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Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 6th 12, 05:03 PM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Wolfgang Weisselberg
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Posts: 5,285
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

Eric Stevens wrote:

control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?

-Wolfgang
  #2  
Old December 9th 12, 04:27 AM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Eric Stevens
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Posts: 13,611
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
wrote:

Eric Stevens wrote:

control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?

But was it much brighter than the building?
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #3  
Old December 16th 12, 06:25 PM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Wolfgang Weisselberg
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,285
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?

-Wolfgang
  #4  
Old December 18th 12, 01:12 AM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,611
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 18:25:21 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
wrote:

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?

http://skaremedia.com/sites/default/...ickr/MyEye.jpg
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #5  
Old December 18th 12, 01:43 AM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

On 2012-12-16 09:25:21 -0800, Wolfgang Weisselberg
said:

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?


On my first cognitive visit to London for my Great-Grandmother's 100th
birthday in February 1955, I was quite astonished by the black and grey
snow in Hyde Park.

After that I always thought there was a difference between English snow
and all other snow. However I learned that that was still in the days
of war recovery & reconstruction, coal burning fireplaces, and the
dreaded London fog.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #6  
Old December 19th 12, 01:20 AM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Wolfgang Weisselberg
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,285
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 18:25:21 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?


http://skaremedia.com/sites/default/...ickr/MyEye.jpg


Using an instrument with an amazingly variable automatic
white balance (amongst other really wild stiff) --- which is
also fed and strongly influenced by "how it should look" ---
is a very good method to measure.

You can't even tell what thing is brighter when they're only
a couple centimeters away from each other --- see optical
illusions.

Next up (and with much more justification): Santa Claus really
exists and brings everyone gifts, I've seen him in dozens of
copies in the mall.

-Wolfgang
  #7  
Old December 19th 12, 10:40 PM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,611
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 01:20:17 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
wrote:

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 18:25:21 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?


http://skaremedia.com/sites/default/...ickr/MyEye.jpg


Using an instrument with an amazingly variable automatic
white balance (amongst other really wild stiff) --- which is
also fed and strongly influenced by "how it should look" ---
is a very good method to measure.

You can't even tell what thing is brighter when they're only
a couple centimeters away from each other --- see optical
illusions.

Next up (and with much more justification): Santa Claus really
exists and brings everyone gifts, I've seen him in dozens of
copies in the mall.

So we now have it on record that you think you don't know what you are
looking at.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #8  
Old December 20th 12, 04:58 PM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Wolfgang Weisselberg
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,285
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 01:20:17 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 18:25:21 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?


http://skaremedia.com/sites/default/...ickr/MyEye.jpg


Using an instrument with an amazingly variable automatic
white balance (amongst other really wild stiff) --- which is
also fed and strongly influenced by "how it should look" ---
is a very good method to measure.


You can't even tell what thing is brighter when they're only
a couple centimeters away from each other --- see optical
illusions.


Next up (and with much more justification): Santa Claus really
exists and brings everyone gifts, I've seen him in dozens of
copies in the mall.


So we now have it on record that you think you don't know what you are
looking at.


We have it on record that *you* think your eyes are reliable
colour measurement instruments --- even when used in different
circumstances and without being able to see both scenes at the
same time --- whereas *I* claim they can easily be tricked /and/
have given you enough pointers to research that on your own.

Then we have it on record that you believe knowing that the eye
can be tricked equals "you don't know what you are looking at".

Maybe you /can/ bring proof that *your* eyes are good, absolute
colourimeters, but I wouldn't bet a cent to an Earldom on it.


Oh, BTW, let me congratulate you on embarking on your quest
to ridicule me since I don't agree with you. But look up what
Ghandi said about that.

-Wolfgang
  #9  
Old December 21st 12, 12:10 AM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,611
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

On Thu, 20 Dec 2012 16:58:32 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
wrote:

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 01:20:17 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 18:25:21 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?


http://skaremedia.com/sites/default/...ickr/MyEye.jpg


Using an instrument with an amazingly variable automatic
white balance (amongst other really wild stiff) --- which is
also fed and strongly influenced by "how it should look" ---
is a very good method to measure.


