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Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 15th 04, 09:07 PM
Jeff L
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Default Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides

Hello,

I have a few questions about color slides, some of which I have
wondered about for the past 20 years or so. Could anyone answer
these?:

1) What all is involved in the K-14 process? How many, and what kind
of chemicals are there? Why have they never been available to the
public?

2) What would happen if someone tried to process Kodachrome film using
the E-6 process?

3) What is the difference in chemistry between Kodachrome and
Ektachrome films?

4) In detail, what do each of the 7 chemicals in the E-6 process
actually do? If you omit the color developer step, will you get B&W
slides?

5) Is it possible to process C-41 print film using E-6 or K-14
chemicals to end up with slides instead of negatives? What about D-76
B&W print film?

6) Since color slides were invented in 1936, what year were the first
color prints available? All of my parents' family photos older than
the mid-60's are all B&W, except for color slides from the 50's.

Thanks,
Jeff
  #2  
Old February 15th 04, 09:56 PM
James Robinson
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Default Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides

Jeff L wrote:

1) What all is involved in the K-14 process? How many, and what kind
of chemicals are there?


There are 14 steps (K-14, get it?) Here is a link to the K-Lab
processing manual on the Kodak site. You can read the section on
"processing steps" to get a better idea of how it works:

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/servi...uals/z50.shtml

Why have they never been available to the public?


There are a number of reasons. The process is complicated, and has to
be very tightly controlled, both chemically and the temperatures. It is
probably beyond most amateur's abilities. You also need a pure red and
a pure blue light to re-expose the film during processing. Finally, one
of the chemicals, used for refogging the film, is somewhat toxic, and
Kodak probably never wanted to take the risk.

2) What would happen if someone tried to process Kodachrome film using
the E-6 process?


You would first upset the person doing the processing. Kodachrome has a
unique antihalation backing called Remjet that will come off the film in
the first processing step. The backing will deposit itself like a tar
all through the processing machine. The machine then has to be taken
apart to be cleaned.

Other than that, the processes are entirely different. E-6 relies on
dyes already in the film, while Kodachrome is essentially a multi-layer
black and white film, where the dyes are added during processing. In
short, you won't get anything.

3) What is the difference in chemistry between Kodachrome and
Ektachrome films?


As above, they are quite different.
  #3  
Old February 15th 04, 10:20 PM
no
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Default Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides

James Robinson wrote in
:

Jeff L wrote:

1) What all is involved in the K-14 process? How many, and what kind
of chemicals are there?


There are 14 steps (K-14, get it?) Here is a link to the K-Lab
processing manual on the Kodak site. You can read the section on
"processing steps" to get a better idea of how it works:

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/servi...uals/z50.shtml

Why have they never been available to the public?


There are a number of reasons. The process is complicated, and has to
be very tightly controlled, both chemically and the temperatures. It
is probably beyond most amateur's abilities. You also need a pure red
and a pure blue light to re-expose the film during processing.
Finally, one of the chemicals, used for refogging the film, is
somewhat toxic, and Kodak probably never wanted to take the risk.

2) What would happen if someone tried to process Kodachrome film
using the E-6 process?


You would first upset the person doing the processing. Kodachrome has
a unique antihalation backing called Remjet that will come off the
film in the first processing step. The backing will deposit itself
like a tar all through the processing machine. The machine then has
to be taken apart to be cleaned.

Other than that, the processes are entirely different. E-6 relies on
dyes already in the film, while Kodachrome is essentially a
multi-layer black and white film, where the dyes are added during
processing. In short, you won't get anything.

3) What is the difference in chemistry between Kodachrome and
Ektachrome films?


As above, they are quite different.


One note: It's very possible to process C-41 as E6 and vice versa.
First, you will get slides from your print film or negs from your slide
film. However the colours become very strange indeed. I have done this
on a number of occasions with varying, albeit artistic results.
  #4  
Old February 15th 04, 10:22 PM
Geoffrey S. Mendelson
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Default Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides

In article , Jeff L wrote:

1) What all is involved in the K-14 process? How many, and what kind
of chemicals are there? Why have they never been available to the
public?


Don't know. Kodak has never been forthcoming about what is in the process.


2) What would happen if someone tried to process Kodachrome film using
the E-6 process?


You would end up with orange film with nothing on it.


3) What is the difference in chemistry between Kodachrome and
Ektachrome films?


Don't know.

4) In detail, what do each of the 7 chemicals in the E-6 process
actually do? If you omit the color developer step, will you get B&W
slides? you'll get blank film.


