A Photography forum. PhotoBanter.com

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » PhotoBanter.com forum » Digital Photography » Digital Point & Shoot Cameras
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Need to replace my Sony W1



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old January 31st 06, 06:34 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

If you check the Sony H1 forum (in Steve's), there are alot of people who
also have the same 1/30 sec problem. I am very surprised becasue the H1
seems to have a much bigger lens. The most confussing thing is that this
only in the Sony forum. When I check the other forums for other brands,
People don't seem to have this show shutter speed problem.






"Whiskers" wrote in message
...
On 2006-01-31, Tom wrote:


Most of the reviews there seem to be very positive. So we are back to
either the settings you are using, or the camera being faulty. It's up to
you what you decide to do to work out which ) but given the
limitations on user input with that model and the history of some faulty
specimens, I'd be inclined to think that you got one of the 'bad batch'.

If you decide to try a different model, I can report that I've been very
pleased with my Samsung Digimax V700 (which may offer too many manual
modes for comfort, if you want a purely point and shoot operation,
although the auto or programmed modes seem to handle most things pretty
well). I also get some good results with my Minolta Dimage X20, although
that is only 2MP and lacks an optical viewfinder - but that range of models
includes some with a higher specification, and is very much point and
shoot in spirit.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~


  #12  
Old February 1st 06, 05:49 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

On 2006-01-31, Tom wrote:
"Whiskers" wrote in message
...
Most of the reviews there seem to be very positive. So we are back to
either the settings you are using, or the camera being faulty. It's up to
you what you decide to do to work out which ) but given the
limitations on user input with that model and the history of some faulty
specimens, I'd be inclined to think that you got one of the 'bad batch'.


snip

If you check the Sony H1 forum (in Steve's), there are alot of people who
also have the same 1/30 sec problem. I am very surprised becasue the H1
seems to have a much bigger lens. The most confussing thing is that this
only in the Sony forum. When I check the other forums for other brands,
People don't seem to have this show shutter speed problem.


(I know that Outlook Express isn't the world's greatest usenet client, but
it can be made to 'quote' properly - in the way I have modified your post
above - and you can move the 'cursor' to where it makes sense before you
start typing. Thank you for working out how to use 'plain text').

I don't know what you mean by "the Sony H1 forum (in Steve's), there are
alot of people [...]". I have skimmed
http://www.steves-digicams.com/2005_reviews/sony_h1_pg5.html and the
five other reviews linked from the bottom of that page, but no complaints
about the camera using a too-slow shutter speed leaped out at me.

That camera's lens may be physically bulkier than the one on your camera,
but given that it claims to be a 12x zoom and incorporates an optical
'anti-shake' gadget, that's hardly surprising. Its maximum aperture is
f/2.8, exactly the same as on your camera.

If you have taken a dislike to Sony cameras, for whatever reason, then
don't buy another one.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
  #13  
Old February 1st 06, 07:35 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

Hi,

In the Sony forum in the Steves-digicams site, many people have the same
slow shutter speed problem for Sony H1. I am wondering why the other brands
do not have this slow shutter speed problem even they have the same f/2.8.

for instance:
http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...12&forum_id=28



OT:
Why plain text? Are you still living in a cave or something? Men already
landed on the moon... hmmm... almost 50 years ago... and we are going to
land on Mars soon... only if Bush brings back some oil to fuel the mission
of course... hahaha!!!



I don't know what you mean by "the Sony H1 forum (in Steve's), there are
alot of people [...]". I have skimmed
http://www.steves-digicams.com/2005_reviews/sony_h1_pg5.html and the
five other reviews linked from the bottom of that page, but no complaints
about the camera using a too-slow shutter speed leaped out at me.

That camera's lens may be physically bulkier than the one on your camera,
but given that it claims to be a 12x zoom and incorporates an optical
'anti-shake' gadget, that's hardly surprising. Its maximum aperture is
f/2.8, exactly the same as on your camera.

