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#11
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Image Stabilisation - why?
"Steve Cutchen" wrote in message ... In article , Jim wrote: "Justin C" wrote in message news:justin.0612-69173C.23540905012007@stigmata... (Also posted to uk.rec.photo.misc, sorry to those who follow both NGs, I intended to post it here but had the wrong NG selected when I posted). I keep reading about IS in modern cameras and lenses and people seem to go on about it as if it's essential. It's not in any camera I have and it was never in any camera I've ever had. I've managed to get perfectly good and sharp shots over the years, hand-held with 450mm lenses. The rule of thumb was that to avoid lens movement ruining a shot you the shutter speed in fractions of a second must be at least the length of lens used. So, if you're shooting wide open in low light with a 50mm lens you can get away with 1/60th sec. But if you're shooting on a sunny day, but in the woods, with a 450mm you need 1/500 sec. You know there is a risk of shake so you're careful, if you can use a tripod you do, if not then a monopod, or a bean bag, or rest the lens on a branch, or lean against a tree. With a little care you can get that speed down without needing a tripod. Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? I'm not looking to start a flame war and this is not a troll. -- Justin C, by the sea. A very good professional nature photographer once remarked that, before IS, he was lucky to get one good shot per roll of birds in flight. With IS, the ratio has now improved to almost all of the shots. Most of my shots are of more stationary target so I would not expect such a dramatic improvement in my photography. This sounds like just the opposite... If you have a stationary target, IS will let you slow down the shutter and still hand hold. The movement you are compensating for is you. But if you have a fast moving target and need to freeze action, you still have to shoot the higher shutter speed, IS or not, and so are already fast enough to hand hold. The movement you need to compensate for is the subject. One thing IS does in this case is compensate for unwanted vertical movement when panning horizontally. -- Skip Middleton www.shadowcatcherimagery.com www.pbase.com/skipm |
#12
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Image Stabilisation - why?
"Justin C" wrote in message
news:justin.0612-69173C.23540905012007@stigmata... Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? A few examples. Hand held in a concert, stadium sports event, dim museum. All are difficult to get in a fast enough f-stop / zoom combination, and a tripod is not permitted in each case. I've had IS for several months and absolutely love it. Bruce. |
#13
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Image Stabilisation - why?
Jim wrote:
A very good professional nature photographer once remarked that, before IS, he was lucky to get one good shot per roll of birds in flight. With IS, the ratio has now improved to almost all of the shots. I think I know the photographer you speak of, and what he was talking about was fast predictive autofocus, not image stabilization ... the example he gave was of photographing eagles in flight, IIRC. Bill |
#14
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Image Stabilisation - why?
"Justin C" wrote in message news:justin.0612-69173C.23540905012007@stigmata... (Also posted to uk.rec.photo.misc, sorry to those who follow both NGs, I intended to post it here but had the wrong NG selected when I posted). I keep reading about IS in modern cameras and lenses and people seem to go on about it as if it's essential. It's not in any camera I have and it was never in any camera I've ever had. I've managed to get perfectly good and sharp shots over the years, hand-held with 450mm lenses. The rule of thumb was that to avoid lens movement ruining a shot you the shutter speed in fractions of a second must be at least the length of lens used. So, if you're shooting wide open in low light with a 50mm lens you can get away with 1/60th sec. But if you're shooting on a sunny day, but in the woods, with a 450mm you need 1/500 sec. You know there is a risk of shake so you're careful, if you can use a tripod you do, if not then a monopod, or a bean bag, or rest the lens on a branch, or lean against a tree. With a little care you can get that speed down without needing a tripod. Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? I'm not looking to start a flame war and this is not a troll. -- Justin C, by the sea. Shaky hands. And lack of propping objects. Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services ---------------------------------------------------------- ** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY ** ---------------------------------------------------------- http://www.usenet.com |
#15
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Image Stabilisation - why?
