The deals on Ebay

I've been keeping an eye on ebay lately, with a mind for purchasing a
large-format rig. I'd really like the Shen-Hao, even if it doesn't offer
full movements, but there are none used on Ebay, and a new one with a lens
costs $1200.

But then there's the ebay thing--here are a few I tracked, which I assume
are representative of a particular price range/product. These are already
completed auctions--this is not an ebay advertisement:

http://tinyurl.com/ywwwx
http://tinyurl.com/2d792
http://tinyurl.com/3c4ex

All of these appear to be entry level large format cameras--what are the
limitations one might generally expect from entry level view cameras such as
these? Is there anything in particular to watch out for?

For 3-4 hundred bucks, these seem like a great deal.

Then there's the Aletta and Bender do it yourself-ers. I'm curious as to
why anyone would anyone spend $300 on one of those when you can get one of
the aforementioned ebay deals including lenses and boards and film holders,
etc., for around the same money?

Regards,
Matt Clara
www.mattclara.com

Subject: The deals on Ebay
From: "mjc"
Date: 4/2/2004 1:16 PM Mountain Standard Time
Message-id:

I've been keeping an eye on ebay lately, with a mind for purchasing a
large-format rig. I'd really like the Shen-Hao, even if it doesn't offer
full movements, but there are none used on Ebay, and a new one with a lens
costs $1200.

But then there's the ebay thing--here are a few I tracked, which I assume
are representative of a particular price range/product. These are already
completed auctions--this is not an ebay advertisement:

http://tinyurl.com/ywwwx
http://tinyurl.com/2d792
http://tinyurl.com/3c4ex

All of these appear to be entry level large format cameras--what are the
limitations one might generally expect from entry level view cameras such as
these? Is there anything in particular to watch out for?

For 3-4 hundred bucks, these seem like a great deal.

Then there's the Aletta and Bender do it yourself-ers. I'm curious as to
why anyone would anyone spend $300 on one of those when you can get one of
the aforementioned ebay deals including lenses and boards and film holders,
etc., for around the same money?

Regards,
Matt Clara
www.mattclara.com


Before buying a camera may I suggest the Free Articles on the View Camera
magazine web site

www.viewcamera.com

If you can make it there is a View Camera conference in Monterey, CA April
23-25. You will see more cameras here than any place I can think of. The trade
show is free and you do not need to sign up in advance. Info is also on our web
site.

Here are some books that might be helpful

User's Guide to the View Camera by Jim Stone

Large Format Nature Photography by Jack Dykinga

Using the View Camera that I wrote a few years ago. Any/all should be available
from Amazon.com


steve simmons

mjc wrote:
I've been keeping an eye on ebay lately, with a mind for purchasing a
large-format rig. I'd really like the Shen-Hao, even if it doesn't offer
full movements, but there are none used on Ebay, and a new one with a lens
costs $1200.

But then there's the ebay thing--here are a few I tracked, which I assume
are representative of a particular price range/product. These are already
completed auctions--this is not an ebay advertisement:

http://tinyurl.com/ywwwx
http://tinyurl.com/2d792
http://tinyurl.com/3c4ex

All of these appear to be entry level large format cameras--what are the
limitations one might generally expect from entry level view cameras such as
these? Is there anything in particular to watch out for?


You're looking at monorails of various types. The first Calumet I think is
better then the last one. None of the pictures are that great and I don't
think the text ever mentioned what lenses they came with. One of the sellers
had no feedback. So between the pictures and the lack of feedback those
prices are possibly lower then they might have been.

The limitations relative to the Shen-hao are going to be in weight and
in how easy they are to haul around. Once you get them to the location they
likely all have more movements and longer bellows then the Shen-hao does.
They might only have spring backs so if you want to use a roll back check
that out. If the Shen-hao is coming with a new lens then you don't need to
worry if the lens and shutter are in good condition. Of course you need to
worry about the condition of the camera itself.





Then there's the Aletta and Bender do it yourself-ers. I'm curious as to
why anyone would anyone spend $300 on one of those when you can get one of
the aforementioned ebay deals including lenses and boards and film holders,
etc., for around the same money?


