How to measure ISO

In article ,
Whisky-dave wrote:


it is not mechanically timed (gears and springs), which is why it's not
called a mechanical shutter.

very simple.

it doesnt matter what you choose to call it it is what it is.

it matters what the world calls it, and they call it an electronic
shutter.

technically it's an electro-mechanical shutter, but nobody calls it
that.


http://www.steves-digicams.com/knowl...ras-have-mecha
nical-shutters.html

a mike chaney article?? you must be kidding. mike chaney has written a
number of tech articles for steve's digicams, nearly all of them wrong
in one way or another.

get yourself educated.

take your own advice.

In article ,
Whisky-dave wrote:

So his point is valid, but his terminology can be misinterpreted easily.

he's wrong end of story most DSLRs today use mechanical shutters.

they're electronically timed, which why it's called an electronic
shutter.

watch the 10,000FSP video of the canon 7D shutter, to watch how the slit
transverses the sensor in order to expose it to light.

I also think that virtuall all lenses still use a mechnaical diaphram for
stopping down the lens, sure the shutter button senses pressure and uses
electricity to set everything in montion but the daiphram is still
mechanical.

so what?

Not that I understand why it has to be, other than perhaps speed, and that
getting a LCD dense enoguhb to block all light might be a problem.
But it's **** easy to vreate a dark circle like a diaphram on a LCD.

that would be a very stupid way to do it.

In article ,
Sandman wrote:

Now I could have used a monkey to trigger the camera or thrown a
rock at teh camera triggering the shutter but that does not make it
a rock controled or monkey controlled shutter. !

Uh, yeah it would. It it's controlled by a monkey, it's a monkey-controlled
shutter.

nonsense.

if a shutter triggered by a monkey makes it monkey-controlled then all
cameras have human controlled shutters, which is clearly false.

and the monkey doesn't own the copyright to any photos.

On 2015-11-11 18:01:02 +0000, nospam said:

In article ,
Whisky-dave wrote:

Just a mere fact that's all. Justy like in the Bible.

nothing in the bible is factual.

There are a few things that are factual; for example Herod existed.

it's nothing more than a bunch of fictional stories which are full of
contradictions and flat out impossible scenarios.

Most of the content of the bible, cover to cover is man written myth.

....and here come all the faithful, who are free to believe whatever
they choose, to tell me I am a doomed, heathen, athiest.

....I know, I know, but that's OK.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 2015-11-11 18:01:05 +0000, nospam said:

In article ,
Sandman wrote:

Now I could have used a monkey to trigger the camera or thrown a
rock at teh camera triggering the shutter but that does not make it
a rock controled or monkey controlled shutter. !

Uh, yeah it would. It it's controlled by a monkey, it's a monkey-controlled
shutter.

nonsense.

if a shutter triggered by a monkey makes it monkey-controlled then all
cameras have human controlled shutters, which is clearly false.

and the monkey doesn't own the copyright to any photos.

Except in Europe.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

In article 2015111110593437879-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

Now I could have used a monkey to trigger the camera or thrown a
rock at teh camera triggering the shutter but that does not make it
a rock controled or monkey controlled shutter. !

Uh, yeah it would. It it's controlled by a monkey, it's a monkey-controlled
shutter.

nonsense.

if a shutter triggered by a monkey makes it monkey-controlled then all
cameras have human controlled shutters, which is clearly false.

and the monkey doesn't own the copyright to any photos.

Except in Europe.

what does europe have to do with it? the photo wasn't taken in europe
nor is it being litigated in europe.

however, it's hilarious.

In article , Whisky-dave
wrote:

Sandman:
Yes, analog cameras, especially those without a battery, used
mechanically controlled shutters. Here's a good image of a
mechanically controlled focal plane (mechanical) shutter:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ns/9/9a/Focal-
plane_shutter_gears.jpg Here's an image of an electronically
controlled focal plane (mechanical) shutter on an analog film
camera:

http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography...reliability/f5
shutteropen.jpg And here's an image of an electronically
controlled focal plane (mechanical) shutter on a modern DSLR:
https://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-
content/uploads/sites/13/2014/12/Focal-plane-shutter.jpg

yes a mechanical shutter as I said originally.

Well, duh.

Sandman:
And here's an image of an electronically controlled electronic
shutter:

http://www.dxomark.com/var/ezwebin_s...ges/sensor/102
613-1-eng-US/sensor.jpg

Which does NOT appear in the majority of DSLRs since the 80s.

Well, duh.

Sandman:
This means that the shutter is electronically
controlled, "

Whisky-dave:
cameras that DO NOT have batteries can;t have shutters that are
electronically controlled, where the electricity coming from if
there's no battereis !

Sandman:
If you hadn't snipped my quote, you may have been able to read it
correctly (who am I kidding, right?)