On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 23:54:09 +0000, Justin C wrote:
(Also posted to uk.rec.photo.misc, sorry to those who follow both NGs, I intended to post it here but had the wrong NG selected when I posted). I keep reading about IS in modern cameras and lenses and people seem to go on about it as if it's essential. It's not in any camera I have and it was never in any camera I've ever had. I've managed to get perfectly good and sharp shots over the years, hand-held with 450mm lenses. The rule of thumb was that to avoid lens movement ruining a shot you the shutter speed in fractions of a second must be at least the length of lens used. So, if you're shooting wide open in low light with a 50mm lens you can get away with 1/60th sec. But if you're shooting on a sunny day, but in the woods, with a 450mm you need 1/500 sec. You know there is a risk of shake so you're careful, if you can use a tripod you do, if not then a monopod, or a bean bag, or rest the lens on a branch, or lean against a tree. With a little care you can get that speed down without needing a tripod. Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? I think the point might be "you don't have to work so hard at it". I'm not looking to start a flame war and this is not a troll. |
#16
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Image Stabilisation - why?
You would have to use it to understand. It is very useful for many types of
circumstances from people that have nerve disorders that can't hold perfectly still to being able to hand hold a shot at 1/2 second and more. Those that have used a stabilized lens or camera seldom go back without a fight especially if they take the time to learn and understand the charm of the system. ljc "Justin C" wrote in message news:justin.0612-69173C.23540905012007@stigmata... (Also posted to uk.rec.photo.misc, sorry to those who follow both NGs, I intended to post it here but had the wrong NG selected when I posted). I keep reading about IS in modern cameras and lenses and people seem to go on about it as if it's essential. It's not in any camera I have and it was never in any camera I've ever had. I've managed to get perfectly good and sharp shots over the years, hand-held with 450mm lenses. The rule of thumb was that to avoid lens movement ruining a shot you the shutter speed in fractions of a second must be at least the length of lens used. So, if you're shooting wide open in low light with a 50mm lens you can get away with 1/60th sec. But if you're shooting on a sunny day, but in the woods, with a 450mm you need 1/500 sec. You know there is a risk of shake so you're careful, if you can use a tripod you do, if not then a monopod, or a bean bag, or rest the lens on a branch, or lean against a tree. With a little care you can get that speed down without needing a tripod. Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? I'm not looking to start a flame war and this is not a troll. -- Justin C, by the sea. |
#17
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Image Stabilisation - why?
On Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:54:09 -0800, Justin C wrote
(in article justin.0612-69173C.23540905012007@stigmata): I've managed to get perfectly good and sharp shots over the years, hand-held with 450mm lenses. The rule of thumb was that to avoid lens movement ruining a shot you the shutter speed in fractions of a second must be at least the length of lens used. So, if you're shooting wide open in low light with a 50mm lens you can get away with 1/60th sec. But if you're shooting on a sunny day, but in the woods, with a 450mm you need 1/500 sec. You know there is a risk of shake so you're careful, if you can use a tripod you do, if not then a monopod, or a bean bag, or rest the lens on a branch, or lean against a tree. With a little care you can get that speed down without needing a tripod. Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? The point is that IS changes the rule of thumb that you have been using. The lens speed now can be 1/4 of the focal length of the lens. |
#18
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Image Stabilisation - why?
"Jim" wrote in message t... "Justin C" wrote in message news:justin.0612-69173C.23540905012007@stigmata... (Also posted to uk.rec.photo.misc, sorry to those who follow both NGs, I intended to post it here but had the wrong NG selected when I posted). I keep reading about IS in modern cameras and lenses and people seem to go on about it as if it's essential. It's not in any camera I have and it was never in any camera I've ever had. I've managed to get perfectly good and sharp shots over the years, hand-held with 450mm lenses. The rule of thumb was that to avoid lens movement ruining a shot you the shutter speed in fractions of a second must be at least the length of lens used. So, if you're shooting wide open in low light with a 50mm lens you can get away with 1/60th sec. But if you're shooting on a sunny day, but in the woods, with a 450mm you need 1/500 sec. You know there is a risk of shake so you're careful, if you can use a tripod you do, if not then a monopod, or a bean bag, or rest the lens on a branch, or lean against a tree. With a little care you can get that speed down without needing a tripod. Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? I'm not looking to start a flame war and this is not a troll. -- Justin C, by the sea. A very good professional nature photographer once remarked that, before IS, he was lucky to get one good shot per roll of birds in flight. With IS, the ratio has now improved to almost all of the shots. Most of my shots are of more stationary target so I would not expect such a dramatic improvement in my photography. One example where I could certainly have used help happened in Canada. I was trying to photograph an elk, and I was hand holding an F3 with a 300mm f4 lens. According to the usual technique, I should have set the shutter to 1/300, but the light was low, and I really needed 1/300 at f2.8. So, I took the shot anyway, and it isn't too bad (well, it is a little dark). With IS, I could have set the shutter and lens for the light and never given the problem another thought. Jim A comparison with my old Oly OM-2 and a C8080 Effective film/ISO speed OM-2 400-800 (When I was using it) C8080 100 (for reasonable noise) OM2 shutter speeds Usually 1/250 or faster (F2.8 lens) C8080 Slower by 2-4x or so under same lighting C8080 can become unusable in daylight with autofocus at full zoom and long distance, requiring painful manual focus, due to low resolution of LCDs in focus mode that uses a digital multiplier in center of LCD. For moving objects (racing cars) daylight, full zoom long distance (infinity) Focus manually and lock focus and exposure. Now hand held is possible, with good results. Without manual focus & lock, even tripod based was NG, due to auto focus time & lock fail with moving subjects at long distance. Next digital camera will be one with easy to use manual focus and zoom. In my opinion, the automatic features can be useful, but also tend to cripple the camera when they cannot be easily overidden |
#19
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Image Stabilisation - why?
