Why do Nikon bother producing 'non-printable' manuals??

On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:23:15 +0100, Chris H
wrote:

In message , tony cooper
writes
On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 07:10:37 +0100, Chris H
wrote:

In message , Dave writes
I wanted to get an electronic version of the D3's manual.

I get to a page:

http://support.nikontech.com/cgi-bin...ser/std_adp.ph
p?p_faqid=14438

where it says:

"To protect against Copyright Infringement, Nikon offers two versions
of our current product manuals. A fully printable manual for existing
owners (which requires a valid, North American, Nikon camera serial
number and registration to download) and a non-printable version for
others (no serial number required).If you need an account, click here"

We then have two links:

* Printable, Requires Serial Number - File Size ~ 17.3MB
* Non-printable, No Serial Number required - File Size ~ 17.3 MB

It's probably because Nikon USA are a bunch of prats.

It's more likely to be because Nikon USA discourages the purchase of
"gray market" Nikons that don't come with manuals or don't come with
manuals in English.

That is a reasonable point. If you have a UK D3 you get the manual from
the UK site.

Does the US have a problem with gray imports?

Depends on what you call "a problem". One of the major camera stores
in the US (B&H Camera) sells Nikons imported through Nikon USA and
gray market cameras that bypass Nikon USA. The store is very up-front
about it and tells you if the Nikon item you are ordering is gray
market or through Nikon USA. The pricing is better on the gray market
Nikon items.

Nikon USA will not service or perform warranty work on the gray market
cameras. B&H, though, offers a limited in-store warranty. See:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/GreyMarketStatic.jsp

Where it becomes a problem is with less honest sellers who offer gray
market items without informing the customer. The customer isn't aware
that they purchased a gray market item until they need service. These
sellers don't provide service.

It's like most other things: an informed buyer may decide that the
savings offset the risk. It's not informing the buyer that's the
problem.







--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

tony wrote on Sat, 16 Aug 2008 11:14:50 -0400:

tony cooper wrote:

It's more likely to be because Nikon USA discourages the
purchase of "gray market" Nikons that don't come with
manuals or don't come with manuals in English.

A far more effective way to stop these 'gray imports' would
be to sell the products for the same price in each country.

I don't see how either Nikon or Nikon USA can control the
retail pricing of their products. In the US, sales are
through distributors (camera stores, retail outlets, etc).
"Gray market" Nikons are also available through distributors -
and sometimes the same distributors that sell the Nikon USA
products - but don't have the same warranty features.

The only reason I did not get my D3 from outside the UK was
that is was more money than I was willing to risk. But for a
£500-£1000 lens I would not think twice about it if the
savings were sufficiently large.

I don't know how the market works in the UK, but I have
noticed that many UK residents say they pay more for the same
basic model than do the US buyers. I would think, though,
that this is the retail structure and not the Nikon pricing
structure. I don't know for sure, though.

Don't British buyers pay prices including 17% (?) VAT tax? I admit that
does not account for all the discrepancies. I've seen a lot of British
gadgets priced in almost the same number of Pounds as the things cost in
the US in dollars.

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

James Silverton wrote:
[]
Don't British buyers pay prices including 17% (?) VAT tax? I admit
that does not account for all the discrepancies. I've seen a lot of
British gadgets priced in almost the same number of Pounds as the
things cost in the US in dollars.

James,

Prices for consumer-market goods would typical include all taxes, but post
& packing may be extra. Prices for "industrial" or "professional" markets
would typically not include the 17.5% tax etc. Buyer beware!

[cross-posting trimmed]

David

tony cooper wrote:

That is a reasonable point. If you have a UK D3 you get the manual from
the UK site.

If you fancy having a printed copy of the manual, whether or not you own
a D3, you can get it from the European site, so US uses can bypass all
that rubbish.

There is no need for me to be logged into the European site to download
a D3 manual that prints. There are not a non-printable version on Nikon
Europe.



Does the US have a problem with gray imports?

Depends on what you call "a problem". One of the major camera stores
in the US (B&H Camera) sells Nikons imported through Nikon USA and
gray market cameras that bypass Nikon USA. The store is very up-front
about it and tells you if the Nikon item you are ordering is gray
market or through Nikon USA. The pricing is better on the gray market
Nikon items.

Nikon USA will not service or perform warranty work on the gray market
cameras. B&H, though, offers a limited in-store warranty. See:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/GreyMarketStatic.jsp


Nice, I see they are very upfront about it, also mentioning that gray
import film might not be kept under the conditions US film would have
been. Very honest.

It's like most other things: an informed buyer may decide that the
savings offset the risk. It's not informing the buyer that's the
problem.


Exactly. I chose not to go the gray route with the D3, despite quite
large savings being possible. But I'll certainly do it on less expensive
items.

I find one of the most irritating US/UK problems is with a piece of
software called Mathematica.

http://www.wolfram.com/products/mathematica/index.html

A windows version of that in the UK is £2035 + taxes. Ignoring taxes,
that would be $4070 in the USA. But the US price is $2495. So those in
the US, if they bought it in the UK, would have to pay an extra $1575.
That is one hell of a premium!

It is a piece of software, which can be delivered electronically. In the
event of support being needed one goes to the company in the USA. It
really is hard to see how they justify such a large difference in price.

