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#301
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"Dallas" wrote in message news On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 18:32:37 -0700, Mark M wrote: So, getting back to what I said at the start of this silly exchange, Toyota may sell more cars than BMW, but that does not make them a leader in automotive technology. Oh. Surely you must know what DOES then. Please, master. Educate us. BMW doesn't have to prove anything to anyone, Mark. Then why bring up the Corolla?? Take a look at the Formula One racing series and compare BMW Williams' results with the very well funded Toyota team. BMWs are GREAT! Never said anything other than the fact that they have worse records in ONE---SINGLE---ELEMENT...reliability of their modern vehicles, compared with Toyota's modern vehicles. Are there any other "goofy" comparisons you would like to add to the mix and then accuse me of making? BMWs and Land Cruisers are both considered top tier vehicles, and therefore are within the realm of valid comparison. Land Cruisers are not cars. They are all-terrain vehicles. I was specifically referring to cars. Oooooh. I forgot you get to set up new rules as we go.. That's just funny. I'm smiling at my screen again. Sedans. People carriers. BTW, I think the BMW X5 will kick the Land Cruiser's ass. Around a corner? Absolutely. BMW wins! Hooray for BMW. THey do make some fine, fine automobiles. Over the boulders and mud and etc.? We both know which we'd prefer to drive (and they'd both be the same choice), but who cares?? -Even BMW doesn't make your silliest of claims. Why is everything a ****ing contest with you, Dallas? Most companies have areas of expertise, and they lack in other areas. BMW is better at some things, and Toyota is better at others. -Just like Canon and Nikon. Both are good. Some aspects outshine the other's. Each vehicle (camera, lens...) has it's characteristics that share both "better-than," and "not-as-good-as" aspects, depending upon which product they are compared with. You keep claiming "victory" for this and that unrelated thingy... Why? You decided to throw in the lowliest of all Toyotas-not because it was relevant, but because it suited your fancy. -This is the argumentation of desperation. You would be graded quite poorly in a debate contest. You wouldn't even make the team, fella. Wrong again. I was top debater in my university class. -But let's not make the mistake of comparing these silly thread rants of ours with formal debate... There is simply no comparison. |
#302
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"Dallas" wrote in message news On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 18:32:37 -0700, Mark M wrote: So, getting back to what I said at the start of this silly exchange, Toyota may sell more cars than BMW, but that does not make them a leader in automotive technology. Oh. Surely you must know what DOES then. Please, master. Educate us. BMW doesn't have to prove anything to anyone, Mark. Then why bring up the Corolla?? Take a look at the Formula One racing series and compare BMW Williams' results with the very well funded Toyota team. BMWs are GREAT! Never said anything other than the fact that they have worse records in ONE---SINGLE---ELEMENT...reliability of their modern vehicles, compared with Toyota's modern vehicles. Are there any other "goofy" comparisons you would like to add to the mix and then accuse me of making? BMWs and Land Cruisers are both considered top tier vehicles, and therefore are within the realm of valid comparison. Land Cruisers are not cars. They are all-terrain vehicles. I was specifically referring to cars. Oooooh. I forgot you get to set up new rules as we go.. That's just funny. I'm smiling at my screen again. Sedans. People carriers. BTW, I think the BMW X5 will kick the Land Cruiser's ass. Around a corner? Absolutely. BMW wins! Hooray for BMW. THey do make some fine, fine automobiles. Over the boulders and mud and etc.? We both know which we'd prefer to drive (and they'd both be the same choice), but who cares?? -Even BMW doesn't make your silliest of claims. Why is everything a ****ing contest with you, Dallas? Most companies have areas of expertise, and they lack in other areas. BMW is better at some things, and Toyota is better at others. -Just like Canon and Nikon. Both are good. Some aspects outshine the other's. Each vehicle (camera, lens...) has it's characteristics that share both "better-than," and "not-as-good-as" aspects, depending upon which product they are compared with. You keep claiming "victory" for this and that unrelated thingy... Why? You decided to throw in the lowliest of all Toyotas-not because it was relevant, but because it suited your fancy. -This is the argumentation of desperation. You would be graded quite poorly in a debate contest. You wouldn't even make the team, fella. Wrong again. I was top debater in my university class. -But let's not make the mistake of comparing these silly thread rants of ours with formal debate... There is simply no comparison. |
#303