Some people like to build things. Some don't feel confident buying off
ebay. Some don't know any better. Some are trying to learn how to build a
camera so they then can then build what they really wanted. Lots of reasons.
Only the buyer can decide how good the reason is.

Nick

On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 20:16:51 GMT, "mjc" wrote:

I've been keeping an eye on ebay lately, with a mind for purchasing a
large-format rig. I'd really like the Shen-Hao, even if it doesn't offer
full movements, but there are none used on Ebay, and a new one with a lens
costs $1200.


Get a new ShenHao from Badger and get a
very nice 150 mm f/5.6 for $200 on eBay.

The Shen-Hao has all movements execpt shift.
It has rise/fall, swing, and tilt on both front and rear.
It's beautifully built, and the bellows draw should
comfortably accomodate a 240 or 270 mm lens.

(Still shopping for my first long lens, see below.)

Lenses in the "normal" range of 150 - 180 mm
are easy to find on eBay and are relatively
inexpensive. So you can easily have your outfit
for $900 instead of $1200.

Don't diss the Shen-Hao. It's a beaut. And the
folks at Badger are cool. The camera comes
with a lens board, and they'll drill it to fit whatever
lens you have in mind.

(Not affiliated with Badger, just a happy customer...)


rafe b.
http://www.terrapinphoto.com


WTB: Fuji 240 mm f/9. Please email offline.

"Raphael Bustin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 02 Apr 2004 20:16:51 GMT, "mjc" wrote:

I've been keeping an eye on ebay lately, with a mind for purchasing a
large-format rig. I'd really like the Shen-Hao, even if it doesn't offer
full movements, but there are none used on Ebay, and a new one with a
lens
costs $1200.


Get a new ShenHao from Badger and get a
very nice 150 mm f/5.6 for $200 on eBay.

The Shen-Hao has all movements execpt shift.
It has rise/fall, swing, and tilt on both front and rear.
It's beautifully built, and the bellows draw should
comfortably accomodate a 240 or 270 mm lens.

(Still shopping for my first long lens, see below.)

Lenses in the "normal" range of 150 - 180 mm
are easy to find on eBay and are relatively
inexpensive. So you can easily have your outfit
for $900 instead of $1200.

Don't diss the Shen-Hao. It's a beaut. And the
folks at Badger are cool. The camera comes
with a lens board, and they'll drill it to fit whatever
lens you have in mind.

(Not affiliated with Badger, just a happy customer...)


rafe b.
http://www.terrapinphoto.com


WTB: Fuji 240 mm f/9. Please email offline.

Thanks Rafe, I'm not putting down the Shen-Hao, I just can't afford it right
now. $300-$400, on the other hand, I can swing without raising my wife's
eyebrows _too_ far--the $1000 lens I just bought for my 35mm rig has put her
off a bit!

--
Regards,
Matt Clara
www.mattclara.com

On Fri, 2 Apr 2004 21:10:38 -0800, "AArDvarK"
wrote:


Add it all up and it is not menial. I would say it costs
*one hell* of a lot more than a sweet $900.xx ... even
if buying a cheap monorail to learn with. And a great
many details to keep in mental tune.

now I challenge all of you to economize on all of this,
because one set of sweet ideals is not the way to think
about getting into large format, please, don't fantasize.


First of all, the OP is not exactly a newbie
who's never held a camera before. So
a few of the items you list would already
be part of his kit.

I don't believe anyone was claiming that
$1200 or $900 was going to be the end-all.
I believe most of us understand that there
are costs beyond just the camera and lens.

Even so, I've managed to take a few half
decent 4x5 images without the Fred Picker
Zone VI book, or the "specialized" note book.

Lens wrap: take a small terrycloth towel,
fold in half, sew up two sides to form a pouch.

Another camera can function as a light meter.
Quick-release gear is convenient but by no
means mandatory. Etc. etc.


rafe b.
http://www.terrapinphoto.com

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 05:34:16 GMT, "Matt Clara"
wrote:


Thanks Rafe, I'm not putting down the Shen-Hao, I just can't afford it right
now. $300-$400, on the other hand, I can swing without raising my wife's
eyebrows _too_ far--the $1000 lens I just bought for my 35mm rig has put her
off a bit!


