Wearing phot vest at Europe in June 2006

Lucas wrote:
"PTravel" schreef in bericht
. com...

SNIP

Passport should be carried some place under a shirt, not in a vest
pocket.

It's best not to carry the passport.


It is the requirement in a lot of European countries, especially Spain
that you carry your passport at all times.

It's a requirement in some, but never enforced. A photocopy will do.


SNIP

In ALL European countries it is law that you should be able to (legally)
identify yourself. For residents of most European Union countries any
official ID-card (with photo) will do, sometimes a drivers licence is
accepted. Foreigners (non EU-residents) on the other hand must be able to
identify themselves with their passports when requested by officials
(police, customs, etc..) at all times; a photocopy is NOT a legal document!
When you have only a photocopy on you, you may (or may not) be asked to come
to the police station in order to "establish your identity", depending on
how trustworthy you are in the eyes of the official, and wether or not there
is a recent terrorist threat (we have those over here as well...).

In many European countries, including Italy, France and Spain, hotels
must register foreign guests with the local police station, and take
the passport of the guest at check-in to do so. The passport is
usually returned within a few hours or, occassionally, overnight.
Notwithstanding the ID requirements, carrying a passport around with
you is sometimes impossible, and never a good idea.



Sanctions vary in different countries; in Holland there is a fine of 30
euro's (I beleive), in neighbouring Belgium you can even get arrested for as
long as it is necessary to establish your identity... this can sometimes
take a while... These regulations are often used to deal with football (USA:
soccer) hooliganism.

We were having a discussion about an American tourist and a photo vest,
not about football hooligans.


On the other hand: in the over 30 years of my adult life, and visiting over
a dozen european countries, I can't remember when the last time it was when
anybody asked for my ID/passport, except at airports and when checking in in
hotels.

In over 30 years of constant international travel, which has included
multiple visits to virtually every western and most central European
countries, as well as Asia, Africa and India, I've never been asked for
my ID/passport except at airports and when checking in to hotels. I've
been asked to provide my passport number for VAT refund forms.
Notwithstanding the de minimus fines that may be associated with
failure to produce _adequate_ ID, i.e. showing a photocopy instead of
the passport, the consequences to an American of losing a passport (or
having is stolen) are so severe that I _always_ recommend leaving the
passport in the hotel safe (though I have, in some circumstances when I
thought the hotel a bit dodgy, locked my passport in my luggage, along
with expensive electronics and my wife's expensive items of clothing).


Doesn't your travel agent have this kind of information for you?

I only use my travel agent for booking domestic business travel. I
have more than enough experience to handle booking international travel
myself. Moreover, this is exactly the kind of information for which
Americans should not rely on travel agents, as travel agents in the
U.S. are focused almost exclusively on business travelers, or on
selling "package" tours and cruises.



Lucas, Dutchman.

Lucas wrote:
"Derek Fountain" schreef in bericht
reenews.net...
In ALL European countries it is law that you should be able to
(legally)
identify yourself. SNIP

Rubbish. You don't need to carry any identification in the United
Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Yes I do: I'm no UK-citizen.

No you don't. There is no requirement under UK law for that regardless
of your citizenship.


If that is really the case, I was misinformed the last time I stayed in one
of the better reputed international hotels in London.
After checking in, my passport was returned to me with the words: "Please
keep your passport on you in case anyone asks for it".

That's odd. In my many visits to the U.K., I've never had a hotel
clerk say anything other than, "Here's your passport. Thank you."

Why should anyone ask for it, other than for identification purposes? And
who is entitled to ask for it, other than officials (police etc.)?

So you're simply assuming that it's required by "officials."?


Anyway: better safe than sorry; as I said: in some EU-countries you can even
be arrested if you have no valid ID. That I know for a fact: my stepfather
was a policeman who had to deal with that kind of situation several times.

In the U.S., you can be arrested for jaywalking (crossing the street
against the light). However, no policeman will arrest you for that
unless you've given them some other concern and they need the charge as
a pretext.