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On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 17:47:11 -0700, Mark M wrote:
"Dallas" wrote in message news On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 18:29:04 -0700, Mark M wrote: BTW, it seems that you have a huge interest in what I have to say. No, but I notice you enough to form an opinion that I voice. Ooh. Not interested in me or what I have to say, but here we are, s double reply to my offensive posts. Why *do* you bother? The trouble in arguing with you, Dallas, is that you really don't catch the subtleties of the language. I grow tired of re-wording things so that you understand them. This comment is just absolutely ridiculous. You are about as subtle as a Tequila Slammer, Mark. And you're intellectually challenged to boot. I call you on a statement you make and you try to turn it around to save face. Doesn't work, buddy. Go out and take some photos. -- Dallas www.dallasdahms.com "You know you're right! You're bloody well right! You've bloody got a right to say!" ~ Supertramp |
#304
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On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 17:47:11 -0700, Mark M wrote:
"Dallas" wrote in message news On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 18:29:04 -0700, Mark M wrote: BTW, it seems that you have a huge interest in what I have to say. No, but I notice you enough to form an opinion that I voice. Ooh. Not interested in me or what I have to say, but here we are, s double reply to my offensive posts. Why *do* you bother? The trouble in arguing with you, Dallas, is that you really don't catch the subtleties of the language. I grow tired of re-wording things so that you understand them. This comment is just absolutely ridiculous. You are about as subtle as a Tequila Slammer, Mark. And you're intellectually challenged to boot. I call you on a statement you make and you try to turn it around to save face. Doesn't work, buddy. Go out and take some photos. -- Dallas www.dallasdahms.com "You know you're right! You're bloody well right! You've bloody got a right to say!" ~ Supertramp |
#305
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On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 18:02:43 -0700, Mark M wrote:
BMW doesn't have to prove anything to anyone, Mark. Then why bring up the Corolla?? Because IMO although they may be big sellers, they are not in the same class as BMW's. BMWs are GREAT! Never said anything other than the fact that they have worse records in ONE---SINGLE---ELEMENT...reliability of their modern vehicles, compared with Toyota's modern vehicles. Which is TOTAL bull****, to the nth degree. A sweeping statement with no basis in reality at all. A figment of Mark Morgan's imagination. I'll bet you've never driven one, just like you've never shot with a Nikon camera either (but you have a HELLUVA lot to say about both). Land Cruisers are not cars. They are all-terrain vehicles. I was specifically referring to cars. Oooooh. I forgot you get to set up new rules as we go.. That's just funny. I'm smiling at my screen again. Yes, I see that often in movies about lunatics. Wrong again. I was top debater in my university class. -But let's not make the mistake of comparing these silly thread rants of ours with formal debate... There is simply no comparison. I'm willing to bet my whole photography setup that you have just made a bald faced lie. The proof of the pudding is in the eating, Mark, and thus far all we're seeing from you is flop after flop. You couldn't debate your way around a traffic fine. Get a life. -- Dallas www.dallasdahms.com "You know you're right! You're bloody well right! You've bloody got a right to say!" ~ Supertramp |
#306
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On Thu, 23 Sep 2004 18:02:43 -0700, Mark M wrote:
BMW doesn't have to prove anything to anyone, Mark. Then why bring up the Corolla?? Because IMO although they may be big sellers, they are not in the same class as BMW's. BMWs are GREAT! Never said anything other than the fact that they have worse records in ONE---SINGLE---ELEMENT...reliability of their modern vehicles, compared with Toyota's modern vehicles. Which is TOTAL bull****, to the nth degree. A sweeping statement with no basis in reality at all. A figment of Mark Morgan's imagination. I'll bet you've never driven one, just like you've never shot with a Nikon camera either (but you have a HELLUVA lot to say about both). Land Cruisers are not cars. They are all-terrain vehicles. I was specifically referring to cars. Oooooh. I forgot you get to set up new rules as we go.. That's just funny. I'm smiling at my screen again. Yes, I see that often in movies about lunatics. Wrong again. I was top debater in my university class. -But let's not make the mistake of comparing these silly thread rants of ours with formal debate... There is simply no comparison. I'm willing to bet my whole photography setup that you have just made a bald faced lie. The proof of the pudding is in the eating, Mark, and thus far all we're seeing from you is flop after flop. You couldn't debate your way around a traffic fine. Get a life. -- Dallas www.dallasdahms.com "You know you're right! You're bloody well right! You've bloody got a right to say!" ~ Supertramp |