If you have taken a dislike to Sony cameras, for whatever reason, then
don't buy another one.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~



  #14  
Old February 1st 06, 07:50 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default OT: plain text posting (was: Need to replace my Sony W1)

Tom wrote:
OT:
Why plain text? Are you still living in a cave or something? Men
already landed on the moon... hmmm... almost 50 years ago... and we
are going to land on Mars soon... only if Bush brings back some oil
to fuel the mission of course... hahaha!!!


Why? Because it is a request in the charter of this newsgroup:

"When posting on rec.photo.digital.point+shoot, please use standard Usenet
netiquette. Treat other posters with courtesy and follow standard
conventions
when replying to posts. Please trim the posts you reply to, retaining only
the
significant portions in your follow up. Preserve attributions (the bits
that
specify who wrote what in each post) and limit your signature to 4 lines
or
less. To ensure readability, do not use HTML in your posts and limit your
line
lengths to the Usenet standard of 80 characters or less."

David


  #15  
Old February 1st 06, 08:06 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default OT: plain text posting (was: Need to replace my Sony W1)

I see. I always think that people are still living in a cave and using a
1200 bps Modem or something and they Telnet to the newsgroup to read the
posts. But yet... the same people are talking about Digital Camera...
etc...

Yeeeaaa... the good old day in the college typing my homework with Pico in
the Sun station...




"David J Taylor"
wrote in
message k...

Why? Because it is a request in the charter of this newsgroup:



  #16  
Old February 1st 06, 09:01 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

On 2006-02-01, Tom wrote:
On 2006-02-01, Whiskers wrote:


snip
(I know that Outlook Express isn't the world's greatest usenet client, but
it can be made to 'quote' properly - in the way I have modified your post
above - and you can move the 'cursor' to where it makes sense before you
start typing. Thank you for working out how to use 'plain text').

snip

OT:
Why plain text? Are you still living in a cave or something? Men already
landed on the moon... hmmm... almost 50 years ago... and we are going to
land on Mars soon... only if Bush brings back some oil to fuel the mission
of course... hahaha!!!


Usenet is a 'plain text' medium. Plain text is low-bandwidth, economical,
and usable by anyone with usenet or e-mail access. HTML is none of those
things. The invention of the motor-car has not made walking any less
sensible or practical.

for your next task, learn how to insert your comments into the quoted text
where it makes sense, rather than where it doesn't. Or learn to have your
posts go un-answered.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
  #17  
Old February 1st 06, 10:20 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

On 2006-02-01, Tom wrote:

snip

I don't know what you mean by "the Sony H1 forum (in Steve's), there are
alot of people [...]". I have skimmed
http://www.steves-digicams.com/2005_reviews/sony_h1_pg5.html and the
five other reviews linked from the bottom of that page, but no complaints
about the camera using a too-slow shutter speed leaped out at me.


snip

for instance:
http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...12&forum_id=28


snip

OK; those people are discussing the 'camera-shake' warning symbol that
most digital cameras show when their programming indicates that 'camera
shake' is likely. As the respondents suggest there, this is not a fault,
it's a useful warning to the user to take particular care to avoid camera
shake spoiling the picture.

Would you prefer the method used for many years on compact point-and-shoot
cameras using film but with 'auto exposure', where the shutter-button
would be 'locked' if the camera thought there was 'too little light'?
(Those cameras didn't have zoom lenses either). I think there may be some
extremely basic digital cameras with that feature, if you want to shop
around for one.

There are some circumstances where it is inevitable that camera shake
becomes likely; 'zooming in' is one and 'low light' is another. It's a
matter of basic optics and the 'laws' of nature.

