Photomechanical Process

I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process in full from how the
latent image is formed, to what the developer acually does, fixer,
etc. Whats a good book for a full on explaination that I can reherse
for my next cocktail party when the smartass grand inquisitor backs me
into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?

Ken Smith wrote:
I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process in full from how the
latent image is formed, to what the developer acually does, fixer,
etc. Whats a good book for a full on explaination that I can reherse
for my next cocktail party when the smartass grand inquisitor backs me
into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?

I suggest an artical entitled Mr. Wm. T. Innes in "The Inland Printer",
page 1031 of the September 1927 issue. Unless you have access to an
extremely good library, you will not be able to get this.

You can also read a little about it in "Autobiography of an Amateur
Inventor" by Frederic E. Ives, published privately in 1928 and a 1934
edition was also printed. Very hard to find. George Eastman House is
likely to have a copy. The library of Bell Telephone Laboratories used to
have a copy and might copy it for you for a fee.

You could also look up U.S. Patents 237,664, 245,501, 495,341,, but
these all preceeded the ruled glass half-tone screen that he also invented
for this work. Max Levy of Philadelphia ruled the screens for him.

IIRC, I have tried to explain this in the past in this newsgroup. You
would have to look it up in Google or something.

The only one I could find is this one, but it is not the one I have in mind:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=gr...109.com&rnum=1

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On 6/21/2004 4:23 PM Jean-David Beyer spake thus:

Ken Smith wrote:

I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process in full from how the
latent image is formed, to what the developer acually does, fixer,
etc. Whats a good book for a full on explaination that I can reherse
for my next cocktail party when the smartass grand inquisitor backs me
into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?

I suggest an artical entitled Mr. Wm. T. Innes in "The Inland Printer",
page 1031 of the September 1927 issue. Unless you have access to an
extremely good library, you will not be able to get this.

IIRC, I have tried to explain this in the past in this newsgroup. You
would have to look it up in Google or something.

The only one I could find is this one, but it is not the one I have in mind:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=gr...109.com&rnum=1

I think you gave the right answer to the wrong question there.

This might be closer to what the O.P. was after:

http://www.cheresources.com/photochem.shtml


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David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 6/21/2004 4:23 PM Jean-David Beyer spake thus:

Ken Smith wrote:



I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process in full from how the
latent image is formed, to what the developer acually does, fixer,
etc. Whats a good book for a full on explaination that I can reherse
for my next cocktail party when the smartass grand inquisitor backs me
into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?


I suggest an artical entitled Mr. Wm. T. Innes in "The Inland
Printer", page 1031 of the September 1927 issue. Unless you have
access to an extremely good library, you will not be able to get this.

IIRC, I have tried to explain this in the past in this newsgroup. You
would have to look it up in Google or something.

The only one I could find is this one, but it is not the one I have in
mind:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=gr...109.com&rnum=1



I think you gave the right answer to the wrong question there.

This might be closer to what the O.P. was after:

http://www.cheresources.com/photochem.shtml


I did not bother describing lith development of litho films because that
part is well-known. The O.P. wanted to start with how the latent image is
formed, and that depends on exposing the grains of the litho film so that
the images of the diaphragm of the camera or enlarger used to make the
little dots whose diameter varies depending on the intensity of the
element of the original subject or negative. Once the negative is properly
exposed, straight litho development does the rest. Now back in about 1880
when the process was devised, litho films did not really exist and it took
a great deal of trouble to get enough contrast to make this work. Ives not
only devised the crossline screen, but also figured out how to develop the
stuff with the materials of the day. And when the materials of the day did
not work well enough, he devised new ones.

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(Ken Smith) writes:

I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process in full from how the
latent image is formed, to what the developer acually does, fixer,
etc. Whats a good book for a full on explaination that I can reherse
for my next cocktail party when the smartass grand inquisitor backs me
into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?

Keepers of the Light. Hum, does the `the' belong in there??

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I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process ... [what book
should I read for the next time some] smartass grand inquisitor
backs me into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?

Hmmm, you mean how to please a smartass? I wouldn't, but if
you feel you have to, I recommend:

"How to Win Friends and Influence People", Dale Carnegie.
Quote: "Everything depends on sincerity. When you can
fake that you have it made."

I.E., 1) Dump the inquisitor on someone else. 2) Feign confusion and
ask him to help you out. 3) "Is that your wife in the corner playing
deep throat with your best friend?"