#307
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"William Graham" wrote in message news:zoH4d.10709$He1.1596@attbi_s01... "Nick C" wrote in message news:GJm4d.86445$MQ5.8069@attbi_s52... wrote in message ... (TP) wrote: The bike I saw was the R1150RT, and if I was in the market for a bike, I would buy this one in an instant: http://www.bmw-motorrad.co.uk/gb/en/...rers_main.html ============================= Beware of the Ninja! http://www.kawasakimotorcycle.org/ninja-zx-12r.php Cody, Egads, just think what would happen to the trim if, in an emergency, the rider had to lay the bike down to avoid a more serious accident. nick If you're serious, very few bikers would lay a bike down to avoid a more serious accident. No Bill, I can't agree with you. Learning how to lay a bike down, at least learning the fundamentals of how to do it, should be learned by anyone who seriously takes to riding bikes. I'm thankful I took the time and trouble to learn how to do it. If I hadn't I would have surely killed an old lady crossing the street or killed myself in another accident. I was riding a Triumph at the time (my favorite Brit bike) and was leaving a main thoroughfare going onto a narrow two way side street, I was gearing down to go slower but I was doing 40 at the time, when an old lady way passed her 60's stepped off the curb at a stop-lightless intersection and started to walk across the street. I was very close to the intersection when she stepped into the street and instinctively I knew I was going to hit her. There was no way I could go around her. Time and distance didn't permit me to accelerate and go around her by entering the outer incoming lane, I couldn't jump the curb and get around her (cars parked). Not once did she look up and see me coming before she stepped off the curb. Elderly people often live in a world of their own, oblivious to their surrounding and this old lady must have been deep in her world. But she was legally crossing at an intersection where due to there being no stoplight, all traffic must stop for pedestrians crossing the street. I knew, in those flashing moments, I was going to hit her and no doubt kill her. The only alternative I had was to lay the bike down, aiming the bike way ahead of her, towards the stopped incoming traffic at the other side of the intersection. Quickly I shifted my body weight, geared into neutral, and applied the rear brake which brought the rear wheel into a sliding skid to the left, and down I went, on my right side. Normally, as you know, the bike will skid away from the rider as the rider falls free of the bike. Only this time, that didn't happen. Some how, my right levi pant leg got snagged onto the bike, I don't know how it did but it did, and I was dragged across the intersection with the bike until the bike and I hit the curb. I think the distance was about 45 or more feet. When the bike and I stopped, I recall the following happening to me, in these sequence of events. As I laid beneath the bike, on the ground, I looked at the old lady and she was still crossing the street, never looking up to see what had happened. A crowd of people started gathering around me but no one was attempting to lift the bike off me. Then I heard a siren and looked up, seeing a chrome bumper and a grill. The engine sputtered and died. Then I passed out. I awoke in a hospital emergency room, the right side of my body, from my hip to the elbow of my right arm was heavily bandaged where the skin had been scrapped off my body. The doctor informed my of my physical condition, then proceeded to tell me the week before, the cops brought in a biker who was DOA. Great news to hear. But the doctor did tell me the cops who brought me to the hospital, when questioning the people who witnessed the accident, thought I was a hero of sorts for choosing to lay the bike down rather than hitting and killing the old lady. There was a second time I had to lay a bike down. I was riding a BMW at the time, going to the Minolta repair center to get my two Minoltas repaired. As I was riding down the ally-way, taking a short cut, a truck backed up into the ally blocking my way. I again laid the bike down and this time I fell free of the bike. The bike continued its skid under the truck and I just rolled to the side. The handlebar, tank, and saddle bags were badly damaged. The cylinder was protected by the crash bar I had installed ahead of the engine, but it was bent. I was fine. I was a little stiff but was undamaged. If I hadn't laid the bike down I would have broadsided the truck, possibly shearing my body, if not, without question, being seriously hurt. No way Bill can I agree with you, about not learning the importance of how to lay a bike down. It's just a matter of learning how to shift body weight, hitting the gearing and at the same time hit the rear brake. Timing is very important. Those