That 'wobbly hands' icon does /not/ mean "using 1/30 sec or slower"; when
you 'zoom in' to the full extent of your 3x zoom, camera shake is likely at
anything much less than 1/200 sec. As the maximum aperture is effectively
much smaller when 'zoomed in' [1], thus requiring a slower shutter speed
than the wide-angle setting could use in the same light, it's easy to see
that even on a fairly bright day there are times when your camera /should/
warn you of 'camera shake'. Photographers who like to use long lenses
with medium-speed film have always had to carry (or hunt around for) some
sort of camera support; so have those who like to take pictures indoors,
unless they an afford an extreme wide-aperture prime lens.

The problem can to some extent be designed out of camera lenses, by making
them with larger maximum apertures; but that makes them a lot bigger, and
a great deal more expensive - and not 'zooms'. Camera lenses built for
low-light hand-held work are not enormous just because the designer felt
like it.

[1] Assuming that the actual 'hole' through which the light passes, is
fixed at whatever works out as "f/2.8" at the wide-angle end of a 3X zoom,
then at the 'tele' end that same hole will work out as more like "f/4.5",
ie letting through only 1/3 as much light. So if you can use 1/100 sec at
f/2.8 at the 'wide' zoom, then when you zoom in you will have to use f/4.5
which means that the shutter speed will be little more than 1/30 sec -
even if the smaller area now being photographed is just as bright as the
wider scene, which it probably isn't.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
  #18  
Old February 1st 06, 11:14 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

Hi,

I didn't use any zoom. I tried to take a outdoor picture similar to the one
in that Sony forum, I got the same 1/30 sec without using zoom. I set the
W1 to AUTO. It just picked 1/30 all the time. (unless it is really bright)
For the Sony, it displays the shaky hand when the shutter speed is selected
1/40 or less (without zoom). So, if I set the W1 to Manual, and pick 1/40
instead of 1/30, the shaky hand will disappear but the same picture will
come out dark.

My question is that is it that the lens used in the Sony does not let enough
light to go in the camera making the camera to always pick a slower shutter
speed.

I am confused why other brands do not have this problem? I don't find any
post in the other forums about their camera picking slow shutter speed in
"pretty" sunny outdoor.

One possibility is that the other brands raise the ISO but keep the shutter
speed fast. The Sony, on the other hand, tries to keep the ISO low but slow
the shutter speed. I don't know. Just a guess.


The Sony slows the shutter speed to 1/30 all the time. So, I always need to
use the flash. When I use the flash, the Sony always picks 1/60 sec or
higher. But the flash in the Sony is not strong enough for outdoor (to
fill) but too bright for indoor.

I am thinking to buy a Olympus E500 ($800 with 2 lenses) or the Sony H1
($500) to replace the W1 ($350). I want one that I can use an external
flash that I can point to a different angle. (right now, I am using one of
those very bright spot flash light) And one that has better lens that can
let more light to go in to the camera.

But before I go nut to folk up a grand for a camera, I want to understand
why the Sony slows the shutter speed but the other brand doesn't do the
same.








That 'wobbly hands' icon does /not/ mean "using 1/30 sec or slower"; when
you 'zoom in' to the full extent of your 3x zoom, camera shake is likely
at
anything much less than 1/200 sec.



  #19  
Old February 2nd 06, 04:49 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

On 2006-02-01, Tom wrote:
Hi,

I didn't use any zoom. I tried to take a outdoor picture similar to the one
in that Sony forum, I got the same 1/30 sec without using zoom. I set the
W1 to AUTO. It just picked 1/30 all the time. (unless it is really bright)
For the Sony, it displays the shaky hand when the shutter speed is selected
1/40 or less (without zoom). So, if I set the W1 to Manual, and pick 1/40
instead of 1/30, the shaky hand will disappear but the same picture will
come out dark.

My question is that is it that the lens used in the Sony does not let enough
light to go in the camera making the camera to always pick a slower shutter
speed.

I am confused why other brands do not have this problem? I don't find any
post in the other forums about their camera picking slow shutter speed in
"pretty" sunny outdoor.

