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Questions about macro lenses



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 28th 04, 07:22 AM
Bob
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses


Lots of times when I try to take a picture I can't focus because I'm too close.
So I guess I need a macro lens, however, does macro mean that I can focus from
just about every position? Or am I limited to some special close range?

Also, in order to decide what I actually want in mm, I was thinking of
pretending to take the pictures I want but can't because of focusing problem but
then just pretend that I can focus at this framed shot, and read what I picked
on a zoom lens.

For example, I would frame the shot I want, notice I can't focus, then look at
the zoom setting and lets say it reads 100mm, then I'll know I should get a
100mm macro lens.

Is this a valid approach?

I noticed once that I couldn't get close enough (60" min) to an object with a
300mm lens so I put an 18mm lens to focus at 8" but the image was about the same
size! I need to get closer with either lens. From my limited knowledge of macros
I think I need 100mm or higher...

I plan on taking pictures of objects from about 2" square up to maybe 20". I use
a Nikon D70. Any suggestions? I was looking at a Sigma 105 F2.8 but haven't seen
much else.

Is there such a thing as a macro (Micro) zoom? Also I don't want to spend
$1000!!

Thanks for any input!

  #2  
Old June 28th 04, 07:40 AM
Charles
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Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses

On Mon, 28 Jun 2004 02:22:20 -0400, Bob wrote:


Lots of times when I try to take a picture I can't focus because I'm too close.
So I guess I need a macro lens, however, does macro mean that I can focus from
just about every position? Or am I limited to some special close range?

Also, in order to decide what I actually want in mm, I was thinking of
pretending to take the pictures I want but can't because of focusing problem but
then just pretend that I can focus at this framed shot, and read what I picked
on a zoom lens.

For example, I would frame the shot I want, notice I can't focus, then look at
the zoom setting and lets say it reads 100mm, then I'll know I should get a
100mm macro lens.

Is this a valid approach?

I noticed once that I couldn't get close enough (60" min) to an object with a
300mm lens so I put an 18mm lens to focus at 8" but the image was about the same
size! I need to get closer with either lens. From my limited knowledge of macros
I think I need 100mm or higher...

I plan on taking pictures of objects from about 2" square up to maybe 20". I use
a Nikon D70. Any suggestions? I was looking at a Sigma 105 F2.8 but haven't seen
much else.

Is there such a thing as a macro (Micro) zoom? Also I don't want to spend
$1000!!

Thanks for any input!



The cheapest way into what you want to do is to use "plus diopter"
add on lenses, call it a close-up filter. This will screw onto the
regular lens when you want to do close-up work. may need more that
one, they can be added together as needed.

Extension tubes can let you focus closer as well. the ultimate (in my
estimation) would be a specialized macro lens, or micro lens in Nikon
terminology. Yes, there are macro zoom lenses, and also fixed focal
length lenses.
--

- Charles
-
-does not play well with others
  #3  
Old June 28th 04, 10:32 AM
Justin Thyme
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses

Preddy Mode
You need a sigma SD10, it has some magical property that allows it to focus
at any distance irrespective of the lens you put on. In fact you don't even
have to adjust focus, you just point it at the subject and you'll take an
amazing photo. Can't afford lenses? well if you had an SD10 you wouldn't
even need to buy one, you can shoot with the lens off if you want.
/Preddy Mode

In all seriousness, the cheapest way out of it is a by attaching close-up
filters to the front of the lens. Purists will say they reduce image
quality, but I've never really had a concern. Light is your biggest concern
with extreme close-ups - you'll often find the camera will tend to shade the
subject, so you may need to look at some sort of side-lighting.
When taking close-ups, make sure you have a sturdy camera mount, and if
feasible you are best to use a small aperture with a slow shutter to
maximize depth of field, and preferably some sort of remote release.
Sometimes, depending on the lens in use, your depth of field will only be of
the order of a couple of millimetres, so small apertures become pretty
essential.

"Bob" wrote in message
...

Lots of times when I try to take a picture I can't focus because I'm too

close.
So I guess I need a macro lens, however, does macro mean that I can focus

from
just about every position? Or am I limited to some special close range?

Also, in order to decide what I actually want in mm, I was thinking of
pretending to take the pictures I want but can't because of focusing

problem but
then just pretend that I can focus at this framed shot, and read what I

picked
on a zoom lens.

For example, I would frame the shot I want, notice I can't focus, then

look at
the zoom setting and lets say it reads 100mm, then I'll know I should get

a
100mm macro lens.

Is this a valid approach?

I noticed once that I couldn't get close enough (60" min) to an object

with a
300mm lens so I put an 18mm lens to focus at 8" but the image was about

the same
size! I need to get closer with either lens. From my limited knowledge of

macros
I think I need 100mm or higher...

I plan on taking pictures of objects from about 2" square up to maybe 20".

I use
a Nikon D70. Any suggestions? I was looking at a Sigma 105 F2.8 but

haven't seen
much else.

Is there such a thing as a macro (Micro) zoom? Also I don't want to spend
$1000!!

Thanks for any input!



