Dpreview loses its nerve, scores 5DIII same as D800!!!

In article , Bruce
wrote:

I'm surprised that you, of all people, omitted to mention DPReview's
long-standing strong bias towards Canon, which dates from long before
Amazon bought DPReview.

Utter nonsense. They have given Nikon gear glowing reviews pretty
consistently since Nikon upgraded their sensors. I'd love to see your
proof of this claim.

It was discussed many, many times on Usenet's photo newsgroups.

A search on Google Groups will take only a few minutes of your time
and provide all the "proof" that any intelligent person would need.

lots of things are discussed on usenet. that's not proof of anything.

i posted two links where dpreview said the nikon d3 and d3x were the
best they've ever tested, which completely blows your claim to bits.

the fact is that dpreview has been accused of bias for every single
manufacturer at one time or another.

On 25/05/2012 11:22 PM, Bruce wrote:
wrote:
On 25/05/2012 10:21 PM, Bruce wrote:
wrote:
On May 24, 6:35 pm, wrote:
On Thu, 24 May 2012 06:48:05 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On May 23, 8:37 am, wrote:
On Tue, 22 May 2012 20:03:30 -0500, wrote:
They have to be kidding.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/cano...5d-mark-iii/29

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikon-d800-d800e/30

Why? Because each cam has it's own strengths and weaknesses, and that
they see a balance? I think they came to the corect conclusion.

By most measures the D800/E is the better camera. It should have won.

If you base the value of the camera on the sensor alone, yes. But when
you throw in the AF, metering, speed, and handling, it's a tossup. If
you read the D800 review they make no bones about it: you need to take
great care when shooting in order to get the most out of that
beautiful sensor.


I'm hoping the buyers of such a camera won't be sloppy when shooting
with it. Precision (as defined here by mp's) means you need to
operate the thing within a tight set of parameters. Whereas the Canon
can be used more cavalierly as its sensor is not nearly as fine. But
in most cases, when you shoot with it correctly, it will produce
better results than the Canon. That tips the balance in its favour
and that is why it is the better camera.


I'm surprised that you, of all people, omitted to mention DPReview's
long-standing strong bias towards Canon, which dates from long before
Amazon bought DPReview.

DPReview's verdicts on Nikon equipment have always been lukewarm,
whereas they get very excited indeed about Canon products. Many
people believed that DPReview was funded by Canon or somehow in
Canon's pocket, although I personally doubt that. It is more likely
that Phil Askey is a Canon fanboi.

We will never know, but the pro-Canon bias seems to have remained.


I was surprised when I read the reviews and could not understand how
they concluded the results.

There were so many things which did not compare.


'Twas ever thus.

A whole generation of photographers have grown to believe that
DPReview is some kind of authoritative resource when it comes to
photographic equipment. Articles such as this should remind them that
DPReview is not a site that people can trust.

hence is why I asked here for users of the Nikon 70-300 lens, the replys
have been what I'm after - users reviews not glossy reviews.

Bruce wrote:

A whole generation of photographers have grown to believe that
DPReview is some kind of authoritative resource when it comes to
photographic equipment. Articles such as this should remind them
that DPReview is not a site that people can trust.

If you go to the conclusion
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/cano...5d-mark-iii/29 and compare
D800 and EOS 5D, you'll see it's a wash in 5 categories, Nikon is
better in 5 categories, and Canon is better in one ("performance",
presumably referring to FPS).

I agree that the 82% rating is rather silly when you compare the
results, but the test itself looks fair.

Andrew.

On Fri, 25 May 2012 20:53:08 +0100, Bruce
wrote:

Bowser wrote:

See above. Usenet discussion frequency means nothing.


There's a guy called Bowser who posts here often but has never said
anything useful. So I suppose you must be right.

Well, I am right about one thing: you have nothing to support your
bull****.

On Fri, 25 May 2012 18:31:15 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Bruce
wrote:

I'm surprised that you, of all people, omitted to mention DPReview's
long-standing strong bias towards Canon, which dates from long before
Amazon bought DPReview.

Utter nonsense. They have given Nikon gear glowing reviews pretty
consistently since Nikon upgraded their sensors. I'd love to see your
proof of this claim.

