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#11
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'cool' temperature lights
the ballasts in the 'shoplite' units are 60mhz - what is the result or
negative effect of using these vs the high frequency 30-40khz ballasts you wrote about - does it have to do with flicker or col or....? Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...w_in_base_dimm able.htm They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- xx "Bandicoot" wrote in message ... "Tsotsi" wrote in message ... I need to buy or make some cool lights (as close to daylight/5500K) as I can get, & that are a reasonable weight, are portable, and give a decent amount of f-stop/shutter speed - I cannot use flash/strobe and tungsten/halogen lights are too hot. Lowell make a unit called Scandles but it's only 200w and I am sure you cant get much of an exposure from them. Can anyone share their experience? thanks Frank HMI is one solution, the one the movies use. Expensive, and you need a ballast as well as the lamphead, but it is reasonably portable. The flicker rate is extremely high, making any flicker virtually non-existent when compared to tungssten lamps, which makes it much better for use with scanning digital backs. It is also almost a point source, so can give very hard light if yo want it, or be modified as appropriate. There are several makes, but the only one I'm familiar with is the Elinchrom: this has a colour temperature of 5,800K. It is a 575W lamp, but be aware that HMI is much more efficient than tungsten, so it is a lot brighter than a 575W tungsten lamp or photoflood would be: the Elinchrom produces 14,000 Lux, whihc is about the same as a 2,000W tungsten halogen lamp. The Elinchrom takes all the same reflectors, softboxes, snoots, fresnels and whatever else as their flash heads do. MSR and CID lamps are more or less similar technology to HMI, but I really don't know anything about these types. Photographic flourescents are the other option. These have a very near daylight 'temperature' (in inverted commas because flourescent doesn't behave like a black-body source, so strictly it doesn't have a colour temperature). However, because the peaks and troughs in their emission are rather different to other sources, they tend not to appear quite the same on different films - not a massive difference but enough to merit some testing before investing a lot of time or money. KinoFlo are the best known manufacturer of these types of lights. They tend to be large, and linear, of course, because of the shape of the tubes. This makes for a large light source, but the light is not as soft as the size alone would suggest - it seems quite attractive when I've seen other people use it, though I haven't done so myself. Popular with fashion photographers. Power is lower than HMI sources, but even so be aware that flourescents are far more efficient than tungsten lights, and so a direct Watt for Watt comparison is extremely misleading. Thus the Scandles you mention are going to be 'worth' a lot more in light output than that 200W power consumption suggests if you are comparing them to a tungsten lamp - you could ask the manufacturer for a Lux value. HMI is much cooler running than a tungsten halogen of equivalent brightness, but obviously flourescents are much cooler still, hence their other group of fans: food photographers. A lot of people hire both these types of light rather than owning them outright so you could always do a day's hire and take some light readings / shoot some test shots before committing to a purchase. Hope that's a bit of help, Peter |
#12
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'cool' temperature lights
the ballasts in the 'shoplite' units are 60mhz - what is the result or
negative effect of using these vs the high frequency 30-40khz ballasts you wrote about - does it have to do with flicker or col or....? Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...w_in_base_dimm able.htm They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- xx "Bandicoot" wrote in message ... "Tsotsi" wrote in message ... I need to buy or make some cool lights (as close to daylight/5500K) as I can get, & that are a reasonable weight, are portable, and give a decent amount of f-stop/shutter speed - I cannot use flash/strobe and tungsten/halogen lights are too hot. Lowell make a unit called Scandles but it's only 200w and I am sure you cant get much of an exposure from them. Can anyone share their experience? thanks Frank HMI is one solution, the one the movies use. Expensive, and you need a ballast as well as the lamphead, but it is reasonably portable. The flicker rate is extremely high, making any flicker virtually non-existent when compared to tungssten lamps, which makes it much better for use with scanning digital backs. It is also almost a point source, so can give very hard light if yo want it, or be