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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber
tripod come apart on me. The failure location is near the top of the tripod, between the top interface plate and the top of the center column tube. The (now revealed) bottom of the interface plate is like a plug that slides down inside the ID of the center column tube. Looks like it was a glue failure. FYI these two parts are also both keyed. This is intended to carry the torsion forces of screwing down a ball head so as to minimize forces being imparted on the glue joint itself. FYI, there's some silver-colored residue "stuff" which apparently was the original glue/adhesive. I quickly found this online reference, which a quick read suggests using either superglue or some epoxies, etc: https://www.permabond.com/materials_bonded/how-to-bond-carbon-fiber-2/ Suggestions? I do know that my next step is to unpack the gear and check to see what material the interface plate's "plug" is made out of; don't believe it to be carbon fiber as it appears machined ... but black in color: I suspect it is anodized aluminum? Similarly, what solvents to use to clean the surfaces will also need checking as well. -hh |
#2
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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
hh:
Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber tripod come apart on me. You wouldn’t consider contacting Gitzo for a repair before gumming it up to the point where they won’t even look at it? |
#3
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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
On Wednesday, December 4, 2019 at 11:09:44 AM UTC-5, Davoud wrote:
hh: Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber tripod come apart on me. You wouldn’t consider contacting Gitzo for a repair before gumming it up to the point where they won’t even look at it? Not really. Its an older model (no warranty) and Gitzo repair services doesn't have a particularly good reputation: I'd rather not be without the tripod for ~6 months. FYI, the recommended cleaner appears to be denatured alcohol and if one goes with 2-part epoxy, the recommendation is to avoid the fast-set stuff because of heat generated; go with 24hr. -hh |
#4
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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
On 12/4/2019 11:22 AM, -hh wrote:
On Wednesday, December 4, 2019 at 11:09:44 AM UTC-5, Davoud wrote: hh: Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber tripod come apart on me. You wouldn’t consider contacting Gitzo for a repair before gumming it up to the point where they won’t even look at it? Not really. Its an older model (no warranty) and Gitzo repair services doesn't have a particularly good reputation: I'd rather not be without the tripod for ~6 months. FYI, the recommended cleaner appears to be denatured alcohol and if one goes with 2-part epoxy, the recommendation is to avoid the fast-set stuff because of heat generated; go with 24hr. I agree with the 2-part epoxy. It will adhere to most materials and provide good strength once it has set. I don't know how important it would be to remove the existing residue, since the epoxy may dissolve the residue while it sets. -- best regards, Neil |
#5
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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
On 2019-12-04 14:41, Neil wrote:
On 12/4/2019 11:22 AM, -hh wrote: On Wednesday, December 4, 2019 at 11:09:44 AM UTC-5, Davoud wrote: hh: Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber tripod come apart on me. You wouldn’t consider contacting Gitzo for a repair before gumming it up to the point where they won’t even look at it? Not really.Â* Its an older model (no warranty) and Gitzo repair services doesn't have a particularly good reputation:Â* I'd rather not be without the tripod for ~6 months. FYI, the recommended cleaner appears to be denatured alcohol and if one goes with 2-part epoxy, the recommendation is to avoid the fast-set stuff because of heat generated; go with 24hr. I agree with the 2-part epoxy. It will adhere to most materials and provide good strength once it has set. I don't know how important it would be to remove the existing residue, since the epoxy may dissolve the residue while it sets. Epoxy doesn't dissolve much, if anything. It's always best to have surfaces that are as clean as possible. If they are very smooth, you can 'rough' them up to improve bonding. With carbon fibre breaks it's usually more than rough enough. |
#6
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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
