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Another Brisbane at night pano..



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 14th 08, 01:40 PM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Mark Thomas
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 835
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

More work in progress..

http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/pano_night1_test.jpg

Fuji S9000, fl~35mm, 3s f5.6, 5 images, PTGUI, adjusted levels/sat,
lightly denoised, reduced to about 1/3 size and USM.
(Need any of this explained or elaborated? just ask..)

Two conflicting thoughts struck me while taking the source images:

1. Why doesn't Brisbane City Council light up the botanical gardens a
bit, so it doesn't look like a huge black slug in the middle of my
image..? (O:

and then, hypocritically

2. Do all of those building lights really need to be on, wasting energy
like it doesn't matter? (OK, it *was* only about 6pm on a weekday, so I
guess it just reflects the long hours we Qlder's work.)

In regard to the image - yes, I'm aware of the stitching errors in the
foreground handrails, due to me shooting this without a pano head.
Maybe I'll go back and fiddle with the control points, maybe not -
consider it a copyright message to prevent misuse...!

And in hindsight, I should probably have used HDR to get more detail in
the sky. But the sunset wasn't a winner, so I couldn't be bothered.
Another for the maybe-next-time bin.

Constructive criticism welcome.
  #2  
Old August 14th 08, 02:04 PM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Troy Piggins[_17_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 42
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

* Mark Thomas wrote :
More work in progress..

http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/pano_night1_test.jpg

Fuji S9000, fl~35mm, 3s f5.6, 5 images, PTGUI, adjusted levels/sat,
lightly denoised, reduced to about 1/3 size and USM.
(Need any of this explained or elaborated? just ask..)

snip /

G'day Mark. I've been thinking about panos lately. I don't have
a pano head, so trying them handheld. Having trouble I think
because the lens I'm using is too wide and getting like a fisheye
effect in each frame which is not condusive to the stitching.

What lens/focal length should you use?

And to minimise the effects of that, should you shoot with
horizon dead centre, as opposed to rule of thirds?

--
Troy Piggins
I always appreciate critique.
  #3  
Old August 14th 08, 02:52 PM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Mark Thomas
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 835
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

Troy Piggins wrote:
* Mark Thomas wrote :
More work in progress..

http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/pano_night1_test.jpg

Fuji S9000, fl~35mm, 3s f5.6, 5 images, PTGUI, adjusted levels/sat,
lightly denoised, reduced to about 1/3 size and USM.
(Need any of this explained or elaborated? just ask..)

snip /

G'day Mark.


Cheers, mate - nice to see you still pop by occasionally!

I've been thinking about panos lately.

Try to resist, even though the Force is strong!! I think they are
starting to take over my hobby completely... aaargh..

I don't have
a pano head, so trying them handheld. Having trouble I think
because the lens I'm using is too wide and getting like a fisheye
effect in each frame which is not condusive to the stitching.


A lot depends on the software you are using.. ? I don't *normally*
hesitate to use mine right down to 28mm with PTGUI, but.. read on..

What lens/focal length should you use?

It depends.. If most/all of the subject matter is a reasonable distance
away from you, then you will probably find you are ok down to 28mm, and
handheld will suffice in most cases as long as you watch what you are
doing. But if there is stuff up close to you, it will all get very
tricky without that pano head - and longer f-l's will help.

The image above is a case in point - I didn't shoot it very carefully,
and it was at about 35mm f-l. The handrails and foliage were all quite
close to my location.. When I gave the images to PTGUI, it did a fine
job with the background stuff, but obviously had a problem with the
handrail area. What you see is exactly what PTGUI gave me with no
intervention on my part.

I *did* briefly try adding a few control points to bring the handrail
into line, but PTGUI basically told me I was asking the impossible. I
told it to go ahead and try anyway - but when it tried to reconcile my
inputs it had to change focal length assumptions and re-align (and
misalign) stuff. In other words, it all went badly wrong because the
parallax issues were too great for *automatic* stitching.

It's a bit like the linear/stepped out issues that were beaten to death
some time back. Too much parallax = no panorama!