On Fri, 5 Jan 2007 23:25:15 -0800, C J Campbell wrote
(in article m): On Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:54:09 -0800, Justin C wrote (in article justin.0612-69173C.23540905012007@stigmata): I've managed to get perfectly good and sharp shots over the years, hand-held with 450mm lenses. The rule of thumb was that to avoid lens movement ruining a shot you the shutter speed in fractions of a second must be at least the length of lens used. So, if you're shooting wide open in low light with a 50mm lens you can get away with 1/60th sec. But if you're shooting on a sunny day, but in the woods, with a 450mm you need 1/500 sec. You know there is a risk of shake so you're careful, if you can use a tripod you do, if not then a monopod, or a bean bag, or rest the lens on a branch, or lean against a tree. With a little care you can get that speed down without needing a tripod. Just what is the big deal with IS? Have I missed the point? Weren't most of the best photo's in the world shot without it? The point is that IS changes the rule of thumb that you have been using. The lens speed now can be 1/4 of the focal length of the lens. Actually, it the improvement is four stops as some manufacturers claim (and my experience is that these claims are, if anything, conservative) then the 1/500 shutter speed rule for a 450mm lens becomes 1/60. But it is actually better than that, at least at medium telephoto range. Using either the amateur 18-200mm VR Nikkor or the 70-200mm f/2.8 VR Nikkor you are practically guaranteed getting a steady shot at 1/25 at 200mm. The thing is, IS keeps functioning, so if you want to really push it down to, say, 1/8, you have an excellent chance of getting an acceptable shot, whereas if you were using the old rule of thumb with a non-stabilized lens you would only be getting an improvement to 1/75 and even then with much less success. So, yeah, you can get great pictures with a pinhole camera, but having a lens makes things a lot easier, doesn't it? In the same way IS makes things easier still. |
#20
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Image Stabilisation - why?
Skip wrote:
"David J. Littleboy" wrote in message ... "MarkČ" mjmorgan(lowest even number wrote: IS's only limitation is, of course that it can't deal with subject motion, although IS lenses with panning modes work extremely well. If you are using IS to shoot at 1/100 when you'd need 1/500 to get a sharp image, you still have a lot of subject stopping potential. I'd like to see some solid tripod vs. IS comparisons, though. (The problem with that, though, is that most people don't own a tripod capable of holding a 300mm lens adequately still for 1/100 second.) David J. Littleboy Tokyo, Japan One of these days, if I ever get one of those mythical "spare times" I'm really going to try that. I have a monster Bogen/Manfrotto 3236 (similar to the current 3258) that should hold a big lens still. If I'm feeling kinda flush at the same time as that "spare time" I might even rent a 600 f4 IS and see what a REALLY big lens will do with IS... My next "big" (at least for me) will be a FAAAAAR larger ball head that will TRULY lock a large, heavy set-up down at any angle. My current ball head is inadequate without a proper vertical bracket (which I don't have)...not to mention the simple circumference to literally STOP motion and creep... -- Images (Plus Snaps & Grabs) by MarkČ at: www.pbase.com/markuson |
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