get a cheap smoke detector, remove the Americium-241 source from it (alpha particle emitter) and attach it to a good sensor or lens brush. The alpha particles ionize the air and cause the static charge of the dust to be eliminated, allowing for easy removal of it. This is something like the old Polonium brushes made by various companies for vinyl records. Of course, brushing is what you'd do after using a non-contacting blower like the Rocket. Yup! I still have a 30 year old one of those brushes buried in with some of my audio stuff. ...and in my hand I have a still functioning Zerostat gun, also about 30+ years old. The grip is wrapped with 20+ year old masking tape! Now I wonder how much that would help de-ionizing the D70 chamber??? Might be worth a try. What's the worst that could happen? ....er nothing. -- Regards, Savageduck |
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