However... In this rather mild case, what I would do is simply go back
to PTGUI's original default effort and ask for a PSD file - which has
all the source images (deformed and aligned appropriately) as layers.
Then I can use Photoshop to fiddle with it - a bit of erasing and
stretching will have those rails sorted in a reasonably short time.
I've done that sort of thing before, notably on this one:
http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/brisbane_pano_bw.jpg
which had some similar problems.

So it's horses for courses.. it really depends on the original scene and
the software you are using.

In summary, yes a pano head will help a lot if your pano's have a lot of
deopth or close up stuff. So will using longer focal lengths, but of
course the penalty is the extra time and effort.

And to minimise the effects of that, should you shoot with
horizon dead centre, as opposed to rule of thirds?


Again, it depends somewhat on the capabilities of the program you stitch
with. The less the program has to stretch/distort images the better, so
I guess yes is the answer.
Plus panoramas by their nature tend to be
'what-you-would-see-if-you-turn-your-head-around', so a level-ish and
centred horizon seems to work better, for me anyways..

And you can always crop high or low - increasingly I am shooting the
source images portrait-ways, so I have a fair bit of head- and foot-room ..

Hope that helps, sorry I waffled on..

mt
  #4  
Old August 14th 08, 08:35 PM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Henry Kolesnik
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 20
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..


"Mark Thomas" wrote in message
...
Troy Piggins wrote:
* Mark Thomas wrote :
More work in progress..

http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/pano_night1_test.jpg

Fuji S9000, fl~35mm, 3s f5.6, 5 images, PTGUI, adjusted levels/sat,
lightly denoised, reduced to about 1/3 size and USM.
(Need any of this explained or elaborated? just ask..)

snip /

G'day Mark.


Cheers, mate - nice to see you still pop by occasionally!

I've been thinking about panos lately.

Try to resist, even though the Force is strong!! I think they are
starting to take over my hobby completely... aaargh..

I don't have
a pano head, so trying them handheld. Having trouble I think
because the lens I'm using is too wide and getting like a fisheye
effect in each frame which is not condusive to the stitching.


A lot depends on the software you are using.. ? I don't *normally*
hesitate to use mine right down to 28mm with PTGUI, but.. read on..

What lens/focal length should you use?

It depends.. If most/all of the subject matter is a reasonable
distance away from you, then you will probably find you are ok down to
28mm, and handheld will suffice in most cases as long as you watch
what you are doing. But if there is stuff up close to you, it will
all get very tricky without that pano head - and longer f-l's will
help.

The image above is a case in point - I didn't shoot it very carefully,
and it was at about 35mm f-l. The handrails and foliage were all
quite close to my location.. When I gave the images to PTGUI, it did
a fine job with the background stuff, but obviously had a problem with
the handrail area. What you see is exactly what PTGUI gave me with no
intervention on my part.

I *did* briefly try adding a few control points to bring the handrail
into line, but PTGUI basically told me I was asking the impossible. I
told it to go ahead and try anyway - but when it tried to reconcile my
inputs it had to change focal length assumptions and re-align (and
misalign) stuff. In other words, it all went badly wrong because the
parallax issues were too great for *automatic* stitching.

It's a bit like the linear/stepped out issues that were beaten to
death some time back. Too much parallax = no panorama!

However... In this rather mild case, what I would do is simply go
back to PTGUI's original default effort and ask for a PSD file - which
has all the source images (deformed and aligned appropriately) as
layers. Then I can use Photoshop to fiddle with it - a bit of erasing
and stretching will have those rails sorted in a reasonably short
time. I've done that sort of thing before, notably on this one:
http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/brisbane_pano_bw.jpg
which had some similar problems.

So it's horses for courses.. it really depends on the original scene
and the software you are using.

In summary, yes a pano head will help a lot if your pano's have a lot
of deopth or close up stuff. So will using longer focal lengths, but
of course the penalty is the extra time and effort.

And to minimise the effects of that, should you shoot with
horizon dead centre, as opposed to rule of thirds?