who choose not to consider the possibility of an emergency arising may end up DOA'ing themselves or someone else. Sure, the "beasts" want to stay upright. g That's all the more reason to learn how to intentionally lay a bike down. Of course, if a fellow never had to lay a bike down, there will be no apparent reason to consider the thought. nick A motorcycle stops fastest when its got the rubber on the road, just like a car.....Also, they do not lay down easily, unless you are in a very hard turn, in which case they are effectively laid down anyway, but even there, it is seldom the case that the rider lays them down intentionally....Stunt riders will sometimes lay them down intentionally, but only at very slow speeds. At high speeds they are almost impossible to lay down....The beasts just insist on remaining upright...(Thank God) |
#308
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"William Graham" wrote in message news:zoH4d.10709$He1.1596@attbi_s01... "Nick C" wrote in message news:GJm4d.86445$MQ5.8069@attbi_s52... wrote in message ... (TP) wrote: The bike I saw was the R1150RT, and if I was in the market for a bike, I would buy this one in an instant: http://www.bmw-motorrad.co.uk/gb/en/...rers_main.html ============================= Beware of the Ninja! http://www.kawasakimotorcycle.org/ninja-zx-12r.php Cody, Egads, just think what would happen to the trim if, in an emergency, the rider had to lay the bike down to avoid a more serious accident. nick If you're serious, very few bikers would lay a bike down to avoid a more serious accident. No Bill, I can't agree with you. Learning how to lay a bike down, at least learning the fundamentals of how to do it, should be learned by anyone who seriously takes to riding bikes. I'm thankful I took the time and trouble to learn how to do it. If I hadn't I would have surely killed an old lady crossing the street or killed myself in another accident. I was riding a Triumph at the time (my favorite Brit bike) and was leaving a main thoroughfare going onto a narrow two way side street, I was gearing down to go slower but I was doing 40 at the time, when an old lady way passed her 60's stepped off the curb at a stop-lightless intersection and started to walk across the street. I was very close to the intersection when she stepped into the street and instinctively I knew I was going to hit her. There was no way I could go around her. Time and distance didn't permit me to accelerate and go around her by entering the outer incoming lane, I couldn't jump the curb and get around her (cars parked). Not once did she look up and see me coming before she stepped off the curb. Elderly people often live in a world of their own, oblivious to their surrounding and this old lady must have been deep in her world. But she was legally crossing at an intersection where due to there being no stoplight, all traffic must stop for pedestrians crossing the street. I knew, in those flashing moments, I was going to hit her and no doubt kill her. The only alternative I had was to lay the bike down, aiming the bike way ahead of her, towards the stopped incoming traffic at the other side of the intersection. Quickly I shifted my body weight, geared into neutral, and applied the rear brake which brought the rear wheel into a sliding skid to the left, and down I went, on my right side. Normally, as you know, the bike will skid away from the rider as the rider falls free of the bike. Only this time, that didn't happen. Some how, my right levi pant leg got snagged onto the bike, I don't know how it did but it did, and I was dragged across the intersection with the bike until the bike and I hit the curb. I think the distance was about 45 or more feet. When the bike and I stopped, I recall the following happening to me, in these sequence of events. As I laid beneath the bike, on the ground, I looked at the old lady and she was still crossing the street, never looking up to see what had happened. A crowd of people started gathering around me but no one was attempting to lift the bike off me. Then I heard a siren and looked up, seeing a chrome bumper and a grill. The engine sputtered and died. Then I passed out. I awoke in a hospital emergency room, the right side of my body, from my hip to the elbow of my right arm was heavily bandaged where the skin had been scrapped off my body. The doctor informed my of my physical condition, then proceeded to tell me the week before, the cops brought in a biker who was DOA. Great news to hear. But the doctor did tell me the cops who brought me to the hospital, when questioning the people who witnessed the accident, thought I was a hero of sorts for choosing to lay the bike down rather than hitting and killing the old lady. There was a second time I had to lay a bike down. I was riding a BMW at the time, going to the Minolta repair center to get my two Minoltas repaired. As I was riding down the ally-way, taking a short cut, a truck backed up into the ally blocking my way. I again laid the bike down and this time I fell free of the bike. The bike continued its skid under the truck