problem with ink and photopaper! will coating help?

Hello,
I've just purchased an HP 4180 photosmart printer as my first foray
into home digital printing.
Getting good images on paper isn't the problem. Problem is keeping the
ink on the paper. Passing the prints around and talking, I've noticed
that tiny spits of liquid cause the color to lift, leaving the white
base paper showing in spots.
A call to HP was useless so far.
I suspect too much ink is being deposited when printing but even after
hours of drying time the image will still lift.
Do digital pix need to be coated to stay colorfast like a good old
fashioned silver print?
I'm using HP's Premium Plus paper and latest Vivera archival inks...
HELP!
TIA,
Frustrated Al

This shouldn't be a problem. Premium Plus paper is the multilayer paper
product. They do have a Advanced paper as well you could try that might
work better. What kind of enviroment are you printing in ? High Humidity ?
Try using a blow dryer on a print and see if that helps. I use a 3210
product here and have had great success with the prints. As with any inkjet
they must dry throughly though for maximum colorfastness. I usually let
mine sit overnight to get best results. I have printed a few and put them
into picture frames as 8 x 10's and only let them dry a short time. Usually
those get a few marks on the fronts if I'm too quick about mounting them.
But overall drying isn't a big deal.

Steve

wrote in message
ups.com...
Hello,
I've just purchased an HP 4180 photosmart printer as my first foray
into home digital printing.
Getting good images on paper isn't the problem. Problem is keeping the
ink on the paper. Passing the prints around and talking, I've noticed
that tiny spits of liquid cause the color to lift, leaving the white
base paper showing in spots.
A call to HP was useless so far.
I suspect too much ink is being deposited when printing but even after
hours of drying time the image will still lift.
Do digital pix need to be coated to stay colorfast like a good old
fashioned silver print?
I'm using HP's Premium Plus paper and latest Vivera archival inks...
HELP!
TIA,
Frustrated Al

wrote:

Hello,
I've just purchased an HP 4180 photosmart printer as my first foray
into home digital printing.
Getting good images on paper isn't the problem. Problem is keeping the
ink on the paper. Passing the prints around and talking, I've noticed
that tiny spits of liquid cause the color to lift, leaving the white
base paper showing in spots.
A call to HP was useless so far.
I suspect too much ink is being deposited when printing but even after
hours of drying time the image will still lift.
Do digital pix need to be coated to stay colorfast like a good old
fashioned silver print?
I'm using HP's Premium Plus paper and latest Vivera archival inks...
HELP!
TIA,
Frustrated Al

A known characteristic of HP inks is that they take a looong time to dry
enough to handle safely. I have not used them myself but friends who do,
tell me they let them "air dry" for 24 hours before much handling.
Bob Williams

I've had one 4X6 drying in the air conditioned household air for four
days and did another water test and the color still lifts off.
I'm in NC so the humidity is high right now.
I'll try the hair dryer tomorrow and then perhaps the microwave oven
(?) if that fails.
Do any of you believe the ink is being applied too thickly? Assuming I
can change dpi settings could this make a difference? The ink doesn't
seem to be bonded or melded into the paper at all.
I am a novice at digital darkroom work but not a stranger to wet b&w
printing so this is a new discipline I need embrace.
Further thoughts and suggestions are very much welcome so please, any
links or comments are greatly appreciated.
Getting beautiful results out of a Fujifilm S1 SLR and various Nikkors
combined with this HP printer.
Health & Peace,
Honest Al
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Bob Williams wrote:
wrote:

Hello,
I've just purchased an HP 4180 photosmart printer as my first foray
into home digital printing.
Getting good images on paper isn't the problem. Problem is keeping the
ink on the paper. Passing the prints around and talking, I've noticed
that tiny spits of liquid cause the color to lift, leaving the white
base paper showing in spots.
A call to HP was useless so far.
I suspect too much ink is being deposited when printing but even after
hours of drying time the image will still lift.
Do digital pix need to be coated to stay colorfast like a good old
fashioned silver print?
I'm using HP's Premium Plus paper and latest Vivera archival inks...
HELP!
TIA,
Frustrated Al

A known characteristic of HP inks is that they take a looong time to dry
enough to handle safely. I have not used them myself but friends who do,
tell me they let them "air dry" for 24 hours before much handling.
Bob Williams