Well, Aardvark has a point... there will be a few other
expenses as well.

How do you plan to get prints from your 4x5 film?

I'm presently figuring around $3 or $4 per exposure,
for film and lab processing.

Pretty outrageous compared to 35 mm or MF.


rafe b.
http://www.terrapinphoto.com

"AArDvarK" wrote in message
news:2Hrbc.69616$1I5.67875@fed1read01...

"Raphael Bustin"
Get a new ShenHao from Badger and get a
very nice 150 mm f/5.6 for $200 on eBay.

The Shen-Hao has all movements execpt shift.
It has rise/fall, swing, and tilt on both front and rear.
It's beautifully built, and the bellows draw should
comfortably accomodate a 240 or 270 mm lens.

(Still shopping for my first long lens, see below.)

Lenses in the "normal" range of 150 - 180 mm
are easy to find on eBay and are relatively
inexpensive. So you can easily have your outfit
for $900 instead of $1200.

I would say it is important to consider all the extras
at actual cost, film holders, how many used @$8 -
$12 each? Each one is two exposures ... a note book
that is specialized for recording exposures in con-
junction with the pencil markings on the holders,
of course the film itself, dark cloth, spot meter and
it's calibration if bought used (a must), a Fred Picker
Zone VI book, the CLA on the used shutter the lens
is in, the decent quality cable release, the tripod that
is sturdy enough to cope with a 4x5, the quick release
for both the camera and the tripod, lens cleaning
supplies, lens filters, shades for the lenses, the
carrying case, lens wraps, a ground-glass protector,
film changing bag, oh and jee-whiz ... possibly an
entire darkroom too, of which it is possible to do
without an actual "dark-room" but that is another
lesson, and set of costs.

Add it all up and it is not menial. I would say it costs
*one hell* of a lot more than a sweet $900.xx ... even
if buying a cheap monorail to learn with. And a great
many details to keep in mental tune.

now I challenge all of you to economize on all of this,
because one set of sweet ideals is not the way to think
about getting into large format, please, don't fantasize.

Alex



I've got all that, thanks--just need the large format camera, a lens, film
holder and film. I suppose I'll need a dark cloth, too, but something tells
me I could find something to do in a pinch.
Maybe an old refrigerator box?
;-)

--
Regards,
Matt Clara
www.mattclara.com

"Matt Clara"

[snip]
lens filters, shades for the lenses, the
carrying case, lens wraps, a ground-glass protector,
film changing bag, oh and jee-whiz ... possibly an
entire darkroom too, of which it is possible to do
without an actual "dark-room" but that is another
lesson, and set of costs.

Add it all up and it is not menial. I would say it costs
*one hell* of a lot more than a sweet $900.xx ... even
if buying a cheap monorail to learn with. And a great
many details to keep in mental tune.

now I challenge all of you to economize on all of this,
because one set of sweet ideals is not the way to think
about getting into large format, please, don't fantasize.

Alex



I've got all that, thanks--just need the large format camera, a lens, film
holder and film. I suppose I'll need a dark cloth, too, but something tells
me I could find something to do in a pinch.
Maybe an old refrigerator box?
;-)

--
Regards,
Matt Clara
www.mattclara.com

Well that's cool, right~on, now what do you think of the
difference between monorail and field folding cameras?

Alex

Two23 wrote:

I'm presently figuring around $3 or $4 per exposure,
for film and lab processing.

Pretty outrageous compared to 35 mm or MF.


Don't be ridiculous. With 4x5 you generally only shoot a few frames a
day.
With 35mm, you shoot a couple of rolls. I shoot 35mm, 645, and 4x5 and
find
that I actually spend less total $$ when shooting 4x5. And if 35mm was
giving me the quality I wanted I never would have gotten into 4x5 in the
first place.



Exactly. The only hassle with 4X5 IMHO is setting up the camera takes
longer. Probably why I shoot more medformat than 4X5 nowadays.

--

Stacey