If your concern is "better safe than sorry," a tourist, particularly
one like the OP who is wearing a photo vest, is far, far more likely to
lose his passport to a pickpocket (or simply lose the passport), than
to be arrested for failing to produce a passport in lieu of a photocopy
on demand. Notwithstanding those posters who think a decoy wallet is
necessary to mollify muggers, violent crime against tourists is simply
not a problem in Europe. Pickpockets, however, are quite common in
tourist areas, and specifically target tourists. I've never heard of
anyone having the slightest problem with "authorities" because they
didn't carry a passport with them. I have, however, heard of many,
many, many instances in which people have lost passports, wallets,
plane tickets and other not-easily-replaced items to pickpockets.
Incidently, in my 30 years of traveling the world, I've never, not
once, been pickpocketed (though I've been targetted a couple of times).
There are common sense precautions that one can and should take that
ensure against that kind of petty crime.


Lucas

irwell wrote:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2006 04:51:40 GMT, "PTravel"
wrote:


"irwell" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 9 Apr 2006 19:31:56 -0700, "PTravel"
wrote:


"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
.com...

"zxcvbnm2bg" wrote in message
oups.com...
Greetings! I am thinking of wearing a photo vest which has many pockets
to store passport, small digital camera and batteries etc. I shall be
traveling to London, Paris and Rome in late May and June 2006. One bad
point I can think - It will immediately mark me as tourist.

Will it be too hot to wear photo vest in June in London, Paris and
Rome?

I just spent 10 days in Italy. I carried my small camera in my shirt
pocket. Spare batteries can fit in a pocket easily too. The rest of
the
batteries and charger will be back at the hotel.

Passport should be carried some place under a shirt, not in a vest
pocket.

It's best not to carry the passport.


It is the requirement in a lot of European countries, especially Spain
that you carry your passport at all times.

It's a requirement in some, but never enforced. A photocopy will do.

It is enforced in Spain.

In all the times I've been to Spain, I've never been asked to show my
passport, except at hotel check-in and at the airport. Even if it is
enforced, as you claim (and contrary to my personal experience), are
you aware of any instance in which an American tourist was
arrested,detained or fined solely for failure to show a passport in
lieu of a photocopy? I've never heard of any such instance anywhere in
Europe, and I've been travelling there extensively for 30 years.


Have you ever tried to replace a passport overseas? It's not an easy, quick
or pleasant process.
No, I believe you.

Getting stranded overseas for a period of time that can range up to
week is not fun, particularly since checking into a hotel without a
passport is problematic. Even if the hotel isn't an issue while
waiting for a new passport, plane tickets certainly are. Unless you're
travelling on unrestricted fares (and few leisure travellers do),
you'll incur significant fees for changing your tickets, even assuming
there are seats available on the day you finally receive your
replacement passport. Even if planes and hotels aren't a concern, who
wants to spend their vacation time dealing with rude and disinterested
Americans at the U.S. consulate? And, of course, that assumes that
you're somewhere near a U.S. consulate -- what if you have to travel to
a major city to find one?

A passport is far too critical a document to carry around. It can be
stolen, lost, or simply mutilated or damaged. Keep it somewhere safe,
i.e. _inside_ a safe.



Your passport is safer on your body than ina hotel safe.

Nonsense.

Nonsense to you too!. Hotel safes, the bedroom type are not
that safe, not for things like passports (for which there is a
thriving market) and your airline tickets, though these days
e-tickets are safer anyway.

Hotel safes are far safer than carrying a passport and airline tickets
on your person. Though e-tickets are in common use in the U.S. and
Europe, they are not in common use in Asia. The few instances in which
I've heard of people having things stolen from hotel safes were either
dodgy hotels to begin with, or resulted from carelessness on the part
of the guest. Notwithstanding, if you're concerned with in-room safes,
then use the hotel's primary safe and leave the passport (and any other
valuables) with the hotel desk.

A money belt or other pocket that you keep under your shirt
is the safest way to carry your passport and credit cards.

I use a wallet that links to my belt and is kept underneath my pants,
against my thigh. However, I only use it for my credit cards and
larger amounts of cash (pocket money I simply keep in my pocket).

On 10 Apr 2006 10:53:27 -0700, wrote:

plane tickets and other not-easily-replaced items to pickpockets.
Incidently, in my 30 years of traveling the world, I've never, not
once, been pickpocketed (though I've been targetted a couple of times).
There are common sense precautions that one can and should take that
ensure against that kind of petty crime.


