Surfing Novices

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

Here, these are mine.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/qv2jt19ickukn7t/AAAVXtBzyajk5CeIzkH0EbuOa

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 20:58:45 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

You sure about this? It would be uncharacteristic of Peter. He might
have just not been paying attention, but I could be wrong.

On Sep 19, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 20:58:45 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

You sure about this? It would be uncharacteristic of Peter. He might
have just not been paying attention, but I could be wrong.

Oh! He was paying attention. It was his way of telling Ron & me to butt out of his "artistic expression", regardless of how much, and the manner in which we tried to advise.
Whenever I comment when I see a problematic image, it is with constructive critcism in mind, regardless of how harsh it might sound. That criticism is there to be taken in the spirit in which it is given, or not. Just don’t try to jerk my chain along the way.

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On 9/19/2017 11:52 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

Here, these are mine.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/qv2jt19ickukn7t/AAAVXtBzyajk5CeIzkH0EbuOa



What causes the change in the water color?

On Sep 19, 2017, gray_wolf wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:52 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

Here, these are mine.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/qv2jt19ickukn7t/AAAVXtBzyajk5CeIzkH0EbuOa

What causes the change in the water color?

Change from in water color from what?

Cloud cover, water depth at the shore break, bottom material & structure, sand, rock, or kelp, along with other intangibles such as character of the ocean, sea, body of water involved. The ocean isn’t always blue.

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 20:58:45 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Why not?

Would you have been less concerned if Peter had said 'Where did you
find them?' when they were actually your shots?

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

So is your sensitivity.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

Rrrrrrrr ....
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 22:04:11 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Sep 19, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 20:58:45 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped
artistic expressions.

You sure about this? It would be uncharacteristic of Peter. He might
have just not been paying attention, but I could be wrong.

Oh! He was paying attention. It was his way of telling Ron & me to butt out of his "artistic expression", regardless of how much, and the manner in which we tried to advise.
Whenever I comment when I see a problematic image, it is with constructive critcism in mind, regardless of how harsh it might sound. That criticism is there to be taken in the spirit in which it is given, or not. Just don’t try to jerk my chain along the way.

What's got at you?
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

On 9/19/2017 11:58 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Why plainly not yours? I look at a presented image for what I feel. I
don't pixel peer, nor do I use an Exif viewer to evaluate an image.




Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

You went about tht in a strange way.



Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

Obviously, for some reason you are insulted that the images are not
yours. I strive to make nice images, in a style I like, and have ignored
you not so subtle barbs.


--
PeterN

On 9/20/2017 12:52 AM, Bill W wrote:
On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 20:58:45 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 11:10 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On Sep 19, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Sep 19, 2017, PeterN wrote
(in article ):

On 9/19/2017 9:54 PM, PeterN wrote:
On 9/19/2017 7:55 PM, Ron C wrote:
On 9/19/2017 8:49 AM, PeterN wrote:

...totally gigantic snip...

That is exactly my point. Some images need cropping, others don't. It
depends on what I am trying to convey.
I am showing that we really do not have different points on the
subject of cropping. That is: cropping is simply one technique for
conveying the concept in an image. In the case of surfers, I am
conveying one concept, and you prefer to convey a different concept.
After our discussion I think I understand the concept you and Ron
like to convey. That said, I like to convey a different concept in my
images, than you. That does not make me wrong, nor does it make you
wrong. What would make me wrong would be if I did not convey what I
intended to convey.

I wrote a few responses, but discarded them because they
could have been construed as personally critical. Instead
I'll just this quick question:

Getting back to the beginning, what did you intend to convey
with your original post/photo?

I have a thick skin, and do not consider well intentioned comments about
my photography, as adverse personal criticism.
As can be gleaned from my original posting statement, I was protesting
against the long drift from photography.
As for what I intended to convey, it was simply a surfing wipe-out. The
Duck pointed out that I could have posted a better one, and you, I think
correctly, pointed out that my image was almost meaningless to a surfer.
I take my photography seriously,as it it the means by which I forget
about certain personal, and unpleasant realities. I do not, and will not
even try to sell my images, as that would be work. For the same reason,
I have refused several offers from stock publishers to allow my images
to be published. I do however, enter my images in competitions, and some
have done reasonably well in local and regional competitions. I recently
had some images accepted in an international PSA competition. When
making any image I usually try to please only my taste. I inquired about
surfers preferences, because I hope to shoot a surfing competition, and
donate the images to the organization running the competition. I well
appreciate that participants in various sports can have preferences
peculiar to that sport. Similarly, in my golfing days, when I was
shooting images of holes for a local golf magazine, in exchange for
free rounds of golf, showed the subtleties that made the holes desirable.

BTW
Does this sequence contain the type of images surfers prefer?

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/wd5d4s83qdf2w51/AADsDIPQuwPN-FDIQIcREOgwa?dl=0

The sequence not so much. #1, #2, & #5 would not be worthy of consideration. #3 is the most acceptable of the group, and #4 would be very good had the surfer been in focus, I would think of that as an AF-C tracking issue.

Consider shots such as these:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJccuOhXcAER0Dp.jpg
http://i.cdn-surfline.com/surfnews/images/2016/09_september/nsb-640/full/00-Smyrna_EricGeiselmanU79A4373Watts.jpg
https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/sl-coldfusion-static-prod/surfnews/images/2011/08_august/padang_new/full/MICK-CURLEY_SURFLINE_RIPCURLCUP_5-8-2011_WALSHY-3539.jpg
or
http://tinyurl.com/yab6btue

...or this, which seems related to your first two shots.
http://nysea.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/nysea-balaram-stack-F-stop-Surfline.png

Most are really nice images. Where did yu take them?

Those are plainly not my shots.

Your sarcasm is unseemly when all I am trying to do is give you a few pointers.

Obviously you don't care for any such advice, or hints to help you with the surf competition project you have in your future, or how the subjects of your shots will see themselves depicted. I am sure they will be thankful to get shots of unidentifiable surfers lost in the shore break mush. So I will leave you to your cropped artistic expressions.

You sure about this? It would be uncharacteristic of Peter. He might
have just not been paying attention, but I could be wrong.


The images the Duck showed are of good surfers. In some cases I would
have presented them differently, but that does not make them not good
surfing shots. Note how the surfers form blends with the natural form of
the waves, and in many cases the luminescence of the water.
I started this thread as a protest against the gotcha competition of the
trolls. It was my way of saying let's get back to photography.


--
PeterN