and I just rolled to the side. The handlebar, tank, and saddle bags were badly damaged. The cylinder was protected by the crash bar I had installed ahead of the engine, but it was bent. I was fine. I was a little stiff but was undamaged. If I hadn't laid the bike down I would have broadsided the truck, possibly shearing my body, if not, without question, being seriously hurt. No way Bill can I agree with you, about not learning the importance of how to lay a bike down. It's just a matter of learning how to shift body weight, hitting the gearing and at the same time hit the rear brake. Timing is very important. Those who choose not to consider the possibility of an emergency arising may end up DOA'ing themselves or someone else. Sure, the "beasts" want to stay upright. g That's all the more reason to learn how to intentionally lay a bike down. Of course, if a fellow never had to lay a bike down, there will be no apparent reason to consider the thought. nick A motorcycle stops fastest when its got the rubber on the road, just like a car.....Also, they do not lay down easily, unless you are in a very hard turn, in which case they are effectively laid down anyway, but even there, it is seldom the case that the rider lays them down intentionally....Stunt riders will sometimes lay them down intentionally, but only at very slow speeds. At high speeds they are almost impossible to lay down....The beasts just insist on remaining upright...(Thank God) |
#309
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"TP" wrote in message ... "William Graham" wrote: If you're serious, very few bikers would lay a bike down to avoid a more serious accident. A motorcycle stops fastest when its got the rubber on the road, just like a car.....Also, they do not lay down easily, unless you are in a very hard turn, in which case they are effectively laid down anyway, but even there, it is seldom the case that the rider lays them down intentionally....Stunt riders will sometimes lay them down intentionally, but only at very slow speeds. At high speeds they are almost impossible to lay down....The beasts just insist on remaining upright...(Thank God) I was lucky to be trained by a police motor cycle driving instructor, and part of the instruction was how to lay the bike down to escape a more serious accident. I had to use the technique twice; basically it was more about stepping off than laying down. You had to slow down as much as possible for exactly the reason you stated above; at high speeds the gyroscopic effect meant they would just carry on in a (fairly) straight line. I'm with you on this Tony. But I'd like to say that while you are correct in saying "it's more like stepping off" the bike rather than laying it down, I place the difference between stepping off a bike as to laying it down to be about 30 mph. When "up in my cups" and riding, especially when some friends and I were hunting rabbits in the fields by racing along side a rabbit and jumping off the bike onto the rabbit, I've often whooped it up by stepping off a bike while the bike may have been going about 20 mph or so. But laying a bike down at speeds of about 50 or so is just that, " laying a bike down" while at the same time getting the body into a rolling spin. It ain't fun but it's the only game to play when you have to play it. A bike will stay upright in a straight line at greater speeds, even when gearing down (depending upon speed, how far down you gear, and road surface), but it will not say straight if the front brake is applied by itself, or the rear brake applied by itself (without the shifting of body weight to prevent skidding). If at high speed the front brake only is applied, depending upon the road surface, the bike will dip greatly and slip out from under. If the rear wheel brake only is applied, the bike will wobble (again, depending upon surface condition) the rear end will attempt to swing around (if body weight shifts uncontrolled) and at a given moment will unpredictably flip and go down. I've seen beginners flip a bike about 5 feet into the air because they didn't apply the brakes properly. I didn't learn from the local police how to control shift body weight and bring the rear wheel around to skid and lay down a bike. I learned how to do that from old time bikers who played games by accelerating towards a brick wall and before hitting the wall, bring the bike around to where the one whose rear wheel just touches the wall and stops (rider still on the bike) wins the beer. If done properly, the rider would just step off the bike when it stopped, but many a rider had to lay the bike down right at the critical moment when they realized they were going too fast to bring the rear wheel around to just touching the wall. Grinning There's people who ride bikes, and there's bikers. In my 16 years or so of riding bikes, I went from riding a bike to become a biker. After a while, I transcended from being a professional during the week to becoming a biker when the weekends rolled around. One time I promised my wife I would give it up, no more bikes, and I did. A year or so later, friend brought his new bike to the house for me to see. It was a "Hog" and it was a beauty. We chewed the fat a while, admiring the bike, then he offered to let me ride it. I rejected the offer, knowing how my wife feels about bikes. But he convinced me and I hopped on and rode that puppy. About 20 minutes later, I telephoned the house and asked my wife to drive Frank (my buddy) to the bike shop where I had just bought a new Kawasaki (my favorite Japanese bike). Yeah, I heard it and heard it, over and over again from my wife. I finally sold the and never bought another. But I still update and maintain my license to ride a bike. I don't know how long I'll be doing it but one never knows. nick |