modified as appropriate. There are several makes, but the only one I'm familiar with is the Elinchrom: this has a colour temperature of 5,800K. It is a 575W lamp, but be aware that HMI is much more efficient than tungsten, so it is a lot brighter than a 575W tungsten lamp or photoflood would be: the Elinchrom produces 14,000 Lux, whihc is about the same as a 2,000W tungsten halogen lamp. The Elinchrom takes all the same reflectors, softboxes, snoots, fresnels and whatever else as their flash heads do. MSR and CID lamps are more or less similar technology to HMI, but I really don't know anything about these types. Photographic flourescents are the other option. These have a very near daylight 'temperature' (in inverted commas because flourescent doesn't behave like a black-body source, so strictly it doesn't have a colour temperature). However, because the peaks and troughs in their emission are rather different to other sources, they tend not to appear quite the same on different films - not a massive difference but enough to merit some testing before investing a lot of time or money. KinoFlo are the best known manufacturer of these types of lights. They tend to be large, and linear, of course, because of the shape of the tubes. This makes for a large light source, but the light is not as soft as the size alone would suggest - it seems quite attractive when I've seen other people use it, though I haven't done so myself. Popular with fashion photographers. Power is lower than HMI sources, but even so be aware that flourescents are far more efficient than tungsten lights, and so a direct Watt for Watt comparison is extremely misleading. Thus the Scandles you mention are going to be 'worth' a lot more in light output than that 200W power consumption suggests if you are comparing them to a tungsten lamp - you could ask the manufacturer for a Lux value. HMI is much cooler running than a tungsten halogen of equivalent brightness, but obviously flourescents are much cooler still, hence their other group of fans: food photographers. A lot of people hire both these types of light rather than owning them outright so you could always do a day's hire and take some light readings / shoot some test shots before committing to a purchase. Hope that's a bit of help, Peter |
#13
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'cool' temperature lights
The only bulbs on that page that seem to meet the criteria are
http://www.goodmart.com/products/74194.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Initial Lumens at 25C=1200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213696.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens=1,200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213709.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens: 1,020 All have an internal ballast, frequency of 45 kHz. The CRI of 84 is a bit *low* for photographic work, and at a price of $20 to $25 each, they are just a bit costly ... particularly since you will need to set up somewhere between 8 and 32 of them in an array. "wsb" wrote in message ... Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...dimmable.ht m They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- xx "Bandicoot" wrote in message ... "Tsotsi" wrote in message ... I need to buy or make some cool lights (as close to daylight/5500K) as I can get, & that are a reasonable weight, are portable, and give a decent amount of f-stop/shutter speed - I cannot use flash/strobe and tungsten/halogen lights are too hot. Lowell make a unit called Scandles but it's only 200w and I am sure you cant get much of an exposure from them. Can anyone share their experience? thanks Frank HMI is one solution, the one the movies use. Expensive, and you need a ballast as well as the lamphead, but it is reasonably portable. The flicker rate is extremely high, making any flicker virtually non-existent when compared to tungssten lamps, which makes it much better for use with scanning digital backs. It is also almost a point source, so can give very hard light if yo want it, or be modified as appropriate. There are several makes, but the only one I'm familiar with is the Elinchrom: this has a colour temperature of 5,800K. It is a 575W lamp, but be aware that HMI is much more efficient than tungsten, so it is a lot brighter than a 575W tungsten lamp or photoflood would be: the Elinchrom produces 14,000 Lux, whihc is about the same as a 2,000W tungsten halogen lamp. The Elinchrom takes all the same reflectors, softboxes, snoots, fresnels and whatever else as their flash heads do. MSR and CID lamps are more or less similar technology to HMI, but I really don't know anything about these types. Photographic flourescents are the other option. These have a very near daylight 'temperature' (in inverted commas because flourescent doesn't behave like a black-body source, so strictly it doesn't have a colour temperature). However, because