Whatever happened to Art Kramer?

TAFKAB wrote:

He posts every now and then, but for some reason, seems to catch flack from
a few acidic posters for no good reason. I think they drove him away.

Being one of those acidic posters, I would say the only problems with Art were
the rambling war stories, which I enjoyed, but which should have been posted in
the appropriate group; and like some other Leicaphiles the unmoveable position
that there are cameras (Leicas) and things that are not cameras (not Leicas) and
thus an opinion that does not fit with charter, nor spirit, of this group.

Cheers,
Alan



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Tony wrote:

Art is still promoting his website only now he has learned to pose his
promotions in the form of questions so people don't accuse him of spamming.
Example of his questions "Are pictures from digital cameras good enough to
print?" One has to assume a former writer for photo magazines knows a little
more than that - unless he has the oldtimers.
The problem with this "Greatest Generation" crap is that a lot of the old
timers already thought they were pretty special, and have been nothing but
rude to younger vets from later wars.

Well, thank your lucky stars we have a few rude younger "vets".
Promoting their own stuff, only with top posting, failing to trim, and
excessive sig lines.

Crap, indeed.

--
John McWilliams.

Coach: "Are you just ignorant, or merely apathetic?"
Player: "Coach, I don't know, and I don't care."

He got shot down by a newsgroup.

Excelsior, you fatheads!
-Chris-

"TAFKAB" writes:

He posts every now and then, but for some reason, seems to catch flack

That's "flak", son. A German contraction for "Fliegerangriffkanone".
No wonder they contracted it.

snip

--
-Stephen H. Westin
Any information or opinions in this message are mine: they do not
represent the position of Cornell University or any of its sponsors.

ChrisPlatt wrote:

He got shot down by a newsgroup.

SNORT, cough. Chuckle.


--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.

Alan Browne wrote:
ChrisPlatt wrote:

He got shot down by a newsgroup.


He was run off after he began to post rambling paragraphs with gross
spelling and punctuation errors. He got pretty rude when people told
him to check his keyboard.

I suspect his network privileges were taken away by his
caretakers...There's a fear that when people that old start doing that
they might post things they shouldn't. So he may have been banished or
limited to read only access.

Perhaps the net-nanny programs are as useful for the old as for the
young...I wonder if it's a market segment anyone caters to?

Anyway, as for the Leica stuff: keep in mind that more Leicas built
before WWII still work than not. How many modern cameras will work in
50 years?

He was run off after he began to post rambling paragraphs with gross spelling
and punctuation errors.

I got more good information from the Art Kramer magazine columns that I saved
during the years than from all of the wiseass Usenet posters combined.

Some people know their stuff. Others think they do. Real photographers can tell
the difference.

....pt

-------------------------------
Business/Communications start at http://www.PhilipTobias.com.
Grow your business using my technical and marketing communications -
Effective writing, graphic design, multimedia, photos, and Web sites.

Phil Tobias wrote:
He was run off after he began to post rambling paragraphs with
gross spelling
and punctuation errors.

I got more good information from the Art Kramer magazine columns that
I saved
during the years than from all of the wiseass Usenet posters
combined.

Some people know their stuff. Others think they do. Real
photographers can tell
the difference.

No one will deny that Kramer was a very intelligent man, if
opinionated,in his day. But he posted some stuff that by its appearance
gave the impression he had "lost it". He became very agitated and
apparently irrational when it was pointed out: in addition he's been
intransigent to the point of irrationality for awhile. So a lot of
people figured he had been afflicted.

With modern medicine many more people live to Kramer's age than did
twenty years ago-some of them are in a state best described as
afflicted but apparently functional. They can drive cars, type, talk to
you, mow the lawn, et al. But at the corners of the envelope,"there be
draggons". I have had for example WWII vets get agitated to the point
of violence when questioned further that they had, for example, worked
on Merlin powered P-38's in Hawaii or carried a automatic pistol
chambered .38 Special or that so-and-so was a convicted draft dodger.
(The man wasn't). They were THERE goddamnit and YOU WEREN"T BORN YET!
In a way students of WWII will have it easier in twenty years-they'll
have to rely on written documentation and pictures. I have been
fascinated with a lot of aspects of old technology and culture all my
life and can remember when the WWII generation was in its sixties, you
could get a lot of useful information and if they were off they'd
either admit it or be obvious goofs and you'd walk off. Now they all
have the mantle of extreme age and if you ask a question you might get
the truth...or some mixed up memories...or pure horse****..and to avoid
being a boor you just have to nod your head and smile when you are
being told pure nonsense. When a guy's a certain age, like Arthur
Miller, you just have to either agreeably listen to pure crap or
politely avoid the old *******.

In article .com, Ted wrote:
on Merlin powered P-38's in Hawaii or carried a automatic pistol
chambered .38 Special

WW II led to some strange technology and aliances. For example,
Smith & Wesson made (and still does AFIK) a revolver in .45 ACP and
Colt made a version of the 1911 pistol that took .357
magnum shells (though I think the shells were modified).

IBM made M1 carbines, Remington Rand made 1911 pistols.

E. Leitz exported Leica cameras and lenses from Nazi Germany via Switzerland.
In the U.S. they had the "E Leitz Wetzlar", engraving replaced with
"E Leitz New York" and were sold to the U.S. government. In exchange,
their factories were never bombed.

Mitsubishi automotive factories in Japan were owned by Chrysler and were
also never bombed.

At least Art Kramer has his lucid moments. If you think he's "lost it",
then he's in good company on this news group, IMHO many of the people who
post here long ago "lost it".

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a lunch meeting with George Eastman. :-)

Geoff.

--
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IL Voice: 972-544-608-069 IL Fax: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
I may be an old fart, but I'm a high-tech, up to date old fart. :-)

On 8 Dec 2004 15:37:16 -0800, "Ted" wrote:

With modern medicine many more people live to Kramer's age than did
twenty years ago-some of them are in a state best described as
afflicted but apparently functional. They can drive cars, type, talk to
you, mow the lawn, et al. But at the corners of the envelope,"there be
draggons".

Which explains William Graham. A 70+ man with some truly frightening
ideas who admits to being constantly armed in case of barbarians.