We travelled for well over 40 years before being hit by pickpockets,
that was 15 years ago, since then we use precautions like money belts
and keeping our passports on us at all times under the shirt.
So don't be too complacent there are lots of thieves out there.

On 10 Apr 2006 10:45:04 -0700, wrote:


In many European countries, including Italy, France and Spain, hotels
must register foreign guests with the local police station, and take
the passport of the guest at check-in to do so. The passport is
usually returned within a few hours or, occassionally, overnight.

This also is not true, hotels will take a photocop, all they want is
the passport number and personal details, it is just entered on
the computer these days. The idea of the cop coming round for
the info like in 'Day of the Jackal' has long gone.

Notwithstanding the ID requirements, carrying a passport around with
you is sometimes impossible, and never a good idea.

A very good idea, in fact the only one that makes sense is to keep it
with you like you would your drivers license .


the passport, the consequences to an American of losing a passport (or
having is stolen) are so severe that I _always_ recommend leaving the
passport in the hotel safe (though I have, in some circumstances when I
thought the hotel a bit dodgy, locked my passport in my luggage, along
with expensive electronics and my wife's expensive items of clothing).

This is even worse, thieves with razor sharp knives will open your
cases within seconds. Or take your luggage off somewhere else to open
it. For a 'well travelled' person there is a lot to learn.

On 10 Apr 2006 11:08:00 -0700, wrote:




In all the times I've been to Spain, I've never been asked to show my
passport, except at hotel check-in and at the airport. Even if it is
enforced, as you claim (and contrary to my personal experience), are
you aware of any instance in which an American tourist was
arrested,detained or fined solely for failure to show a passport in
lieu of a photocopy? I've never heard of any such instance anywhere in
Europe, and I've been travelling there extensively for 30 years.

Why American tourists? The law is there because of the many
illegal immigrants from North Africa and other places, but try
making a disturbance or shop lifting and see how being
'American' helps in Spain.

On 10 Apr 2006 11:08:53 -0400, (Al Dykes) wrote:

In article ,
Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

"zxcvbnm2bg" wrote in message
groups.com...
Greetings! I am thinking of wearing a photo vest which has many pockets
to store passport, small digital camera and batteries etc. I shall be
traveling to London, Paris and Rome in late May and June 2006. One bad
point I can think - It will immediately mark me as tourist.

Will it be too hot to wear photo vest in June in London, Paris and
Rome?

I just spent 10 days in Italy. I carried my small camera in my shirt pocket.
Spare batteries can fit in a pocket easily too. The rest of the batteries
and charger will be back at the hotel.

Passport should be carried some place under a shirt, not in a vest pocket.
What about your wallet? I carry a decoy wallet in my back pocket. It has a
couple of supermarket discount cards in it and $2 in paper money. My real
wallet is either in a money belt or a front pocket. Cash is kept elsewhere
also.

No matter how hard you try, you will be easily spotted as a tourist. Make
the best of it and skip the vest.

I like a passport pouch on a neck cord, under the shirt. If I'm
carrying expensive airline tickets, they go there, too. Maybe a space
credit card, also.

That's the way we do it also.

Best way to obtain Euros is to use your ATM card at any Bancomat. No
service charges or upcharges as you'll get at the airport or hotel. Rome


It's been a while since I checked, but there used to be problem with
PIN numbers longer than 4 digits on American cards used from overseas
ATMs. Does anyone know if this is still the case?

Used to be, but it seems OK now.

Rome will be very hot then- you might be better of with cargo shorts.

Plenty of people wear those vests in Europe anyway so you will be ok.

garry
www.rugbyphoto.com

"Lucas" wrote in message
l.nl...

In ALL European countries it is law that you should be able to (legally)
identify yourself. For residents of most European Union countries any

Not in free UK. We haven't yet got the sort of police state mentality which
requires us to carry identification. Not even for a foreigner.

"Al Dykes" wrote in message
...
carrying expensive airline tickets, they go there, too. Maybe a space
credit card, also.


I bet they ask for ID when you travel in space? No?