On 12/6/2019 9:10 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2019-12-04 14:41, Neil wrote: On 12/4/2019 11:22 AM, -hh wrote: On Wednesday, December 4, 2019 at 11:09:44 AM UTC-5, Davoud wrote: hh: Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber tripod come apart on me. You wouldn’t consider contacting Gitzo for a repair before gumming it up to the point where they won’t even look at it? Not really.Â* Its an older model (no warranty) and Gitzo repair services doesn't have a particularly good reputation:Â* I'd rather not be without the tripod for ~6 months. FYI, the recommended cleaner appears to be denatured alcohol and if one goes with 2-part epoxy, the recommendation is to avoid the fast-set stuff because of heat generated; go with 24hr. I agree with the 2-part epoxy. It will adhere to most materials and provide good strength once it has set. I don't know how important it would be to remove the existing residue, since the epoxy may dissolve the residue while it sets. Epoxy doesn't dissolve much, if anything.Â* It's always best to have surfaces that are as clean as possible.Â* If they are very smooth, you can 'rough' them up to improve bonding.Â* With carbon fibre breaks it's usually more than rough enough. As a read the OP's message, it didn't come across as a break, but a disassembly of the leg and head mount. -hh wrote: "The failure location is near the top of the tripod, between the top interface plate and the top of the center column tube. "The (now revealed) bottom of the interface plate is like a plug that slides down inside the ID of the center column tube. Looks like it was a glue failure. FYI these two parts are also both keyed. This is intended to carry the torsion forces of screwing down a ball head so as to minimize forces being imparted on the glue joint itself." If so, the likely adhesive is epoxy, and the application of 2-part epoxy would probably dissolve the original. If it didn't it wouldn't matter because the parts would bond anyway. -- best regards, Neil |
#7
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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
On 04/12/2019 12:18, -hh wrote:
Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber tripod come apart on me. The failure location is near the top of the tripod, between the top interface plate and the top of the center column tube. The (now revealed) bottom of the interface plate is like a plug that slides down inside the ID of the center column tube. Looks like it was a glue failure. FYI these two parts are also both keyed. This is intended to carry the torsion forces of screwing down a ball head so as to minimize forces being imparted on the glue joint itself. FYI, there's some silver-colored residue "stuff" which apparently was the original glue/adhesive. I quickly found this online reference, which a quick read suggests using either superglue or some epoxies, etc: https://www.permabond.com/materials_bonded/how-to-bond-carbon-fiber-2/ Suggestions? I do know that my next step is to unpack the gear and check to see what material the interface plate's "plug" is made out of; don't believe it to be carbon fiber as it appears machined ... but black in color: I suspect it is anodized aluminum? Similarly, what solvents to use to clean the surfaces will also need checking as well. -hh Solvent: isopropanol or other alcohol, acetone will also work. Glue: two part epoxy. |
#8
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Repairing carbon fiber - adhesive recommendations?
On 2019-12-04 07:18, -hh wrote:
Just back from a trip where I had the unplanned experience of my Gitzo carbon fiber tripod come apart on me. The failure location is near the top of the tripod, between the top interface plate and the top of the center column tube. The (now revealed) bottom of the interface plate is like a plug that slides down inside the ID of the center column tube. Looks like it was a glue failure. FYI these two parts are also both keyed. This is intended to carry the torsion forces of screwing down a ball head so as to minimize forces being imparted on the glue joint itself. FYI, there's some silver-colored residue "stuff" which apparently was the original glue/adhesive. I quickly found this online reference, which a quick read suggests using either superglue or some epoxies, etc: https://www.permabond.com/materials_bonded/how-to-bond-carbon-fiber-2/ Suggestions? Epoxy is my choice. Note that full hardness takes about 24 hours. (This will be on the epoxy instructions). Initial setting can be accelerated with heat from a hair dryer (for example) - but take care if there are parts that may expand and upset the bonding area. Use mild clamping force. It's good to do a mock setup to make sure everything will hold together before mixing the expoxy. I do know that my next step is to unpack the gear and check to see what material the interface plate's "plug" is made out of; don't believe it to be carbon fiber as it appears machined ... but black in color: I suspect it is anodized aluminum? Similarly, what solvents to use to clean the surfaces will also need checking as well. Isopropyl alcohol to clean parts before using epoxy. Let dry completely. Dishsoap to clean expoxy messes before it sets (minutes). I usually mix epoxy on a sheet of aluminum paper with a toothpick. A later trick I use is the tops of jars. Then after the waste epoxy sets the jar top is still available for later jobs. |
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