the peaks and troughs in their emission are rather different to other sources, they tend not to appear quite the same on different films - not a massive difference but enough to merit some testing before investing a lot of time or money. KinoFlo are the best known manufacturer of these types of lights. They tend to be large, and linear, of course, because of the shape of the tubes. This makes for a large light source, but the light is not as soft as the size alone would suggest - it seems quite attractive when I've seen other people use it, though I haven't done so myself. Popular with fashion photographers. Power is lower than HMI sources, but even so be aware that flourescents are far more efficient than tungsten lights, and so a direct Watt for Watt comparison is extremely misleading. Thus the Scandles you mention are going to be 'worth' a lot more in light output than that 200W power consumption suggests if you are comparing them to a tungsten lamp - you could ask the manufacturer for a Lux value. HMI is much cooler running than a tungsten halogen of equivalent brightness, but obviously flourescents are much cooler still, hence their other group of fans: food photographers. A lot of people hire both these types of light rather than owning them outright so you could always do a day's hire and take some light readings / shoot some test shots before committing to a purchase. Hope that's a bit of help, Peter |
#14
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'cool' temperature lights
The only bulbs on that page that seem to meet the criteria are
http://www.goodmart.com/products/74194.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Initial Lumens at 25C=1200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213696.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens=1,200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213709.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens: 1,020 All have an internal ballast, frequency of 45 kHz. The CRI of 84 is a bit *low* for photographic work, and at a price of $20 to $25 each, they are just a bit costly ... particularly since you will need to set up somewhere between 8 and 32 of them in an array. "wsb" wrote in message ... Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...dimmable.ht m They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- xx "Bandicoot" wrote in message ... "Tsotsi" wrote in message ... I need to buy or make some cool lights (as close to daylight/5500K) as I can get, & that are a reasonable weight, are portable, and give a decent amount of f-stop/shutter speed - I cannot use flash/strobe and tungsten/halogen lights are too hot. Lowell make a unit called Scandles but it's only 200w and I am sure you cant get much of an exposure from them. Can anyone share their experience? thanks Frank HMI is one solution, the one the movies use. Expensive, and you need a ballast as well as the lamphead, but it is reasonably portable. The flicker rate is extremely high, making any flicker virtually non-existent when compared to tungssten lamps, which makes it much better for use with scanning digital backs. It is also almost a point source, so can give very hard light if yo want it, or be modified as appropriate. There are several makes, but the only one I'm familiar with is the Elinchrom: this has a colour temperature of 5,800K. It is a 575W lamp, but be aware that HMI is much more efficient than tungsten, so it is a lot brighter than a 575W tungsten lamp or photoflood would be: the Elinchrom produces 14,000 Lux, whihc is about the same as a 2,000W tungsten halogen lamp. The Elinchrom takes all the same reflectors, softboxes, snoots, fresnels and whatever else as their flash heads do. MSR and CID lamps are more or less similar technology to HMI, but I really don't know anything about these types. Photographic flourescents are the other option. These have a very near daylight 'temperature' (in inverted commas because flourescent doesn't behave like a black-body source, so strictly it doesn't have a colour temperature). However, because the peaks and troughs in their emission are rather different to other sources, they tend not to appear quite the same on different films - not a massive difference but enough to merit some testing before investing a lot of time or money. KinoFlo are the best known manufacturer of these types of lights. They tend to be large, and linear, of course, because of the shape of the tubes. This makes for a large light source, but the light is not as soft as the size alone would suggest - it seems quite attractive when I've seen other people use it, though I haven't done so myself. Popular with fashion photographers. Power is lower than HMI sources, but even so be aware that flourescents are far more efficient than tungsten lights, and so a direct Watt for Watt comparison is extremely misleading. Thus the Scandles you mention are going to be 'worth' a lot more in light output than that 200W power consumption suggests if you are comparing them to a tungsten lamp - you could ask the manufacturer for a Lux value. HMI is much cooler running than a tungsten halogen of equivalent brightness, but obviously flourescents are much cooler still, hence their other group of fans: food photographers. A lot of people hire both these types of light rather than owning them outright so you could always do a day's hire and take some light readings / shoot some test shots before committing to a purchase. Hope that's a bit of help, Peter |
