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#31
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
On Wed, 25 Mar 2015 10:10:11 +1300, Eric Stevens
wrote: On Tue, 24 Mar 2015 16:50:46 GMT, "MC" wrote: Savageduck wrote: Most importantly, did you have the printer handle color management in both, or did you have "Photoshop Manages Colors" + appropriate icc profile, and "Other" with an icc profile selected in LR? ...or did you have different color management in PS and LR? This is indeed the crucial question, the answer of which will more than probably lead to the reason behind the reason why there are two differing outputs. The printer will only print the data it is told to print. If two differing profiles are used from two different applications there is no guarantee of identical prints. Same profile used in all cases. Epson's 'Pro38 PGPP' The easiest option when using two applications, regardless which you use for your editing, is to stick to one for tweaking output and actual printing. There are times when one feels thick: when you learn something which is probably known by most other people. In the process of trying to answer this question about the differences between PS and LR when printing it was forcibly brought home to me that an image suitable for viewing on screen is probably not at all suitable for printing: and vice versa. I have produced several hundred images suitable for viewing on screen only to belatedly realise that most of them exceed the colour gamut of my choice of printer and paper. Duh! One lives and learns. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#32
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Wed, 25 Mar 2015 10:10:11 +1300, Eric Stevens wrote: On Tue, 24 Mar 2015 16:50:46 GMT, "MC" wrote: Savageduck wrote: Most importantly, did you have the printer handle color management in both, or did you have "Photoshop Manages Colors" + appropriate icc profile, and "Other" with an icc profile selected in LR? ...or did you have different color management in PS and LR? This is indeed the crucial question, the answer of which will more than probably lead to the reason behind the reason why there are two differing outputs. The printer will only print the data it is told to print. If two differing profiles are used from two different applications there is no guarantee of identical prints. Same profile used in all cases. Epson's 'Pro38 PGPP' The easiest option when using two applications, regardless which you use for your editing, is to stick to one for tweaking output and actual printing. There are times when one feels thick: when you learn something which is probably known by most other people. In the process of trying to answer this question about the differences between PS and LR when printing it was forcibly brought home to me that an image suitable for viewing on screen is probably not at all suitable for printing: and vice versa. I have produced several hundred images suitable for viewing on screen only to belatedly realise that most of them exceed the colour gamut of my choice of printer and paper. Duh! One lives and learns. Exactly why all the fussing folks do with colorspace is usually a total waste. For that matter, most of the efforts that photographers make with White Balance is also a total waste for the exact same reasons. When they get done virtually always there are just one or two things done with the image: 1) print it, or 2) let random people view it on random computers. In the first case the color gamut is limited to what the printer can produce and editing with a greater gamut is wasted effort. In the second case the gamut might be slightly higher, but the average random computer on the Internet isn't even close. If you print... use sRGB and calibrate the monitor at a brightness, gamma and color temperature that is as close as possible to the specific printer. If you post to the web, use sRGB and give it no thought because nobody will see exactly what you see. Only if you do graphic arts production and must be able to match a similar image printed by someone else, then exact colors do actually make a difference and the fuss with colorspace is significant. But very few photographers do that kind of production work. An example is magazine layout where a yellow logo has to be exactly the same yellow on opposing pages. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://www.apaflo.com/ Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
#33
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
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#34
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
In article , Floyd L. Davidson
wrote: If you print... use sRGB and calibrate the monitor at a brightness, gamma and color temperature that is as close as possible to the specific printer. bad advice. the display and printer should be calibrated separately and independently. also, the difference between using srgb and a wider space is very noticeable in prints. andrew rodney has an in depth video explaining it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLlr7wpAZKs This three part, 32 minute video covers why a wide gamut RGB working space like ProPhoto RGB can produce superior quality output to print. Part 1 discusses how the supplied Gamut Test File was created and shows two prints output to an Epson 3880 using ProPhoto RGB and sRGB, how the deficiencies of sRGB gamut affects final output quality. Part 1 discusses what to look for on your own prints in terms of better color output. It also covers Photoshopıs Assign Profile command and how wide gamut spaces mishandled produce dull or over saturated colors due to user error. Part 2 goes into detail about how to print two versions of the properly converted Gamut Test File file in Photoshop using Photoshopıs Print command to correctly setup the test files for output. It covers the Convert to Profile command for preparing test files for output to a lab. Part 3 goes into color theory and illustrates why a wide gamut space produces not only move vibrant and saturated color but detail and color separation compared to a small gamut working space like sRGB. If you post to the web, use sRGB and give it no thought because nobody will see exactly what you see. in general that's true, but there are many people with a colour managed workflow who *can* see what you see, and often more than srgb. Only if you do graphic arts production and must be able to match a similar image printed by someone else, then exact colors do actually make a difference and the fuss with colorspace is significant. But very few photographers do that kind of production work. An example is magazine layout where a yellow logo has to be exactly the same yellow on opposing pages. that's entirely different. |