--
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Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.
Remove spaces etc. to reply: n o lindan at net com dot com
psst.. want to buy an f-stop timer? nolindan.com/da/fstop/

"Nicholas O. Lindan" wrote in message hlink.net...
I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process ... [what book
should I read for the next time some] smartass grand inquisitor
backs me into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?

Hmmm, you mean how to please a smartass? I wouldn't, but if
you feel you have to, I recommend:

"How to Win Friends and Influence People", Dale Carnegie.
Quote: "Everything depends on sincerity. When you can
fake that you have it made."

I.E., 1) Dump the inquisitor on someone else. 2) Feign confusion and
ask him to help you out. 3) "Is that your wife in the corner playing
deep throat with your best friend?"

Wow, I just checked back to this article today to look for one title of one
decent photo book, and all I've got so far is all this yammering, first from
a look how eccentric and smart I am guy, then this drivel. You guys have a
little bit too much time on your hands, and are not the least bit helpful.
Of course you simply MUST write back to tell me what a turd I am, Its your
newsgroup reason to be, but how bout dropping a standard 1950s library
title that covered the original question, or even part of it, when you do.

Ken Smith wrote:

Wow, I just checked back to this article today to look for one title of one
decent photo book, and all I've got so far is all this yammering, first from
a look how eccentric and smart I am guy, then this drivel. You guys have a
little bit too much time on your hands, and are not the least bit helpful.
Of course you simply MUST write back to tell me what a turd I am, Its your
newsgroup reason to be, but how bout dropping a standard 1950s library
title that covered the original question, or even part of it, when you do.

I tried to give you an answer.

The problem is that there are no recent books on the subject because no
editor would dare publish such a book now for fear of not selling any,
other than to relatives of the author. There was one about 40 years ago,
but that author, while no doubt experienced at making printing plates, had
no fundamental scientific understanding of what was going on. His view was
that the crossline screen worked entirely by diffraction, which is not the
case, though diffraction is a factor, especially with the finer screens.

Similar to the case of Mees and James "Theory of the Photographic
Process". No books like this are likely ever to be written again. There is
just no demand for such stuff.

So unless you want to track down F.E.Ives' Bolt Court Technical School
lectures in London in the late 19th century (1898), The Journal of the
Franklin Institute in May 1888 (I have not read this, so it may describe
an earlier opto-mechanical process), or the Inland Printer article I cited
previously, you are out of luck.

If you are reasonably smart and understand geometric optics, you can
re-invent the ruled crossline screen and, realizing each aperture is a
pinhole of a pinhole camera and the lens of the copy camera or enlarger is
the subject, and that litho film is clear for less than a certain
exposure, and opaque at greater exposures.

--
.~. Jean-David Beyer Registered Linux User 85642.
/V\ Registered Machine 241939.
/( )\ Shrewsbury, New Jersey http://counter.li.org
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Ken Smith wrote:

Of course you simply MUST write back to tell me what a turd I am, Its your
newsgroup reason to be, but how bout dropping a standard 1950s library
title that covered the original question, or even part of it, when you do.

Well, I won't tell you you're a turd, because I'm really not very good
at that sort of thing. And I can't give you a 1950s reference -- but if
you'll settle for 1960s, try to find a suitable copy of Encyclopedia
Americana. The major article in that tome on photography illustrates
the energetics of latent image formation and development about as well
as anything that doesn't require an advanced degree in photochemistry to
understand, to the point it was understood ca. 1963. There might well
be better versions of this article in newer editions of the Americana,
but since I've never seen a newer edition, I can't say for certain -- I
do know, however, that the Americana we had at my school when I was in
5th grade was the 1963 edition, and had an exceptional article that was
completely understandable to a very bright ten year old, but technically
correct (to the science of the time) insofar as I've ever been able to
check it.

While you have the encyclopedia, it's very much worth your time to check
out the major article on Color by Edwin Land...

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Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

(Ken Smith) wrote in message . com...
I found myself a little tongue tied and embarassed the other day
trying to explain the photomechanical process in full from how the
latent image is formed, to what the developer acually does, fixer,
etc. Whats a good book for a full on explaination that I can reherse
for my next cocktail party when the smartass grand inquisitor backs me
into a corner and I can't explain the workings of my own craft?

What do you mean by 'the photomechanical process'? That term usually
refers to printing with inks from plates burned with UV, etc.

If you mean 'chemical photography', try 'The Science of Photography'
by Baines/Bomback.