You can't even tell what thing is brighter when they're only
a couple centimeters away from each other --- see optical
illusions.


Next up (and with much more justification): Santa Claus really
exists and brings everyone gifts, I've seen him in dozens of
copies in the mall.


So we now have it on record that you think you don't know what you are
looking at.


We have it on record that *you* think your eyes are reliable
colour measurement instruments --- even when used in different
circumstances and without being able to see both scenes at the
same time --- whereas *I* claim they can easily be tricked /and/
have given you enough pointers to research that on your own.


You are reading too much into what I wrote, unless you believe white
walls are never found in the presence of snow.

Then we have it on record that you believe knowing that the eye
can be tricked equals "you don't know what you are looking at".


Well, doesn't it?

Maybe you /can/ bring proof that *your* eyes are good, absolute
colourimeters, but I wouldn't bet a cent to an Earldom on it.


This is not just a discussion of colour.


Oh, BTW, let me congratulate you on embarking on your quest
to ridicule me since I don't agree with you. But look up what
Ghandi said about that.

Tsk, tsk. You are too sensitive. Maybe you have seen too many Santa
Clauses in the mall?
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #10  
Old December 25th 12, 03:28 PM posted to rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Wolfgang Weisselberg
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,285
Default Sony tells DSLR shooters they're idiots

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 20 Dec 2012 16:58:32 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 01:20:17 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 18:25:21 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 17:03:01 +0100, Wolfgang Weisselberg
Eric Stevens wrote:


control colour balance and that the F801s could only control exposure.
It did this on the basis of a data base of thousands of images. It
must have had color sensitivity of some kind as, for example, it could
tell the difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene.


So you're basically saying that there's no way to detect the
difference between a large white-walled building and a snow
scene without colour sensitivity, not even by seeing that the
snow scene was much brighter than the building?


But was it much brighter than the building?


So why do you think snow is a different colour than a white
walled building?


http://skaremedia.com/sites/default/...ickr/MyEye.jpg


Using an instrument with an amazingly variable automatic
white balance (amongst other really wild stiff) --- which is
also fed and strongly influenced by "how it should look" ---
is a very good method to measure.


You can't even tell what thing is brighter when they're only
a couple centimeters away from each other --- see optical
illusions.


Next up (and with much more justification): Santa Claus really
exists and brings everyone gifts, I've seen him in dozens of
copies in the mall.


So we now have it on record that you think you don't know what you are
looking at.


We have it on record that *you* think your eyes are reliable
colour measurement instruments --- even when used in different
circumstances and without being able to see both scenes at the
same time --- whereas *I* claim they can easily be tricked /and/
have given you enough pointers to research that on your own.


You are reading too much into what I wrote, unless you believe white
walls are never found in the presence of snow.


Oh, sure, there are. So, what did the camera make from that
scene?


Then we have it on record that you believe knowing that the eye
can be tricked equals "you don't know what you are looking at".


Well, doesn't it?


Say, how do you know you saw white walls in the presence of
snow, or can't your eyes be tricked? Probably that was a
yellow wall and smog-stained snow you say ...

Maybe you /can/ bring proof that *your* eyes are good, absolute
colourimeters, but I wouldn't bet a cent to an Earldom on it.


This is not just a discussion of colour.


Well, either colour measuring is necessary, or it's not. In
the latter case "It must have had color sensitivity of some
^^^^
kind" is proven wrong --- which was my point, in the former
case it *is* a discussion of colour and whether your eyes can
report them correctly.

Oh, BTW, let me congratulate you on embarking on your quest
to ridicule me since I don't agree with you. But look up what
Ghandi said about that.


Tsk, tsk. You are too sensitive.


.... for your ploys to work.

Maybe you have seen too many Santa
Clauses in the mall?


Are they spitting images of you, or where's the connection?

-Wolfgang
 




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