Then put back what I snipped and we'll see won't we. How can a
shutter be electronically contorlled without electical mpower ?

Why are you asking a question unrelated to anything I've said? My unmolested
quote is in the archives, go back and read until you're blu in the face.

Whisky-dave:
NO NOSPAM said they were electronic shutters which they are NOT.

Sandman:
Yes, he has said that, which is incorrect. But the quote in
question now is this one: "the timing is electronic, which is why
it's *far* more accurate than a mechanical shutter that uses
springs and gears." / nospam- 11/10/2015

irrelivent.

Incorrect.

Sandman:
I.e. he is correctly pointing to the fact that an electronically
controlled shutter is more precise than a mechanically controlled
shutter.

Hopefully yes, but the FACT is that the majority of cameras even TOP
end DSLRs have mechanical shutters NOT electronic shutters.

Why can't you read?? Some form of head trauma?

Whisky-dave:
I've been saying the majoroty of DSLRS today use mechnaical
shutters sure they are electroniclly trigger but that doesn;t
make them electronic shutters.

Sandman:
Of course not. The only reason I came in to this thread was to
point out the terminology being used.

and your not the opne to do that not being English.

Most ironic "sentence" ever written. I have a far better understanding of the
English language than you do.

Sandman:
I'll do this again, so you can snip it away in your followup:
nospam has been in reference to *electronically controlled
shutters*, where electronics control a mechanical shutter. See
above for the difference.

he said the majoroty of cameras since the 80s have electronic
shutters and they DO NOT.

Nowhere above did I talk about what he said, I talked about what he was in
REFERENCE to. Man you're slow.

Sandman:
He has incorrectly called them "electronic shutters", which back
in the old analog days *could only mean* an electronically
*controlled* mechanical shutter.

Only to some not those that know what they are talking about.

Incorrect.

Sandman:
But since many years, we have *actual* electronic *shutters*, so
the term nowadays is in reference to a snap shutter, where there
is no mechanical shutter.

which don;t exist in the majority of todays DSLRs.

Well, duuuuuh.

Sandman:
Hence the confusion. That coupled with your poor reading
comprehension was doomed from the start.

Wrong as usual, my comprehension was correct.

No it wasn't. And no, it never ever is.

Just because NOSPAM got the terminology wrong is NOT my fault.

He could have said everything 100% correctly and you still wouldn't have
understood a single thing.

--
Sandman

On 2015-11-11 19:27:04 +0000, nospam said:

In article 2015111110593437879-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

Now I could have used a monkey to trigger the camera or thrown a
rock at teh camera triggering the shutter but that does not make it
a rock controled or monkey controlled shutter. !

Uh, yeah it would. It it's controlled by a monkey, it's a monkey-controlled
shutter.

nonsense.

if a shutter triggered by a monkey makes it monkey-controlled then all
cameras have human controlled shutters, which is clearly false.

and the monkey doesn't own the copyright to any photos.

Except in Europe.

what does europe have to do with it? the photo wasn't taken in europe
nor is it being litigated in europe.

however, it's hilarious.

I guess that is more of a PETA and Wiki-commons issue.

Though Europe (the EU) has some pretty strange rules when it comes to
exploiting images.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

In article , nospam wrote:

Eric Stevens:
ISO is not a measure of the amount of light collected.

Sandman:
Yes, it is.

no it isn't. it's a measure of sensitivity.

And sensitivity determines how much light can be collected.

Eric Stevens:
See https://photographylife.com/what-is-iso-in-photography "In
very basic terms, ISO is the level of sensitivity of your camera
to available light."

Sandman:
Higher sensitivity means it can gather more light.

no. total light is a function of area.

I wasn't in reference to "total light", I was in reference to the fact that
higher sensitivity means the film can gather more light.

Sandman:
With less total amount of light, the signal to noise ratio differs
between sensor sizes, meaning that ISO 200 on MFT has the same
s/n ratio as ISO 800 on FF.

that part is true, but a separate issue.

It's the only issue.

--
Sandman

In article , nospam wrote:

In article
,

Sandman:
This is what you do - make an ambiguous statement and
when corrected you will argue for days while frantically and
desperately snipping out all the proof that you're wrong.

nospam:
it was not ambiguous.

as i said before, only an idiot would be confused.

Sandman:
Some of the links you were forced to snip (again) since they prove
you incorrect:

they do no such thing.

Translation: *LALALAALALALALALAA CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!*

Here are the links that nospam desperately is running form and can't counter with
anything that supports his "views":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shutter_(photography)#Electronic_shutter

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/explora/...aphy/tips-and-
solutions/understanding-shutter-speed

https://support.nikonusa.com/app/ans...~/differences-
between-electronic-and-mechanical-shutters

Ass. Handed. Again.

--
Sandman