It was discussed many, many times on Usenet's photo newsgroups.

A search on Google Groups will take only a few minutes of your time
and provide all the "proof" that any intelligent person would need.

lots of things are discussed on usenet. that's not proof of anything.

i posted two links where dpreview said the nikon d3 and d3x were the
best they've ever tested, which completely blows your claim to bits.

the fact is that dpreview has been accused of bias for every single
manufacturer at one time or another.

I asked Bruce to provide me a link to just one instance where a Nikon
was treated unfairly by DP Review. He can't, so he did the usual Bruce
thing and resorted to insults. The last vestage of a weak mind.

On Sun, 27 May 2012 00:25:57 +0100, Bruce
wrote:

Bowser wrote:

On Fri, 25 May 2012 20:53:08 +0100, Bruce
wrote:

Bowser wrote:

See above. Usenet discussion frequency means nothing.


There's a guy called Bowser who posts here often but has never said
anything useful. So I suppose you must be right.

Well, I am right about one thing: you have nothing to support your
bull****.


There is plenty of evidence to support my statements. I told you
where to find it and how, and pointed out that it would take you only
a few minutes to find it. But you were too lazy to make even that
tiny amount of effort. Just like you were too lazy to make a tiny
amount of effort when you were "running" the SI, or hastening its
death, to be more precise.

A leopard doesn't change its spots, and one thing that will forever be
true in your case is that you will never make even a tiny amount of
effort when the option of doing absolutely nothing is available.

Correct, a leopard can't change it's spots, nor can you change your
line of BS. I've never seen a review on DP Review biased against
Nikon, and you claim a bias. Searching usenet is useless since
searches are likely to turn up only opinion totally devoid of facts,
like your recent posts about Nikon and DP Review. You have NO facts to
support your claim. Why not just admit it rather than blaming someone
else?

On Fri, 25 May 2012 22:28:24 +1000, Rob wrote:
: On 25/05/2012 10:21 PM, Bruce wrote:
: wrote:
: On May 24, 6:35 pm, wrote:
: On Thu, 24 May 2012 06:48:05 -0700 (PDT),
: wrote:
:
: On May 23, 8:37 am, wrote:
: On Tue, 22 May 2012 20:03:30 -0500, wrote:
: They have to be kidding.
:
: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/cano...5d-mark-iii/29
:
: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikon-d800-d800e/30
:
: Why? Because each cam has it's own strengths and weaknesses, and that
: they see a balance? I think they came to the corect conclusion.
:
: By most measures the D800/E is the better camera. It should have won.
:
: If you base the value of the camera on the sensor alone, yes. But when
: you throw in the AF, metering, speed, and handling, it's a tossup. If
: you read the D800 review they make no bones about it: you need to take
: great care when shooting in order to get the most out of that
: beautiful sensor.
:
:
: I'm hoping the buyers of such a camera won't be sloppy when shooting
: with it. Precision (as defined here by mp's) means you need to
: operate the thing within a tight set of parameters. Whereas the Canon
: can be used more cavalierly as its sensor is not nearly as fine. But
: in most cases, when you shoot with it correctly, it will produce
: better results than the Canon. That tips the balance in its favour
: and that is why it is the better camera.
:
:
: I'm surprised that you, of all people, omitted to mention DPReview's
: long-standing strong bias towards Canon, which dates from long before
: Amazon bought DPReview.
:
: DPReview's verdicts on Nikon equipment have always been lukewarm,
: whereas they get very excited indeed about Canon products. Many
: people believed that DPReview was funded by Canon or somehow in
: Canon's pocket, although I personally doubt that. It is more likely
: that Phil Askey is a Canon fanboi.
:
: We will never know, but the pro-Canon bias seems to have remained.
:
:
: I was surprised when I read the reviews and could not understand how
: they concluded the results.
:
: There were so many things which did not compare.

I haven't seen anyone yet mention Nikon's vastly superior implementation of
auto-ISO, one of the features that can ease the burden of "operating within a
tight set of parameters". Does that difference carry over in the D800 vs the
5D3?

