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Nikon 5200 messy-looking high ISO images



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 9th 13, 09:30 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Me
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Posts: 51
Default Nikon 5200 messy-looking high ISO images

On 9/02/2013 8:55 p.m., RichA wrote:

The interesting comparison (IMO) is between the D600 and D5200. It's
not often that you have a comparison between the same "generation" of
sensor and same megapixel count, but one Fx and the other Dx.
With different "generation" sensors or between brands, there's usually
enough difference in contrast, colour rendering, default sharpening, NR
etc, so that it's hard to see what's going on.
To my eyes, the D5200 studio shots (raw) look almost exactly as they
should - ie at ISO 800, they are almost as good as the D600 at ISO 1600,
but clearly much better then the D600 at ISO3200.
The 24mp APS-c studio shots are (when adjusted to allow for the "one
(and a bit)" stop advantage of FX, practically indistinguishable in
every way - including detail at base ISO.
In the field it might be a different story.
  #2  
Old February 10th 13, 12:19 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Rob
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Posts: 95
Default Nikon 5200 messy-looking high ISO images

On 10/02/2013 7:30 AM, Me wrote:
On 9/02/2013 8:55 p.m., RichA wrote:

The interesting comparison (IMO) is between the D600 and D5200. It's
not often that you have a comparison between the same "generation" of
sensor and same megapixel count, but one Fx and the other Dx.
With different "generation" sensors or between brands, there's usually
enough difference in contrast, colour rendering, default sharpening, NR
etc, so that it's hard to see what's going on.
To my eyes, the D5200 studio shots (raw) look almost exactly as they
should - ie at ISO 800, they are almost as good as the D600 at ISO 1600,
but clearly much better then the D600 at ISO3200.
The 24mp APS-c studio shots are (when adjusted to allow for the "one
(and a bit)" stop advantage of FX, practically indistinguishable in
every way - including detail at base ISO.
In the field it might be a different story.





It was surprising to see the test results. Is the pixel density
becoming too much for a reliable sensor at high ISO. Be of interest to
actually know what is causing the spots. It does not seem like dead
pixels, they look different, I've had them and replaced my 5 year old
camera after 70,000 plus actuations.


Going back to the D700 FX at high iso and comparing the results with the
D90 DX same Mp the results were chalk and cheese.


I know a couple of people who use the D3200 and they are very happy with
the results, but then again, don't push their cameras to the extreme, or
have high expectations, bring a replacement a DX camera so they could
use their older lenses.
  #3  
Old February 10th 13, 01:23 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Me
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Posts: 51
Default Nikon 5200 messy-looking high ISO images

On 10/02/2013 11:57 a.m., RichA wrote:
On Feb 9, 3:30 pm, Me wrote:
On 9/02/2013 8:55 p.m., RichA wrote:

The interesting comparison (IMO) is between the D600 and D5200. It's
not often that you have a comparison between the same "generation" of
sensor and same megapixel count, but one Fx and the other Dx.
With different "generation" sensors or between brands, there's usually
enough difference in contrast, colour rendering, default sharpening, NR
etc, so that it's hard to see what's going on.
To my eyes, the D5200 studio shots (raw) look almost exactly as they
should - ie at ISO 800, they are almost as good as the D600 at ISO 1600,
but clearly much better then the D600 at ISO3200.
The 24mp APS-c studio shots are (when adjusted to allow for the "one
(and a bit)" stop advantage of FX, practically indistinguishable in
every way - including detail at base ISO.
In the field it might be a different story.


So going FX buys you one stop or so of noise control and the ability
to use wide angle lenses to their fullest ability. Still wondering if
Nikon will fill the huge void between the ho-hum D600 body and the
D800?