#35
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
nospam wrote:
In article , Floyd L. Davidson wrote: If you print... use sRGB and calibrate the monitor at a brightness, gamma and color temperature that is as close as possible to the specific printer. bad advice. Advice that if followed will produce the desired results without making it into an overly complex process. The advice you promote works wonders for those with a vested interest in the complexity of the process. No complexity means no market for their products... the display and printer should be calibrated separately and independently. also, the difference between using srgb and a wider space is very noticeable in prints. andrew rodney has an in depth video explaining it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLlr7wpAZKs This three part, 32 minute video covers why a wide gamut RGB working space like ProPhoto RGB can produce superior quality output to print. Part 1 discusses how the supplied Gamut Test File was created and shows two prints output to an Epson 3880 using ProPhoto RGB and sRGB, how the deficiencies of sRGB gamut affects final output quality. Part 1 discusses what to look for on your own prints in terms of better color output. It also covers Photoshopıs Assign Profile command and how wide gamut spaces mishandled produce dull or over saturated colors due to user error. Part 2 goes into detail about how to print two versions of the properly converted Gamut Test File file in Photoshop using Photoshopıs Print command to correctly setup the test files for output. It covers the Convert to Profile command for preparing test files for output to a lab. Part 3 goes into color theory and illustrates why a wide gamut space produces not only move vibrant and saturated color but detail and color separation compared to a small gamut working space like sRGB. If you post to the web, use sRGB and give it no thought because nobody will see exactly what you see. in general that's true, but there are many people with a colour managed workflow who *can* see what you see, and often more than srgb. Only if you do graphic arts production and must be able to match a similar image printed by someone else, then exact colors do actually make a difference and the fuss with colorspace is significant. But very few photographers do that kind of production work. An example is magazine layout where a yellow logo has to be exactly the same yellow on opposing pages. that's entirely different. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://www.apaflo.com/ Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
#36
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
In article , Floyd L. Davidson
wrote: If you print... use sRGB and calibrate the monitor at a brightness, gamma and color temperature that is as close as possible to the specific printer. bad advice. Advice that if followed will produce the desired results without making it into an overly complex process. only if the desired results are substandard. The advice you promote works wonders for those with a vested interest in the complexity of the process. No complexity means no market for their products... nonsense. not only is he not selling a product, but there is nothing complex about working in a wider gamut or better yet, choosing software that uses a wider gamut internally and not worrying about it. the display and printer should be calibrated separately and independently. also, the difference between using srgb and a wider space is very noticeable in prints. andrew rodney has an in depth video explaining it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLlr7wpAZKs This three part, 32 minute video covers why a wide gamut RGB working space like ProPhoto RGB can produce superior quality output to print. Part 1 discusses how the supplied Gamut Test File was created and shows two prints output to an Epson 3880 using ProPhoto RGB and sRGB, how the deficiencies of sRGB gamut affects final output quality. Part 1 discusses what to look for on your own prints in terms of better color output. It also covers Photoshopıs Assign Profile command and how wide gamut spaces mishandled produce dull or over saturated colors due to user error. Part 2 goes into detail about how to print two versions of the properly converted Gamut Test File file in Photoshop using Photoshopıs Print command to correctly setup the test files for output. It covers the Convert to Profile command for preparing test files for output to a lab. Part 3 goes into color theory and illustrates why a wide gamut space produces not only move vibrant and saturated color but detail and color separation compared to a small gamut working space like sRGB. If you post to the web, use sRGB and give it no thought because nobody will see exactly what you see. in general that's true, but there are many people with a colour managed workflow who *can* see what you see, and often more than srgb. Only if you do graphic arts production and must be able to match a similar image printed by someone else, then exact colors do actually make a difference and the fuss with colorspace is significant. But very few photographers do that kind of production work. An example is magazine layout where a yellow logo has to be exactly the same yellow on opposing pages. that's entirely different. |
#37
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
nospam wrote:
In article , Floyd L. Davidson wrote: If you print... use sRGB and calibrate the monitor at a brightness, gamma and color temperature that is as close as possible to the specific printer. bad advice. Advice that if followed will produce the desired results without making it into an overly complex process. only if the desired results are substandard. Have you ever done any commercial grade printing? The advice you promote works wonders for those with a vested interest in the complexity of the process. No complexity means no market for their products... nonsense. not only is he not selling a product, but there is nothing complex about working in a wider gamut or better yet, choosing software that uses a wider gamut internally and not worrying about it. the display and printer should be calibrated separately and independently. also, the difference between using srgb and a wider space is very noticeable in prints. andrew rodney has an in depth video explaining it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLlr7wpAZKs This three part, 32 minute video covers why a wide gamut RGB working space like ProPhoto RGB can produce superior quality output to print. Part 1 discusses how the supplied Gamut Test File was created and shows two prints output to an Epson 3880 using ProPhoto RGB and sRGB, how the deficiencies of sRGB gamut affects final output quality. Part 1 discusses what to look for on your own prints in terms of better color output. It also covers Photoshopıs Assign Profile command and how wide gamut spaces mishandled produce dull or over saturated colors due to user error. Part 2 goes into detail about how to print two versions of the properly converted Gamut Test File file in Photoshop using Photoshopıs Print command to correctly setup the test files for output. It covers the Convert to Profile command for preparing test files for output to a lab. Part 3 goes into color theory and illustrates why a wide gamut space produces not only move vibrant and saturated color but detail and color separation compared to a small gamut working space like sRGB. If you post to the web, use sRGB and give it no thought because nobody will see exactly what you see. in general that's true, but there are many people with a colour managed workflow who *can* see what you see, and often more than srgb. Only if you do graphic arts production and must be able to match a similar image printed by someone else, then exact colors do actually make a difference and the fuss with colorspace is significant. But very few photographers do that kind of production work. An example is magazine layout where a yellow logo has to be exactly the same yellow on opposing pages. that's entirely different. -- Floyd L. Davidson http://www.apaflo.com/ Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) |
#38
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
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#39
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
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#40
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Lightroom vs Photoshop when printing.
In article , Floyd L. Davidson
wrote: If you print... use sRGB and calibrate the monitor at a brightness, gamma and color temperature that is as close as possible to the specific printer. bad advice. Advice that if followed will produce the desired results without making it into an overly complex process. only if the desired results are substandard. Have you ever done any commercial grade printing? this isn't about me nor does it have anything to do with commercial grade printing, as the difference can be seen on consumer printers. you're moving the goalposts, as usual. nevertheless, andrew rodney meets your silly and irrelevant qualifications and provides clear proof that what you say is wrong. did you even watch the video? The advice you promote works wonders for those with a vested interest in the complexity of the process. No complexity means no market for their products... nonsense. not only is he not selling a product, but there is nothing complex about working in a wider gamut or better yet, choosing software that uses a wider gamut internally and not worrying about it. the display and printer should be calibrated separately and independently. also, the difference between using srgb and a wider space is very noticeable in prints. andrew rodney has an in depth video explaining it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLlr7wpAZKs This three part, 32 minute video covers why a wide gamut RGB working space like ProPhoto RGB can produce superior quality output to print. Part 1 discusses how the supplied Gamut Test File was created and shows two prints output to an Epson 3880 using ProPhoto RGB and sRGB, how the deficiencies of sRGB gamut affects final output quality. Part 1 discusses what to look for on your own prints in terms of better color output. It also covers Photoshopıs Assign Profile command and how wide gamut spaces mishandled produce dull or over saturated colors due to user error. Part 2 goes into detail about how to print two versions of the properly converted Gamut Test File file in Photoshop using Photoshopıs Print command to correctly setup the test files for output. It covers the Convert to Profile command for preparing test files for output to a lab. Part 3 goes into color theory and illustrates why a wide gamut space produces not only move vibrant and saturated color but detail and color separation compared to a small gamut working space like sRGB. If you post to the web, use sRGB and give it no thought because nobody will see exactly what you see. in general that's true, but there are many people with a colour managed workflow who *can* see what you see, and often more than srgb. Only if you do graphic arts production and must be able to match a similar image printed by someone else, then exact colors do actually make a difference and the fuss with colorspace is significant. But very few photographers do that kind of production work. An example is magazine layout where a yellow logo has to be exactly the same yellow on opposing pages. that's entirely different. |
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