1. developer - develops exposed silver to a normal b&w image
2. stop bath
at one time a second exposure to light was needed here.
3. color developer -- develops the rest of the silver and causes the dyes
coupled to the silver to "develop"
4. bleach - converts all silver to solulable.
5. fixer - standard fixer disolves the silver.
6. wash
7. stabilizer -- makes the dyes last longer used to be formadlehyde.


The process can be cut down to a developer/color developer combination,
bleach/fix (blix) combination, wash/stabilizer combination assuimg the
chemicals are not reused. If they are to be reused a wash or stop bath
would be needed between the developers and blix to prevent
contamination.



5) Is it possible to process C-41 print film using E-6 or K-14
chemicals to end up with slides instead of negatives? What about D-76
B&W print film?


no. but there have been some interesting results published using C-41 for
E-6 film.

6) Since color slides were invented in 1936, what year were the first
color prints available? All of my parents' family photos older than
the mid-60's are all B&W, except for color slides from the 50's.

no idea.

Geoff.

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(Not for email)


  #5  
Old February 16th 04, 04:30 AM
Michael Scarpitti
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Default Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides

Jeff L wrote in message . ..
Hello,

I have a few questions about color slides, some of which I have
wondered about for the past 20 years or so. Could anyone answer
these?:

1) What all is involved in the K-14 process? How many, and what kind
of chemicals are there? Why have they never been available to the
public?


First developer, three reversal exposures and three color devlopers,
bleach, fix, wash, etc.


2) What would happen if someone tried to process Kodachrome film using
the E-6 process?


Blank film.


3) What is the difference in chemistry between Kodachrome and
Ektachrome films?


Different kind of color couplers. Kodachrome's couplers are in teh
developers, Ektachrome couplers are in the film.


4) In detail, what do each of the 7 chemicals in the E-6 process
actually do? If you omit the color developer step, will you get B&W
slides?


No, you will get nothing but bank film...


5) Is it possible to process C-41 print film using E-6 or K-14
chemicals to end up with slides instead of negatives? What about D-76
B&W print film?

6) Since color slides were invented in 1936, what year were the first
color prints available? All of my parents' family photos older than
the mid-60's are all B&W, except for color slides from the 50's.


Kodak made Kodachrome prints service available soon after Kodachrome
film became available.


Thanks,
Jeff

  #6  
Old February 16th 04, 08:18 AM
Slingblade
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Default Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides

On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:20:26 GMT, no wrote:

One note: It's very possible to process C-41 as E6 and vice versa.
First, you will get slides from your print film or negs from your slide
film. However the colours become very strange indeed. I have done this
on a number of occasions with varying, albeit artistic results.


I had E6 (Ektachrome 200) processed with C41 through a mistake at a
photolab once.

The "prints" that were returned to me looked very ethereal.

The "negatives" had a wierd bluish cast (completely unlike the orangy
cast you usually encounter with REAL negative film).

The lab never caught their mistake until I pointed it out and
complained, and then they gave me those shots for free and free
processing on a future roll of slide film. I took them up on the free
processing of the next roll, then changed future processing jobs over
to another lab.
  #7  
Old February 16th 04, 03:25 PM
¡¹¡¸Lonely Boy¡¸¡¹
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Default Kodachrome (K-14) vs. Ektachrome (E-6) Color Slides



1) What all is involved in the K-14 process? How many, and what kind
of chemicals are there? Why have they never been available to the
public?


No available. because it need special hardware to exposure the 3 emulsion
layers color by color.

2) What would happen if someone tried to process Kodachrome film using
the E-6 process?


no image...all silver metal will be converted to silver halide by the bleach
and dissolved by fixer, because no dye will be ever formed.

3) What is the difference in chemistry between Kodachrome and
Ektachrome films?


R, G, B reversal exposure and 3 different colour developer.


4) In detail, what do each of the 7 chemicals in the E-6 process
actually do? If you omit the color developer step, will you get B&W
slides?


First dev converts latent image to silver metal. Reversal bath chemical fog
the undeveloped silver halide. Color developer develop the chemically
fogged silver halide to silver metal and form dyes. Conditioner prepares
the film for the bleach. Bleach converts all silver metal to silver halide.
Fixer dissolves all silver halide. Stabiliser stablises the color dye and
help drying evenly.


5) Is it possible to process C-41 print film using E-6 or K-14
chemicals to end up with slides instead of negatives? What about D-76
B&W print film?

C41 film can go through E6 and form positive image. B/W film in C41 or E6
will become transparent as all silver metal will be removed by bleach and
fixer


6) Since color slides were invented in 1936, what year were the first
color prints available? All of my parents' family photos older than
the mid-60's are all B&W, except for color slides from the 50's.




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