#310
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"TP" wrote in message ... "William Graham" wrote: If you're serious, very few bikers would lay a bike down to avoid a more serious accident. A motorcycle stops fastest when its got the rubber on the road, just like a car.....Also, they do not lay down easily, unless you are in a very hard turn, in which case they are effectively laid down anyway, but even there, it is seldom the case that the rider lays them down intentionally....Stunt riders will sometimes lay them down intentionally, but only at very slow speeds. At high speeds they are almost impossible to lay down....The beasts just insist on remaining upright...(Thank God) I was lucky to be trained by a police motor cycle driving instructor, and part of the instruction was how to lay the bike down to escape a more serious accident. I had to use the technique twice; basically it was more about stepping off than laying down. You had to slow down as much as possible for exactly the reason you stated above; at high speeds the gyroscopic effect meant they would just carry on in a (fairly) straight line. I'm with you on this Tony. But I'd like to say that while you are correct in saying "it's more like stepping off" the bike rather than laying it down, I place the difference between stepping off a bike as to laying it down to be about 30 mph. When "up in my cups" and riding, especially when some friends and I were hunting rabbits in the fields by racing along side a rabbit and jumping off the bike onto the rabbit, I've often whooped it up by stepping off a bike while the bike may have been going about 20 mph or so. But laying a bike down at speeds of about 50 or so is just that, " laying a bike down" while at the same time getting the body into a rolling spin. It ain't fun but it's the only game to play when you have to play it. A bike will stay upright in a straight line at greater speeds, even when gearing down (depending upon speed, how far down you gear, and road surface), but it will not say straight if the front brake is applied by itself, or the rear brake applied by itself (without the shifting of body weight to prevent skidding). If at high speed the front brake only is applied, depending upon the road surface, the bike will dip greatly and slip out from under. If the rear wheel brake only is applied, the bike will wobble (again, depending upon surface condition) the rear end will attempt to swing around (if body weight shifts uncontrolled) and at a given moment will unpredictably flip and go down. I've seen beginners flip a bike about 5 feet into the air because they didn't apply the brakes properly. I didn't learn from the local police how to control shift body weight and bring the rear wheel around to skid and lay down a bike. I learned how to do that from old time bikers who played games by accelerating towards a brick wall and before hitting the wall, bring the bike around to where the one whose rear wheel just touches the wall and stops (rider still on the bike) wins the beer. If done properly, the rider would just step off the bike when it stopped, but many a rider had to lay the bike down right at the critical moment when they realized they were going too fast to bring the rear wheel around to just touching the wall. Grinning There's people who ride bikes, and there's bikers. In my 16 years or so of riding bikes, I went from riding a bike to become a biker. After a while, I transcended from being a professional during the week to becoming a biker when the weekends rolled around. One time I promised my wife I would give it up, no more bikes, and I did. A year or so later, friend brought his new bike to the house for me to see. It was a "Hog" and it was a beauty. We chewed the fat a while, admiring the bike, then he offered to let me ride it. I rejected the offer, knowing how my wife feels about bikes. But he convinced me and I hopped on and rode that puppy. About 20 minutes later, I telephoned the house and asked my wife to drive Frank (my buddy) to the bike shop where I had just bought a new Kawasaki (my favorite Japanese bike). Yeah, I heard it and heard it, over and over again from my wife. I finally sold the and never bought another. But I still update and maintain my license to ride a bike. I don't know how long I'll be doing it but one never knows. nick |
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