But they get you as the product is not licensed for use outside the
country where it is bought for. Software is clearly different from
hardware, as they can restrict you via a license, which makes it illegal
to use it. I doubt Nikon could license a camera for use only in one country!

Please use an appropriate newsgroup for postings on digital cameras. One
of the following groups would be a good place for such postings:

rec.photo.equipment.digital
rec.photo.equipment.digital.point+shoot
rec.photo.equipment.digital.rangefinder
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr-system

nope.

Are you a cop ?

On 8/16/2008 3:13 PM Maurice Blanchard spake thus:

Please use an appropriate newsgroup for postings on digital cameras. One
of the following groups would be a good place for such postings:

rec.photo.equipment.digital
rec.photo.equipment.digital.point+shoot
rec.photo.equipment.digital.rangefinder
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr-system

nope.

Why not? It's a total no-brainer.

Are you a cop ?

Nope.


--
"In 1964 Barry Goldwater declared: 'Elect me president, and I
will bomb the cities of Vietnam, defoliate the jungles, herd the
population into concentration camps and turn the country into a
wasteland.' But Lyndon Johnson said: 'No! No! No! Don't you dare do
that. Let ME do it.'"

- Characterization (paraphrased) of the 1964 Goldwater/Johnson
presidential race by Professor Irwin Corey, "The World's Foremost
Authority".

David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 8/16/2008 3:13 PM Maurice Blanchard spake thus:

Please use an appropriate newsgroup for postings on digital cameras. One
of the following groups would be a good place for such postings:

rec.photo.equipment.digital
rec.photo.equipment.digital.point+shoot
rec.photo.equipment.digital.rangefinder
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr-system

nope.

Why not? It's a total no-brainer.

Are you a cop ?

Nope.


Stop x-posting, fascist pig!

--
lsmft

tony cooper wrote:
On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 15:54:50 +0100, Dave wrote:

tony cooper wrote:

It's more likely to be because Nikon USA discourages the purchase of
"gray market" Nikons that don't come with manuals or don't come with
manuals in English.



A far more effective way to stop these 'gray imports' would be to sell
the products for the same price in each country.

I don't see how either Nikon or Nikon USA can control the retail
pricing of their products.

Pricing is different by country. An online friend happens to also be a
Nikon distributor in South Africa showed me a price list from his
supplier, his wholesale prices were a lot more than US retail.

In the US, sales are through distributors
(camera stores, retail outlets, etc). "Gray market" Nikons are also
available through distributors - and sometimes the same distributors
that sell the Nikon USA products - but don't have the same warranty
features.
The only reason I did not get my D3 from outside the UK was that is was
more money than I was willing to risk. But for a £500-£1000 lens I would
not think twice about it if the savings were sufficiently large.

I don't know how the market works in the UK, but I have noticed that
many UK residents say they pay more for the same basic model than do
the US buyers. I would think, though, that this is the retail
structure and not the Nikon pricing structure. I don't know for sure,
though.




--
Paul Furman
www.edgehill.net
www.baynatives.com

all google groups messages filtered due to spam

On 8/16/2008 6:21 PM John McWilliams spake thus:

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 8/16/2008 3:13 PM Maurice Blanchard spake thus:

Please use an appropriate newsgroup for postings on digital cameras. One
of the following groups would be a good place for such postings:

rec.photo.equipment.digital
rec.photo.equipment.digital.point+shoot
rec.photo.equipment.digital.rangefinder
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr
rec.photo.equipment.digital.slr-system

nope.

Why not? It's a total no-brainer.

Are you a cop ?

Nope.

Stop x-posting, fascist pig!

"Fascist pig"? Going a bit overboard there, aren't we?


--
"In 1964 Barry Goldwater declared: 'Elect me president, and I
will bomb the cities of Vietnam, defoliate the jungles, herd the
population into concentration camps and turn the country into a
wasteland.' But Lyndon Johnson said: 'No! No! No! Don't you dare do
that. Let ME do it.'"

- Characterization (paraphrased) of the 1964 Goldwater/Johnson
presidential race by Professor Irwin Corey, "The World's Foremost
Authority".

In message , tony cooper
writes
On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:23:15 +0100, Chris H
wrote:

Does the US have a problem with gray imports?

Depends on what you call "a problem". One of the major camera stores
in the US (B&H Camera) sells Nikons imported through Nikon USA and
gray market cameras that bypass Nikon USA.

I can see why Nikon US would get upset about that.

The store is very up-front
about it and tells you if the Nikon item you are ordering is gray
market or through Nikon USA. The pricing is better on the gray market
Nikon items.
Nikon USA will not service or perform warranty work on the gray market
cameras. B&H, though, offers a limited in-store warranty. See:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/GreyMarketStatic.jsp

That sounds reasonable. I can see what the problem is.

Where it becomes a problem is with less honest sellers who offer gray
market items without informing the customer. The customer isn't aware
that they purchased a gray market item until they need service. These
sellers don't provide service.

And of course the customers will then go to Nikon US...

It's like most other things: an informed buyer may decide that the
savings offset the risk. It's not informing the buyer that's the
problem.

I agree.

What happens if I move to the USA. I have several Nikon Cameras, bought
in the UK though Official Nikon UK channels and registered with Nikon.
Can I get Nikon US to service/support them?

Would it work the other way... if you moved to the UK with your Nikons
purchased though official Nikon US channels?



--
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills Staffs England /\/\/\/\/
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