Again, it depends somewhat on the capabilities of the program you
stitch with. The less the program has to stretch/distort images the
better, so I guess yes is the answer.
Plus panoramas by their nature tend to be
'what-you-would-see-if-you-turn-your-head-around', so a level-ish and
centred horizon seems to work better, for me anyways..

And you can always crop high or low - increasingly I am shooting the
source images portrait-ways, so I have a fair bit of head- and
foot-room ..

Hope that helps, sorry I waffled on..

mt

Hey neat pic..
Maybe your onto something in your stitching..
Escher's illusions and your handrails are on the right track for an
Escher..
http://www.techeblog.com/index.php/t...hers-waterfall

--

73
Hank WD5JFR

  #5  
Old August 14th 08, 09:27 PM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Troy Piggins[_17_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 42
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

* Mark Thomas wrote :
Troy Piggins wrote:
* Mark Thomas wrote :
More work in progress..

http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/pano_night1_test.jpg

Fuji S9000, fl~35mm, 3s f5.6, 5 images, PTGUI, adjusted levels/sat,
lightly denoised, reduced to about 1/3 size and USM.
(Need any of this explained or elaborated? just ask..)

snip /

G'day Mark.


Cheers, mate - nice to see you still pop by occasionally!


Let's just say your post piqued my interest.
I didn't say I was going altogether, just not posting as much.


I've been thinking about panos lately.


Try to resist, even though the Force is strong!! I think they are
starting to take over my hobby completely... aaargh..


I have a trip planned in a couple of months, and think that panos
will work very nicely there. Santorini/Greek Islands, thankyou
very much

I don't have
a pano head, so trying them handheld. Having trouble I think
because the lens I'm using is too wide and getting like a fisheye
effect in each frame which is not condusive to the stitching.


A lot depends on the software you are using.. ? I don't *normally*
hesitate to use mine right down to 28mm with PTGUI, but.. read on..


I'm very green to the software. I've heard of PTGUI. I've had a
go with the Canon software that came with the camera -
Photostitch or something like that.

I've heard good things about hugin and enblend but haven't played
with it yet.

What lens/focal length should you use?


It depends.. If most/all of the subject matter is a reasonable distance
away from you, then you will probably find you are ok down to 28mm, and
handheld will suffice in most cases as long as you watch what you are
doing. But if there is stuff up close to you, it will all get very
tricky without that pano head - and longer f-l's will help.

snip /
In summary, yes a pano head will help a lot if your pano's have a lot of
deopth or close up stuff. So will using longer focal lengths, but of
course the penalty is the extra time and effort.

And to minimise the effects of that, should you shoot with
horizon dead centre, as opposed to rule of thirds?


Again, it depends somewhat on the capabilities of the program you stitch
with. The less the program has to stretch/distort images the better, so
I guess yes is the answer.
Plus panoramas by their nature tend to be
'what-you-would-see-if-you-turn-your-head-around', so a level-ish and
centred horizon seems to work better, for me anyways..

And you can always crop high or low - increasingly I am shooting the
source images portrait-ways, so I have a fair bit of head- and foot-room ..


Yeah, in my few recent attempts I have been trying portrait
orientation.

Hope that helps, sorry I waffled on..


Thanks mate.

--
Troy Piggins
I always appreciate critique.
  #6  
Old August 14th 08, 10:07 PM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Troy Piggins[_17_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 42
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

* Troy Piggins wrote :
* Mark Thomas wrote :
Troy Piggins wrote:
* Mark Thomas wrote :
More work in progress..

http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/pano_night1_test.jpg

Fuji S9000, fl~35mm, 3s f5.6, 5 images, PTGUI, adjusted levels/sat,
lightly denoised, reduced to about 1/3 size and USM.
(Need any of this explained or elaborated? just ask..)

snip /
A lot depends on the software you are using.. ? I don't *normally*
hesitate to use mine right down to 28mm with PTGUI, but.. read on..


I'm very green to the software. I've heard of PTGUI. I've had a
go with the Canon software that came with the camera -
Photostitch or something like that.

I've heard good things about hugin and enblend but haven't played
with it yet.