BTW, if the 5D3 is so much less finicky than the D800, why does Canon think it
needs a $2300 walking-around lens?

Bob

Bruce wrote:
Bowser wrote:
On Fri, 25 May 2012 13:21:13 +0100, Bruce
wrote:
I'm surprised that you, of all people, omitted to mention DPReview's
long-standing strong bias towards Canon, which dates from long before
Amazon bought DPReview.

Utter nonsense. They have given Nikon gear glowing reviews pretty
consistently since Nikon upgraded their sensors. I'd love to see your
proof of this claim.

It was discussed many, many times on Usenet's photo newsgroups.

So are alien sightings and abductions on the relevant Usenet
groups. So are all kinds of conspiracy theories in relevant
and non-relevant Usenet groups.

A search on Google Groups will take only a few minutes of your time
and provide all the "proof" that any intelligent person would need.

Same wit alien sightings, alien abductions and conspiracy theories.

Whether it is enough for you is of course moot. ;-)

What would you consider proof that DPreview is not biassed as
you claim? Nothing? Then you're a fanatic.

-Wolfgang

On Sun, 27 May 2012 17:19:42 +0100, Bruce wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
:
: BTW, if the 5D3 is so much less finicky than the D800, why does Canon think it
: needs a $2300 walking-around lens?
:
:
: Because until a few months ago, everyone (apparently including Canon)
: expected the 5D III or another new Canon DSLR to have the 34.5 MP
: sensor that had been extensively tested around the world. But it
: never appeared. No-one knows why, because it doesn't appear to have
: been a bad sensor.
:
: Perhaps, when it because clear just how good the Sony sensor in the
: D800 was going to be, Canon pulled theirs to give themselves time to
: develop something better that could compete? I don't know, that's
: just speculation, but it is the only logical explanation that I can
: think of.
:
: So, assuming that by "the $2300 walk-around lens" you mean the EF
: 24-70mm f/2.8L II, it is still likely that there will soon be a Canon
: sensor that can make use of its superior optics. I feel sure that the
: Canon DSLR range will not be limited to 22 MP for very long.
:
: The 7D II is on the way soon, probably for Photokina 2012.

It needs two things for su
- The 61-point AF system, which it certainly won't get, and
- A more versatile auto-ISO, which it damn well ought to get. (Isn't that just
a firmware enhancement? If they leave out some of the more obscure languages
in order to cram it in, I won't object.)

I suppose they may give it more megapixels (but where does that leave the
5D3?), although a case can be made that 18 is enough for that sensor size.

What else? It's a little hard to know. Given the constraints of the smaller
sensor, there's not a lot that the 7D lacks. Better high-ISO performance? I
suppose that's always nice to have.

Don't make it heavier. Two of those doggies around one's neck are plenty (say
I from experience).

But why do I care? I already have two 7D's and can't afford a 5D3. It will be
a cold day in Hell before I buy another camera, unless my wife relents on the
weight issue and decides she wants a 7D.

Bob

Bruce wrote:
Bowser wrote:

Correct, a leopard can't change it's spots, nor can you change your
line of BS. I've never seen a review on DP Review biased against
Nikon, and you claim a bias.

You should read more carefully before replying. I know comprehension
isn't your strong point, as you prefer to lash out against what you
think what people are saying instead of what they actually write.

I reported that many people saw a pro-Canon bias on DPReview which was
widely discussed including on Usenet.

Reality: out of a couple Billion people, a very few claim a
bias, and vent lots of hot air in Usenet. If that's proof,
Elvis is alife.

for several years. I had, and still have, a very low opinion of Phil
Askey's ability and knowledge and that deterred me from taking any
interest in what he wrote.

So you have a KNOWN, PROVEN anti-DPreview and anti-Phil-Askey
bias. And you're the one who has a neutral view?

Nikon gear again. By then, DPReview was firmly under Amazon's control
in any case.

So Amazon now has a pro-Canon bias, too? What next? The aliens
who control the government (Proof that that is absolutely true:
it's widely discussed on Usenet) also have a pro-Canon bias
and excert their powers on Amazon?

That's not something an intelligent person would do, but

.... you don't have any personal experience with intelligent
persons, right?

-Wolfgang