One possibility is that the other brands raise the ISO but keep the shutter
speed fast. The Sony, on the other hand, tries to keep the ISO low but slow
the shutter speed. I don't know. Just a guess.


Can you over-ride the ISO setting? If so, try it. Any camera is going to
need you to learn its quirks; perhaps that is one of the quirks of your
camera?

The Sony slows the shutter speed to 1/30 all the time. So, I always need to
use the flash. When I use the flash, the Sony always picks 1/60 sec or
higher. But the flash in the Sony is not strong enough for outdoor (to
fill) but too bright for indoor.


I don't know if there is a 'problem' with the way your Sony operates, or
with the way you operate it. Perhaps you could spend some of your money
on a 35mm or roll-film camera with manual-only exposure control; that is
the best way to learn 'exposure technique' without camera electronics
getting in the way. Even a seperate hand-held exposure meter will give
you more information than you can easily get from a compact digital camera
(and provide a 'second opinion' if you suspect that the camera is not
metering correctly).

I am thinking to buy a Olympus E500 ($800 with 2 lenses) or the Sony H1
($500) to replace the W1 ($350). I want one that I can use an external
flash that I can point to a different angle. (right now, I am using one of
those very bright spot flash light) And one that has better lens that can
let more light to go in to the camera.

But before I go nut to folk up a grand for a camera, I want to understand
why the Sony slows the shutter speed but the other brand doesn't do the
same.


I'm not convinced that your camera is doing anything significantly
different from comparable models from other brands. All the reviews you
have pointed me to seem to be overwhelmingly favourable, and the 'shaking
hands symbol' bothers only one or two users - and those users are not
complaining about the results (apart from you), only about the fact that
the warning appears and they don't understand what it really means.

Interchangeable lenses and fancy flash technique are way beyond the scope
of 'point and shoot' cameras.

If you want a lens that lets in more light, check the 'maximum aperture';
f/2.8 is the 'best' you're likely to get on a compact camera. Any lenses
marked f/2.8 (or 1:2.8 on some brands) will be 'equally fast'. A lens
marked f/2 will be 'twice as fast' - and for a given focal length it will
be larger, heavier, and more expensive. F/1.4 is twice as fast again, and
getting pretty substantial and (if you want good results at that maximum
aperture), you'll be taking 'real money'. There are even faster lenses
made at the 50mm focal length for 35mm cameras - and they are very
expensive (or not very good). Zoom lenses rarely have large maximum
apertures, likewise 'telephoto' lenses and wideangles.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
  #20  
Old February 2nd 06, 06:17 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.point+shoot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Need to replace my Sony W1

This one is $80 buck. It says it can see what my eyes can see. Sound
pretty good. Will this work for letting more light to go in? Do you know
the different from this lens to the one in my Sony?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...Fencoding=UTF8

"Whiskers" wrote in message
...
On 2006-02-01, Tom wrote:
aperture), you'll be taking 'real money'. There are even faster lenses
made at the 50mm focal length for 35mm cameras - and they are very
expensive (or not very good). Zoom lenses rarely have large maximum
apertures, likewise 'telephoto' lenses and wideangles.



 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sony is Now a Spammer McWebber Digital Photography 0 April 25th 05 05:40 PM
Sony DSC F150 vs Fuji finepix F810 Gnekker Digital Photography 1 December 17th 04 03:44 AM
Sony Cybershot DSC-W1... Bad Camera...Bad Customer Service by Sony... Read on... unavailable 35mm Photo Equipment 38 June 29th 04 06:45 AM
FS: 58mm Infrared 'X Ray' Filter for Sony Cybershot DSC F717 yeo seng tong Digital Photo Equipment For Sale 0 August 2nd 03 04:23 AM
37mm Infrared 'X Ray' Filter for Sony DV Cam yeo seng tong Digital Photo Equipment For Sale 0 July 10th 03 05:32 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 PhotoBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.