Just played with some pano shots I took in Townsville on Monday.
Not the best pano, but that hugin worked a treat using all the
fully automatic settings. Photostich left some wobbly horizons
and blurry bits etc. A comparison:

Canon's Photostitch:
http://piggo.com/~troy/photos/2008_0...tv-pano-ps.jpg

Hugin:
http://piggo.com/~troy/photos/2008_0...80/tv-pano.jpg

For no particular reason, I had a bit of a play with creating a
fake model/tiltshift shot for fun. Nothing at all to do with
panos, sorry
http://piggo.com/~troy/photos/2008/2...9088-model.jpg

--
Troy Piggins
I always appreciate critique.
  #7  
Old August 14th 08, 10:41 PM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Alan Browne
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12,640
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

Troy Piggins wrote:
snipped

Troy, could you drop me an e-mail please?

alan daht browne & videotron daht ca

Thanks,
Alan.

--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
-- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch.
-- usenet posts from gmail.com and googlemail.com are filtered out.
  #8  
Old August 15th 08, 12:12 AM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Mark Thomas
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 835
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

Henry Kolesnik wrote:

Hey neat pic..


Thanks.

Maybe your onto something in your stitching..
Escher's illusions and your handrails are on the right track for an
Escher..
http://www.techeblog.com/index.php/t...hers-waterfall


Yes, when I saw the second handrail neatly misaligned with the lower
edge of itself, Escher-esque images came to mind..


  #9  
Old August 15th 08, 12:21 AM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
Mark Thomas
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 835
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

Troy Piggins wrote:
I have a trip planned in a couple of months, and think that panos
will work very nicely there. Santorini/Greek Islands, thankyou
very much


You lucky, lucky *******! Coincidentally, I was in a fish and chip shop
yesterday and saw two Santorini pictures upon their wall. But the
genius who produced them didn't think the lovely colours of the houses
and landscape was enough, so s/he had pasted in a (completely
mismatched) sunset from another shot. The lighting was all wrong, and
the images had simply been destroyed.

Sigh.

I'm very green to the software. I've heard of PTGUI. I've had a
go with the Canon software that came with the camera -
Photostitch or something like that.


I just saw the comparison you did - I'm sure I've seen folk recommending
the Canon software, but the only examples I've seen have been similar to
yours... Needless to say, I prefer PTGUI! Obviously Hugin seems to do
well too.

As for the focus-challenged tilt-shift shot.. Well, it made me chuckle!

Good luck with the santorini trip. May the light be good! Look forward
to seeing any you care to share.
  #10  
Old August 15th 08, 12:52 AM posted to aus.photo,rec.photo.digital
^Tems^[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 71
Default Another Brisbane at night pano..

Mark Thomas wrote:
More work in progress..

http://www.marktphoto.com/examples/pano_night1_test.jpg

Fuji S9000, fl~35mm, 3s f5.6, 5 images, PTGUI, adjusted levels/sat,
lightly denoised, reduced to about 1/3 size and USM.
(Need any of this explained or elaborated? just ask..)

Two conflicting thoughts struck me while taking the source images:

1. Why doesn't Brisbane City Council light up the botanical gardens a
bit, so it doesn't look like a huge black slug in the middle of my
image..? (O:

and then, hypocritically

2. Do all of those building lights really need to be on, wasting energy
like it doesn't matter? (OK, it *was* only about 6pm on a weekday, so I
guess it just reflects the long hours we Qlder's work.)

In regard to the image - yes, I'm aware of the stitching errors in the
foreground handrails, due to me shooting this without a pano head. Maybe
I'll go back and fiddle with the control points, maybe not - consider it
a copyright message to prevent misuse...!

And in hindsight, I should probably have used HDR to get more detail in
the sky. But the sunset wasn't a winner, so I couldn't be bothered.
Another for the maybe-next-time bin.

Constructive criticism welcome.


A couple I have done this week with PTGui (40d and 28-135 KIT lens)

8 stitch
http://www.pbase.com/temuchin/image/101666935


6 stitch
http://www.pbase.com/temuchin/image/101666933
The centre horizon is very blown but 1/2 hour after sunset it is hard to
get perfect light.
 




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