#15
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'cool' temperature lights
Tsotsi wrote:
the ballasts in the 'shoplite' units are 60mhz - what is the result or negative effect of using these vs the high frequency 30-40khz ballasts you wrote about - does it have to do with flicker or col or....? Don't know of any ballast rated at 60mhz. The standard ones are 60Hz. Basically, fluorescent bulbs flicker at the given frequency.That will effect what shutter speed you can use. By using a high frequency electronic ballast, you can pretty much use any shutter speed, within reason.If your shutter speed is too high, you get into timing problems and exposures can vary from exposure to exposure depending on the number of flickers your image records. As another post mentioned, the CRI is a little low. Your shoplite bulb CRI is better. There are compact fluorescents that go to the low 90's for a CRI.I haven't tried this arrangement but have been looking into it as you are now. If you want to still use a shoplite with HF ballast, the best bulb I've seen specs on is the Triten 950 for 5000K lights. For your current setup, I'd say the ballasts will be a problem if they're not HF. Wes Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...w_in_base_dimm able.htm They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- |
#16
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'cool' temperature lights
Tsotsi wrote:
the ballasts in the 'shoplite' units are 60mhz - what is the result or negative effect of using these vs the high frequency 30-40khz ballasts you wrote about - does it have to do with flicker or col or....? Don't know of any ballast rated at 60mhz. The standard ones are 60Hz. Basically, fluorescent bulbs flicker at the given frequency.That will effect what shutter speed you can use. By using a high frequency electronic ballast, you can pretty much use any shutter speed, within reason.If your shutter speed is too high, you get into timing problems and exposures can vary from exposure to exposure depending on the number of flickers your image records. As another post mentioned, the CRI is a little low. Your shoplite bulb CRI is better. There are compact fluorescents that go to the low 90's for a CRI.I haven't tried this arrangement but have been looking into it as you are now. If you want to still use a shoplite with HF ballast, the best bulb I've seen specs on is the Triten 950 for 5000K lights. For your current setup, I'd say the ballasts will be a problem if they're not HF. Wes Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...w_in_base_dimm able.htm They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- |
#17
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'cool' temperature lights
Tsotsi wrote:
the ballasts in the 'shoplite' units are 60mhz - what is the result or negative effect of using these vs the high frequency 30-40khz ballasts you wrote about - does it have to do with flicker or col or....? Don't know of any ballast rated at 60mhz. The standard ones are 60Hz. Basically, fluorescent bulbs flicker at the given frequency.That will effect what shutter speed you can use. By using a high frequency electronic ballast, you can pretty much use any shutter speed, within reason.If your shutter speed is too high, you get into timing problems and exposures can vary from exposure to exposure depending on the number of flickers your image records. As another post mentioned, the CRI is a little low. Your shoplite bulb CRI is better. There are compact fluorescents that go to the low 90's for a CRI.I haven't tried this arrangement but have been looking into it as you are now. If you want to still use a shoplite with HF ballast, the best bulb I've seen specs on is the Triten 950 for 5000K lights. For your current setup, I'd say the ballasts will be a problem if they're not HF. Wes Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...w_in_base_dimm able.htm They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- |
#18
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'cool' temperature lights
RSD99 wrote:
The only bulbs on that page that seem to meet the criteria are http://www.goodmart.com/products/74194.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Initial Lumens at 25C=1200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213696.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens=1,200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213709.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens: 1,020 All have an internal ballast, frequency of 45 kHz. The CRI of 84 is a bit *low* for photographic work, and at a price of $20 to $25 each, they are just a bit costly ... particularly since you will need to set up somewhere between 8 and 32 of them in an array. I agree. Just do a search on similar terms and you'll find many companies sell natural light fluorescent bulbs. Lowest cost ones I recall were in the $15-20 on the various websites I found. With 8 bulbs, it would be 160w, or roughly 500w standard lighting. 32 bulbs would be 640w or roughly 2000w standard lighting. You want 32 bulbs in a single fixture?? As far as price, go to B&H and price the fluorescent systems there to see why people are off trying to build their own. They should last 10K hours or more though so you amortize the cost over a long time. One problem you run into is how to control the light if you make your own setup. Wes "wsb" wrote in message ... Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...dimmable.ht m They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- xx "Bandicoot" wrote in message . .. "Tsotsi" wrote in message om... I need to buy or make some cool lights (as close to daylight/5500K) as I can get, & that are a reasonable weight, are portable, and give a decent amount of f-stop/shutter speed - I cannot use flash/strobe and tungsten/halogen lights are too hot. Lowell make a unit called Scandles but it's only 200w and I am sure you cant get much of an exposure from them. Can anyone share their experience? thanks Frank HMI is one solution, the one the movies use. Expensive, and you need a ballast as well as the lamphead, but it is reasonably portable. The flicker rate is extremely high, making any flicker virtually non-existent when compared to tungssten lamps, which makes it much better for use with scanning digital backs. It is also almost a point source, so can give very hard light if yo want it, or be modified as appropriate. There are several makes, but the only one I'm familiar with is the Elinchrom: this has a colour temperature of 5,800K. It is a 575W lamp, but be aware that HMI is much more efficient than tungsten, so it is a lot brighter than a 575W tungsten lamp or photoflood would be: the Elinchrom produces 14,000 Lux, whihc is about the same as a 2,000W tungsten halogen lamp. The Elinchrom takes all the same reflectors, softboxes, snoots, fresnels and whatever else as their flash heads do. MSR and CID lamps are more or less similar technology to HMI, but I really don't know anything about these types. Photographic flourescents are the other option. These have a very near daylight 'temperature' (in inverted commas because flourescent doesn't behave like a black-body source, so strictly it doesn't have a colour temperature). However, because the peaks and troughs in their emission are rather different to other sources, they tend not to appear quite the same on different films - not a massive difference but enough to merit some testing before investing a lot of time or money. KinoFlo are the best known manufacturer of these types of lights. They tend to be large, and linear, of course, because of the shape of the tubes. This makes for a large light source, but the light is not as soft as the size alone would suggest - it seems quite attractive when I've seen other people use it, though I haven't done so myself. Popular with fashion photographers. Power is lower than HMI sources, but even so be aware that flourescents are far more efficient than tungsten lights, and so a direct Watt for Watt comparison is extremely misleading. Thus the Scandles you mention are going to be 'worth' a lot more in light output than that 200W power consumption suggests if you are comparing them to a tungsten lamp - you could ask the manufacturer for a Lux value. HMI is much cooler running than a tungsten halogen of equivalent brightness, but obviously flourescents are much cooler still, hence their other group of fans: food photographers. A lot of people hire both these types of light rather than owning them outright so you could always do a day's hire and take some light readings / shoot some test shots before committing to a purchase. Hope that's a bit of help, Peter |
#19
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'cool' temperature lights
RSD99 wrote:
The only bulbs on that page that seem to meet the criteria are http://www.goodmart.com/products/74194.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Initial Lumens at 25C=1200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213696.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens=1,200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213709.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens: 1,020 All have an internal ballast, frequency of 45 kHz. The CRI of 84 is a bit *low* for photographic work, and at a price of $20 to $25 each, they are just a bit costly ... particularly since you will need to set up somewhere between 8 and 32 of them in an array. I agree. Just do a search on similar terms and you'll find many companies sell natural light fluorescent bulbs. Lowest cost ones I recall were in the $15-20 on the various websites I found. With 8 bulbs, it would be 160w, or roughly 500w standard lighting. 32 bulbs would be 640w or roughly 2000w standard lighting. You want 32 bulbs in a single fixture?? As far as price, go to B&H and price the fluorescent systems there to see why people are off trying to build their own. They should last 10K hours or more though so you amortize the cost over a long time. One problem you run into is how to control the light if you make your own setup. Wes "wsb" wrote in message ... Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...dimmable.ht m They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- xx "Bandicoot" wrote in message . .. "Tsotsi" wrote in message om... I need to buy or make some cool lights (as close to daylight/5500K) as I can get, & that are a reasonable weight, are portable, and give a decent amount of f-stop/shutter speed - I cannot use flash/strobe and tungsten/halogen lights are too hot. Lowell make a unit called Scandles but it's only 200w and I am sure you cant get much of an exposure from them. Can anyone share their experience? thanks Frank HMI is one solution, the one the movies use. Expensive, and you need a ballast as well as the lamphead, but it is reasonably portable. The flicker rate is extremely high, making any flicker virtually non-existent when compared to tungssten lamps, which makes it much better for use with scanning digital backs. It is also almost a point source, so can give very hard light if yo want it, or be modified as appropriate. There are several makes, but the only one I'm familiar with is the Elinchrom: this has a colour temperature of 5,800K. It is a 575W lamp, but be aware that HMI is much more efficient than tungsten, so it is a lot brighter than a 575W tungsten lamp or photoflood would be: the Elinchrom produces 14,000 Lux, whihc is about the same as a 2,000W tungsten halogen lamp. The Elinchrom takes all the same reflectors, softboxes, snoots, fresnels and whatever else as their flash heads do. MSR and CID lamps are more or less similar technology to HMI, but I really don't know anything about these types. Photographic flourescents are the other option. These have a very near daylight 'temperature' (in inverted commas because flourescent doesn't behave like a black-body source, so strictly it doesn't have a colour temperature). However, because the peaks and troughs in their emission are rather different to other sources, they tend not to appear quite the same on different films - not a massive difference but enough to merit some testing before investing a lot of time or money. KinoFlo are the best known manufacturer of these types of lights. They tend to be large, and linear, of course, because of the shape of the tubes. This makes for a large light source, but the light is not as soft as the size alone would suggest - it seems quite attractive when I've seen other people use it, though I haven't done so myself. Popular with fashion photographers. Power is lower than HMI sources, but even so be aware that flourescents are far more efficient than tungsten lights, and so a direct Watt for Watt comparison is extremely misleading. Thus the Scandles you mention are going to be 'worth' a lot more in light output than that 200W power consumption suggests if you are comparing them to a tungsten lamp - you could ask the manufacturer for a Lux value. HMI is much cooler running than a tungsten halogen of equivalent brightness, but obviously flourescents are much cooler still, hence their other group of fans: food photographers. A lot of people hire both these types of light rather than owning them outright so you could always do a day's hire and take some light readings / shoot some test shots before committing to a purchase. Hope that's a bit of help, Peter |
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'cool' temperature lights
RSD99 wrote:
The only bulbs on that page that seem to meet the criteria are http://www.goodmart.com/products/74194.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Initial Lumens at 25C=1200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213696.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens=1,200 http://www.goodmart.com/products/213709.htm Color Temp = 5100 deg K CRI = 84 Lumens: 1,020 All have an internal ballast, frequency of 45 kHz. The CRI of 84 is a bit *low* for photographic work, and at a price of $20 to $25 each, they are just a bit costly ... particularly since you will need to set up somewhere between 8 and 32 of them in an array. I agree. Just do a search on similar terms and you'll find many companies sell natural light fluorescent bulbs. Lowest cost ones I recall were in the $15-20 on the various websites I found. With 8 bulbs, it would be 160w, or roughly 500w standard lighting. 32 bulbs would be 640w or roughly 2000w standard lighting. You want 32 bulbs in a single fixture?? As far as price, go to B&H and price the fluorescent systems there to see why people are off trying to build their own. They should last 10K hours or more though so you amortize the cost over a long time. One problem you run into is how to control the light if you make your own setup. Wes "wsb" wrote in message ... Use high frequency ballasts if you're going to try that. Standard ballasts are 60Hz. The high frequency ones are something like 30-40Khz. Same tubes work for both ballasts. The problem is how to control/position a bank of lights. Take a look at: http://www.goodmart.com/products/bul...dimmable.ht m They have HF dimmable, various color temp screw-in bulbs.The max bulb is 20 watt but they are much smaller than a shoplight. Four bulbs would be 80watt. Also would give you more adjustable light levels. I'd estimate 80 watt fluorescent is about 240watt standard bulbs. Wes Tsotsi wrote: I just bought a bunch of 48 inch "shoplights" from the hardware store - the units are all wired up and ready to plug in. A bank of 10 units would give a 4 foot x 4 foot light bank - all connected to a good power bar. With 2 tubes in each unit at 40W per tube = 80W, 10 units would draw 800watts which should be ok for a household circuit. I found Philips "natural sunshine" 48 inch tubes rated at 5000K and 92 CRI. What do you all think of this plan? -- xx "Bandicoot" wrote in message . .. "Tsotsi" wrote in message om... I need to buy or make some cool lights (as close to daylight/5500K) as I can get, & that are a reasonable weight, are portable, and give a decent amount of f-stop/shutter speed - I cannot use flash/strobe and tungsten/halogen lights are too hot. Lowell make a unit called Scandles but it's only 200w and I am sure you cant get much of an exposure from them. Can anyone share their experience? thanks Frank HMI is one solution, the one the movies use. Expensive, and you need a ballast as well as the lamphead, but it is reasonably portable. The flicker rate is extremely high, making any flicker virtually non-existent when compared to tungssten lamps, which makes it much better for use with scanning digital backs. It is also almost a point source, so can give very hard light if yo want it, or be modified as appropriate. There are several makes, but the only one I'm familiar with is the Elinchrom: this has a colour temperature of 5,800K. It is a 575W lamp, but be aware that HMI is much more efficient than tungsten, so it is a lot brighter than a 575W tungsten lamp or photoflood would be: the Elinchrom produces 14,000 Lux, whihc is about the same as a 2,000W tungsten halogen lamp. The Elinchrom takes all the same reflectors, softboxes, snoots, fresnels and whatever else as their flash heads do. MSR and CID lamps are more or less similar technology to HMI, but I really don't know anything about these types. Photographic flourescents are the other option. These have a very near daylight 'temperature' (in inverted commas because flourescent doesn't behave like a black-body source, so strictly it doesn't have a colour temperature). However, because the peaks and troughs in their emission are rather different to other sources, they tend not to appear quite the same on different films - not a massive difference but enough to merit some testing before investing a lot of time or money. KinoFlo are the best known manufacturer of these types of lights. They tend to be large, and linear, of course, because of the shape of the tubes. This makes for a large light source, but the light is not as soft as the size alone would suggest - it seems quite attractive when I've seen other people use it, though I haven't done so myself. Popular with fashion photographers. Power is lower than HMI sources, but even so be aware that flourescents are far more efficient than tungsten lights, and so a direct Watt for Watt comparison is extremely misleading. Thus the Scandles you mention are going to be 'worth' a lot more in light output than that 200W power consumption suggests if you are comparing them to a tungsten lamp - you could ask the manufacturer for a Lux value. HMI is much cooler running than a tungsten halogen of equivalent brightness, but obviously flourescents are much cooler still, hence their other group of fans: food photographers. A lot of people hire both these types of light rather than owning them outright so you could always do a day's hire and take some light readings / shoot some test shots before committing to a purchase. Hope that's a bit of help, Peter |
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