If you need deep DOF at a given FOV, then there's no real advantage to
FX, subject to how lenses perform, and subject to DR still being mainly
limited by read noise at base ISO (less so these days with Nikon - since
the D7000 at least)
There's not much of a "product line-up" gap between the D600 and 800.
An extra $1,000 gets you a few more pixels, a slightly better AF point
coverage, a bit more metal, but not much else. Ergonomically the D600
is better - Ken Rockwell hits the nail on the head with his criticism of
the D300/700/800 obscure and poorly executed menu-only accessible
shooting banks, yet programmable and easily switchable user functions on
the D7000 and D600.
What's missing (IMO) is a faster frame-rate FX camera above the D800,
and a pro Dx camera.
Also missing is some better QA - or some more timely and appropriate
response from Nikon when problems do arise. The D800 and D600 "issues"
might be overblown on internet forums, but even if Nikon thinks so,
their lack of response is pretty bad IMO. Canon did Nikon an almighty
favour when they buried their heads in the sand over the 1D III focus
issues. Nikon seem to be returning the favour.
  #4  
Old February 10th 13, 02:06 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Robert Coe
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Posts: 4,901
Default Nikon 5200 messy-looking high ISO images

On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 13:23:20 +1300, Me wrote:
: On 10/02/2013 11:57 a.m., RichA wrote:
: So going FX buys you one stop or so of noise control and the ability
: to use wide angle lenses to their fullest ability. Still wondering if
: Nikon will fill the huge void between the ho-hum D600 body and the
: D800?
:
: If you need deep DOF at a given FOV, then there's no real advantage to
: FX, subject to how lenses perform, and subject to DR still being mainly
: limited by read noise at base ISO (less so these days with Nikon - since
: the D7000 at least)
: There's not much of a "product line-up" gap between the D600 and 800.
: An extra $1,000 gets you a few more pixels, a slightly better AF point
: coverage, a bit more metal, but not much else. Ergonomically the D600
: is better - Ken Rockwell hits the nail on the head with his criticism of
: the D300/700/800 obscure and poorly executed menu-only accessible
: shooting banks, yet programmable and easily switchable user functions on
: the D7000 and D600.
: What's missing (IMO) is a faster frame-rate FX camera above the D800,

"Above" in what sense? To maintain the D800's resolution at a higher frame
rate would require a faster processor, wouldn't it? This would mean more power
consumption, so maybe you'd need a D4-size body?

: and a pro Dx camera.

The much-discussed "D300 replacement", IOW?

: Also missing is some better QA - or some more timely and appropriate
: response from Nikon when problems do arise. The D800 and D600 "issues"
: might be overblown on internet forums, but even if Nikon thinks so,
: their lack of response is pretty bad IMO. Canon did Nikon an almighty
: favour when they buried their heads in the sand over the 1D III focus
: issues. Nikon seem to be returning the favour.

The 1D3 fiasco was certainly an embarrassment for Canon, but they seem to have
lived it down. I have to admit that I haven't paid much attention to Nikon's
"issues" with the D800 and D600. (Why should I? I'm a Canonian.) But the D800
debuted with so much hype, not all of it Nikon's doing, that it's hard to see
how they could have lived up to it without having to deal with a few
embarrassing glitches. And let's face it: Nikon's competitors haven't exactly
stepped up to the 36Mp challenge.

Bob
  #5  
Old March 1st 13, 11:32 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
Wolfgang Weisselberg
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Posts: 5,285
Default Nikon 5200 messy-looking high ISO images

Robert Coe wrote:

The 1D3 fiasco was certainly an embarrassment for Canon, but they seem to have
lived it down. I have to admit that I haven't paid much attention to Nikon's
"issues" with the D800 and D600. (Why should I? I'm a Canonian.)


Because every good Cannoneer, ah, Canonian should always aim
for the weak spot of the enemy. :-)

embarrassing glitches. And let's face it: Nikon's competitors haven't exactly
stepped up to the 36Mp challenge.


http://www.dpreview.com/news/2010/08...non120mpsensor
Look at the date.

And of course
http://www.dpreview.com/news/2010/08...nlargestsensor

It is obviously not a question of "not capable", it's a question
if it's worth it. There are few people who need a 36 MPix 35mm
camera; and unless you're shooting medium format-like with it
you're not using the resolution. OK, there ARE those who buy
just for the bragging rights. ("I have about as many Gigahertz
in my CPU as the D800 has Megapixels, eat your heart out!")

-Wolfgang
 




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