Bob Williams wrote:


: wrote:

: Hello,
: I've just purchased an HP 4180 photosmart printer as my first foray
: into home digital printing.
: Getting good images on paper isn't the problem. Problem is keeping the
: ink on the paper. Passing the prints around and talking, I've noticed
: that tiny spits of liquid cause the color to lift, leaving the white
: base paper showing in spots.
: A call to HP was useless so far.
: I suspect too much ink is being deposited when printing but even after
: hours of drying time the image will still lift.
: Do digital pix need to be coated to stay colorfast like a good old
: fashioned silver print?
: I'm using HP's Premium Plus paper and latest Vivera archival inks...
: HELP!
: TIA,
: Frustrated Al

: A known characteristic of HP inks is that they take a looong time to dry
: enough to handle safely. I have not used them myself but friends who do,
: tell me they let them "air dry" for 24 hours before much handling.
: Bob Williams
:

One other problem is that printing on photo paper the ink is only
deposited on the surface (soaking in would slightly blur the image). So
the ink is much more sensitive to moisture or physical scratches. One way
to solve this is to wait for the ink to dry (as mentioned above) and then
use a clear coat on top to seal the ink. There are many clear photo spray
on sealers available. Also look in art supplies. Or if you are looking
for something less expensive, look in the spray paint aisle for "crystal
clear" Krylon paint (I haven't tried other brands but they may work too).
A thin coat ontop of a fully dried print does wonders for the prints
durrability. Practice on prints you don't care about as too thick a coat
or spraying from too close can cause ink blur. Also avoid "clear matte" as
it just doesn't work for photos. Use your own practice to decide if any
specific product will do the job for you.

Randy

==========
Randy Berbaum
Champaign, IL

wrote:
: I've had one 4X6 drying in the air conditioned household air for four
: days and did another water test and the color still lifts off.
: I'm in NC so the humidity is high right now.
: I'll try the hair dryer tomorrow and then perhaps the microwave oven
: (?) if that fails.
: Do any of you believe the ink is being applied too thickly? Assuming I
: can change dpi settings could this make a difference? The ink doesn't
: seem to be bonded or melded into the paper at all.

That's what makes photo paper, photo paper. The paper is coated to make it
water resistant. Thus the ink is applied to the surface and dries there
without soaking in. When ink soaks in it spreads out and this blurs the
image slightly. With the exception of a few high end (read high price)
printers, most color printers use watr soluable inks that will lift right
off if they get wet. What you want to do is dry the ink as well as you can
(the hair dryer might help but finding how soon after print and how
intense the heat will take practice). Then to prevent moisture damage
and/or scratches you will need to seal the image. This can be done with
lamination, or with liquid sealants. Either way this is the only good way
to make sure that water and/or physical damage will be resisted.

Randy

==========
Randy Berbaum
Champaign, IL

Randy Berbaum wrote:
wrote:
: I've had one 4X6 drying in the air conditioned household air for four
: days and did another water test and the color still lifts off.

I use Canon paper (and ink) and haven't
had any problems. Wonder what would happen
if you tried a different paper.

Luk

wrote:
Hello,
I've just purchased an HP 4180 photosmart printer as my first foray
into home digital printing.
Getting good images on paper isn't the problem. Problem is keeping the
ink on the paper. Passing the prints around and talking, I've noticed
that tiny spits of liquid cause the color to lift, leaving the white
base paper showing in spots.
A call to HP was useless so far.
I suspect too much ink is being deposited when printing but even after
hours of drying time the image will still lift.
Do digital pix need to be coated to stay colorfast like a good old
fashioned silver print?
I'm using HP's Premium Plus paper and latest Vivera archival inks...
HELP!
TIA,
Frustrated Al

There is an interaction between paper and ink. Not all
combinations work well, and some produce very bad color
distortions. Do you have drying problems with HP ink? With
other inks, you have to use different settings. Try using
less ink - there are settings in the HP software for just that.

I've had good results with Kodak's papers and HP inks on two
HP printer. Kodak provides settings for their papers in HP
printers and HP ink. The settings are built in to the free
EasyShare software from Kodak.

HP has evidence to back up their claims for long-term
stability of prints made with their papers and inks. You
may not be gaining by using third-party ink.