  #4  
Old June 28th 04, 02:36 PM
Don Stauffer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses

The term "macro lens" is used pretty loosely in photography. In general
what most zoom lens mfgs mean is that it is a lens that can focus from
infinity down to some quite close distance, closer than normal lenses.
So a decent one should do what you want.

You seem to be confusing focal length with object distance (distance
from effective center of lens to object you are shooting). You need to
pick up a book on photography that gives a little primer on lenses.

It is easy to measure the object distance. Merely set up a shot (btw, a
tripod is essential for macro shots), and measure with a ruler the
distance from the front of your lens to the midpoint of the object.
That will be close enough to shop for a macro lens that has the close
focus distance you need.

While technically the term macro means your image on negative is same
size as object size (1:1 magnification), the normal meaning today is
'close'. Most macro lenses will focus to six inches or even a bit
closer.

You can ALSO use supplemental closeup lenses, that screw on the front of
your lens just like a filter. These come in sets, and can be combined.
With most sets, you can end up focusing on closer objects than with most
macro lenses.

Bob wrote:

Lots of times when I try to take a picture I can't focus because I'm too close.
So I guess I need a macro lens, however, does macro mean that I can focus from
just about every position? Or am I limited to some special close range?

Also, in order to decide what I actually want in mm, I was thinking of
pretending to take the pictures I want but can't because of focusing problem but
then just pretend that I can focus at this framed shot, and read what I picked
on a zoom lens.

For example, I would frame the shot I want, notice I can't focus, then look at
the zoom setting and lets say it reads 100mm, then I'll know I should get a
100mm macro lens.

Is this a valid approach?

I noticed once that I couldn't get close enough (60" min) to an object with a
300mm lens so I put an 18mm lens to focus at 8" but the image was about the same
size! I need to get closer with either lens. From my limited knowledge of macros
I think I need 100mm or higher...

I plan on taking pictures of objects from about 2" square up to maybe 20". I use
a Nikon D70. Any suggestions? I was looking at a Sigma 105 F2.8 but haven't seen
much else.

Is there such a thing as a macro (Micro) zoom? Also I don't want to spend
$1000!!

Thanks for any input!


--
Don Stauffer in Minnesota

webpage-
http://www.usfamily.net/web/stauffer
  #5  
Old June 28th 04, 06:58 PM
Chieh Cheng
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses

Bob wrote in message . ..
So I guess I need a macro lens, however, does macro mean that I can focus from
just about every position? Or am I limited to some special close range?


You are still limited to a minimum focus distance. But a macro lens
has a much closer minimum focus distance than regular lens. Say 1"
versus 1'.

For example, I would frame the shot I want, notice I can't focus, then look at
the zoom setting and lets say it reads 100mm, then I'll know I should get a
100mm macro lens. Is this a valid approach?


Yes. That is a good way to go about doing it.

I plan on taking pictures of objects from about 2" square up to maybe 20". I use
a Nikon D70. Any suggestions? I was looking at a Sigma 105 F2.8 but haven't seen
much else.


That is a good lens. That is my only macro lens. It has the capability
to shoot 1:1 magnification. I shoot 95% of my macro shots with it. I
use extension tubes, teleconverters, and close-up lenses in the other
5% of the time. The macro lens and the extension tubes route provides
the best image quality.

Is there such a thing as a macro (Micro) zoom? Also I don't want to spend
$1000!!


Yes. But they are more limited than single focal length macro lenses.
Most of the time the macro zoom lens have the same minimum focus range
as a regular lens. They are macro because they can focus closer than
most other zoom lenses.

Chieh
--
Camera Hacker - http://www.CameraHacker.com/
  #6  
Old June 28th 04, 11:17 PM
David Dyer-Bennet
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses

Bob writes:

Lots of times when I try to take a picture I can't focus because I'm too close.
So I guess I need a macro lens, however, does macro mean that I can focus from
just about every position? Or am I limited to some special close range?


"Macro" generally means magnifications from 1:10 to 1:1 or so (image
one-tenth lifesize on the film (or sensor) to lifesize on the sensor.

All the modern macro lenses I know will focus out to infinity, and
produce good sharp results there. The focus is usually slower than on
more limited lenses -- because there's a larger range of physical
motion.

Also, in order to decide what I actually want in mm, I was thinking
of pretending to take the pictures I want but can't because of
focusing problem but then just pretend that I can focus at this
framed shot, and read what I picked on a zoom lens.

For example, I would frame the shot I want, notice I can't focus,
then look at the zoom setting and lets say it reads 100mm, then I'll
know I should get a 100mm macro lens.

Is this a valid approach?


It's not crazy. It does suggest that a 100mm lens would give you
around the working distance you seem to want. Is your choice of focal
length driven by image size, or by working distance? This test is
valid for working distance, not for image size.

The iamge size changes as you focus, so this isn't a precise method at
all.

I noticed once that I couldn't get close enough (60" min) to an
object with a 300mm lens so I put an 18mm lens to focus at 8" but
the image was about the same size! I need to get closer with either
lens. From my limited knowledge of macros I think I need 100mm or
higher...

I plan on taking pictures of objects from about 2" square up to
maybe 20". I use a Nikon D70. Any suggestions? I was looking at a
Sigma 105 F2.8 but haven't seen much else.


I've found the Sigma 105mm f2.8 macro quite acceptable. Only
specialized macro lens I've owned, but I've also used extension tubes
and bellows on more normal lenses to let them focus closer.

Sounds like you don't need anything close to 1:1 capability. This
argues in favor of a macro zoom or extension tubes in conjunction with
some other lens, rather than a dedicated macro lens (nothing *wrong*
with the macro lens, but the extension tubes are cheaper and the macro
zoom is more flexible).

Is there such a thing as a macro (Micro) zoom? Also I don't want to
spend $1000!!


Some zoom lenses provide extra close focusing, and bill themselves as
"macro". (Nikon uses "micro" for their macro lenses).

Depending on what lenses you already have, the *cheapest* way to get a
little closer is extension tubes. This lets you focus closer, but
*does* prevent you focusing to infinity; so it's inconvenient if you
switch back and forth between close and far and want the same focal
length. The quality you get depends on the quality of the lens you
put in front of the extension tube (extension tubes simply move the
lens further from the film/sensor, and have no optical elements --
hence are relatively cheap compared to lenses). While zooms "work" on
extension tubes, they're more likely to have optical faults that
macro work will show up.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/
RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/
Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/
Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/
  #7  
Old June 29th 04, 01:06 AM
Skip M
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses

"David Dyer-Bennet" wrote in message
...
Bob writes:

Lots of times when I try to take a picture I can't focus because I'm too

close.
So I guess I need a macro lens, however, does macro mean that I can

focus from
just about every position? Or am I limited to some special close range?


"Macro" generally means magnifications from 1:10 to 1:1 or so (image
one-tenth lifesize on the film (or sensor) to lifesize on the sensor.

All the modern macro lenses I know will focus out to infinity, and
produce good sharp results there. The focus is usually slower than on
more limited lenses -- because there's a larger range of physical
motion.

Also, in order to decide what I actually want in mm, I was thinking
of pretending to take the pictures I want but can't because of
focusing problem but then just pretend that I can focus at this
framed shot, and read what I picked on a zoom lens.

For example, I would frame the shot I want, notice I can't focus,
then look at the zoom setting and lets say it reads 100mm, then I'll
know I should get a 100mm macro lens.

Is this a valid approach?


It's not crazy. It does suggest that a 100mm lens would give you
around the working distance you seem to want. Is your choice of focal
length driven by image size, or by working distance? This test is
valid for working distance, not for image size.

The iamge size changes as you focus, so this isn't a precise method at
all.

I noticed once that I couldn't get close enough (60" min) to an
object with a 300mm lens so I put an 18mm lens to focus at 8" but
the image was about the same size! I need to get closer with either
lens. From my limited knowledge of macros I think I need 100mm or
higher...

I plan on taking pictures of objects from about 2" square up to
maybe 20". I use a Nikon D70. Any suggestions? I was looking at a
Sigma 105 F2.8 but haven't seen much else.


I've found the Sigma 105mm f2.8 macro quite acceptable. Only
specialized macro lens I've owned, but I've also used extension tubes
and bellows on more normal lenses to let them focus closer.

Sounds like you don't need anything close to 1:1 capability. This
argues in favor of a macro zoom or extension tubes in conjunction with
some other lens, rather than a dedicated macro lens (nothing *wrong*
with the macro lens, but the extension tubes are cheaper and the macro
zoom is more flexible).

Is there such a thing as a macro (Micro) zoom? Also I don't want to
spend $1000!!


Some zoom lenses provide extra close focusing, and bill themselves as
"macro". (Nikon uses "micro" for their macro lenses).

Depending on what lenses you already have, the *cheapest* way to get a
little closer is extension tubes. This lets you focus closer, but
*does* prevent you focusing to infinity; so it's inconvenient if you
switch back and forth between close and far and want the same focal
length. The quality you get depends on the quality of the lens you
put in front of the extension tube (extension tubes simply move the
lens further from the film/sensor, and have no optical elements --
hence are relatively cheap compared to lenses). While zooms "work" on
extension tubes, they're more likely to have optical faults that
macro work will show up.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/
RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/
Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/

http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/
Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/


BTW, get a macro focusing rail, that will give you the ability to focus
easier than just moving your tripod in and out. And you won't change your
angle of view. Manfrotto makes a good one that's not too expensive.

--
Skip Middleton
http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com


  #8  
Old June 29th 04, 03:02 AM
David Dyer-Bennet
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Questions about macro lenses

"Skip M" writes:

BTW, get a macro focusing rail, that will give you the ability to focus
easier than just moving your tripod in and out. And you won't change your
angle of view. Manfrotto makes a good one that's not too expensive.


That's good advice -- the higher the magnification, the better advice
it is :-). It's actually built in to my Nikon PB-4 bellows, so I
don't have a rail, so I suffer without when using other macro
equipment.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, , http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/
RKBA: http://noguns-nomoney.com/ http://www.dd-b.net/carry/
Pics: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/ http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/
Dragaera/Steven Brust: http://dragaera.info/
 




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